On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 6:47 PM, robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

Hi,

Fencing 5,000 acres of land, we might as well fence the CBD, please note that the one in Egypt is 600 acres and Egypt is a very different place from Kenya they have the brotherhood who will blow up anything just because someone sneezed in a way to suggest.

Silicon valley is not fenced, just because we fenced the Aberdare forest does not justify fencing every inch of the country. Have we thought of the cost of doing this and of what benefit will it be to the development of Kenya as a technology destination?

Also note that the parks are being fenced to keep the animals in, mmmmm.

It should be enough to just put markers around the perimeter, to alert anyone intending to encroach on the land....... -- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube

Dorcas, That's lovely. Hopefully, we can also get an upto date Sitrep on the Malili project. Have we surmounted the initial challenges, that were getting in the way to posses the site. Perhaps, some of us are quite behind on this... Harry _____ From: kictanet-bounces+harry=comtelsys.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+harry=comtelsys.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of Dorcas Muthoni Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 2010 9:20 AM To: harry@comtelsys.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Is it possible for listers to also indicate how they hope to exploit opportunities that come with Malili. I believe the government has done a good job to commit to this project. They have done it for the Kenyan ICT community and our people at large. How about discussing opportunities in this venture more? I guess we need build more on "positive thinking" and well as future prospects. People are still free to air their opinions though! On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 6:47 PM, robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> wrote: Hi, Fencing 5,000 acres of land, we might as well fence the CBD, please note that the one in Egypt is 600 acres and Egypt is a very different place from Kenya they have the brotherhood who will blow up anything just because someone sneezed in a way to suggest. Silicon valley is not fenced, just because we fenced the Aberdare forest does not justify fencing every inch of the country. Have we thought of the cost of doing this and of what benefit will it be to the development of Kenya as a technology destination? Also note that the parks are being fenced to keep the animals in, mmmmm. Regards PS. Just thought it might to of interest Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696 _____ From: Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com> To: robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Fri, 9 April, 2010 12:47:25 Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Bob, That is Private Property, i suppose that is the right thing to do, i am sure we are going to have Mini Malilis in Malili, it is good to distinguish them. I havent been to the smart village in Egypt but i had a chance to look at the dummy and noticed it was controled, i guess that is the standard take a look at http://www.smart-villages.com/docs/cairo.aspx. Unless i didnt understand your query Regards On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 10:57 AM, robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

Hi Listers, I have just found out that the Technology Park in Malili is to be fenced, interesting Regards

Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya

Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696

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Distinguished colleagues, I dont see the problem in Fencing 5000 acres of Land if there is Justification, in Europe , respect for other peoples property and order is the name of the game, the community has already started protesting what prevents them from marching into the park and "taking over" once they get some self styled leader in the future, this are realities we must consider, we should learn from the sugar cane plantation wars in Mumias and Nzoia plus i am sure there are lots of vested interests politically and socially that might have to be handled with care My Opinion On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 8:57 AM, Akich Kwach <kwach@archway-productions.com> wrote:

Hi Robert,

I dont know the source of the information regarding the fencing of the Malili ICT Park. Before I can dismiss the idea, I would be interested to understand afew things; - The objective behind the fencing and any case study globally? At what costs and stage just to to ensure this is not the constructor's idea to take the loot years before the park start functioning. Finally such projects should be undertaken by the military who cannot even protect the poor fisherman in Migingo Island; Kenya is not at war and will never be at war soon, this is one of the ways to make good use of the these well trained amry.

Akich Kwach

----- Original Message ----- From: robert yawe To: kwach@archway-productions.com Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Sent: Monday, April 12, 2010 6:47 PM Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Hi, Fencing 5,000 acres of land, we might as well fence the CBD, please note that the one in Egypt is 600 acres and Egypt is a very different place from Kenya they have the brotherhood who will blow up anything just because someone sneezed in a way to suggest. Silicon valley is not fenced, just because we fenced the Aberdare forest does not justify fencing every inch of the country.  Have we thought of the cost of doing this and of what benefit will it be to the development of Kenya as a technology destination? Also note that the parks are being fenced to keep the animals in, mmmmm. Regards PS.  Just thought it might to of interest

Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya

Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696

________________________________ From: Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com> To: robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Fri, 9 April, 2010 12:47:25 Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

Bob,

That is Private Property, i suppose that is the right thing to do, i am sure we are going to have Mini Malilis in Malili, it is good to distinguish them. I havent been to the smart village in Egypt but i had a chance to look at the dummy and noticed it was controled, i guess that is the standard take a look at http://www.smart-villages.com/docs/cairo.aspx. Unless i didnt understand your query

Regards

On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 10:57 AM, robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

...

Hi Listers, I have just found out that the Technology Park in Malili is to be fenced, interesting Regards

Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya

Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696

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Hi, I need to seriously understand the rational behind fencing 5,000 acres of land unless PS Ndemo has decided to effect his threat to turn the plot into a cattle holding ground because of the bickering by the politicians from the area and that the park is officially moved to Thika. Fencing is a barbaric way of demarcation, its similar to having ones wife or daughters wear a chastity belt, you utilise institutions to secure land rights or any other rights and not physical barriers. I believe the government could find better use of the money, the rest is wastage of the taxes, the same amount could be used to setup a wired convention centre where we could go to brainstorm the future of the park and also to indicate to prospective local and foreign investors (in that order) that we have begun the journey. Even the Minister for Lands, Hon. Orengo, clear indicated that the fencing of a plot and the sinking of a pit latrine does not constitute development. Fencing Malili does not constitute development, so lets make better use of those funds. REgards Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696 ________________________________ From: Pamela <pamela@cardiacimplants.com> To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Tue, 13 April, 2010 10:46:25 Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Land encroachment, private developers, squatters, IDPs etc, land unlike in countries like Egypt and Silicone valley is a very emotive subject, a clear demarcation (although expensive) is a wise thing to do. Otherwise tomorrow, we will have squatters claiming haki yao on malili technopolis. Being fenced to keep land grabbers away!! Pamela From:kictanet-bounces+pamela=cardiacimplants.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+pamela=cardiacimplants.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of robert yawe Sent: Monday, April 12, 2010 6:48 PM To: pamela@cardiacimplants.com Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Hi, Fencing 5,000 acres of land, we might as well fence the CBD, please note that the one in Egypt is 600 acres and Egypt is a very different place from Kenya they have the brotherhood who will blow up anything just because someone sneezed in a way to suggest. Silicon valley is not fenced, just because we fenced the Aberdare forest does not justify fencing every inch of the country. Have we thought of the cost of doing this and of what benefit will it be to the development of Kenya as a technology destination? Also note that the parks are being fenced to keep the animals in, mmmmm. Regards PS. Just thought it might to of interest Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696 ________________________________ From:Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com> To: robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Fri, 9 April, 2010 12:47:25 Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Bob, That is Private Property, i suppose that is the right thing to do, i am sure we are going to have Mini Malilis in Malili, it is good to distinguish them. I havent been to the smart village in Egypt but i had a chance to look at the dummy and noticed it was controled, i guess that is the standard take a look at http://www.smart-villages.com/docs/cairo.aspx. Unless i didnt understand your query Regards On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 10:57 AM, robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

Hi Listers, I have just found out that the Technology Park in Malili is to be fenced, interesting Regards

Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya

Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696

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Fencing - not sure how helpful that would be. Markers for the area would be useful. The place I think just needs to be demarcated and fencing can be done on individual locations. Dubai's internet, media cities etc are not fenced. Would anyone have GPS co-ordinates for the place, or a location on google maps? Regards, -- Josiah Mugambi On Fri, Apr 16, 2010 at 9:24 AM, Thomas Kibui <thomas.kibui@gmail.com>wrote:

I think fencing is a start because eventually after we put up expensive equipment and data there .. they need to be protected. Likewise any construction taking place will require protection from thieves and constructors protected from wild animals.

The "wired convention" is a very good idea but it will need to be protected for us to hold a brainstorm there. Personally, I don't think I can brainstorm effectively when lions are roaming free in the convention...

On 15 April 2010 19:56, robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

...

Hi,

I need to seriously understand the rational behind fencing 5,000 acres of land unless PS Ndemo has decided to effect his threat to turn the plot into a cattle holding ground because of the bickering by the politicians from the area and that the park is officially moved to Thika.

Fencing is a barbaric way of demarcation, its similar to having ones wife or daughters wear a chastity belt, you utilise institutions to secure land rights or any other rights and not physical barriers.

I believe the government could find better use of the money, the rest is wastage of the taxes, the same amount could be used to setup a wired convention centre where we could go to brainstorm the future of the park and also to indicate to prospective local and foreign investors (in that order) that we have begun the journey. Even the Minister for Lands, Hon. Orengo, clear indicated that the fencing of a plot and the sinking of a pit latrine does not constitute development.

Fencing Malili does not constitute development, so lets make better use of those funds.

REgards

Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya

Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696

------------------------------ *From:* Pamela <pamela@cardiacimplants.com> *To:* robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk

*Cc:* KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Tue, 13 April, 2010 10:46:25

*Subject:* Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

Land encroachment, private developers, squatters, IDPs etc, land unlike in countries like Egypt and Silicone valley is a very emotive subject, a clear demarcation (although expensive) is a wise thing to do. Otherwise tomorrow, we will have squatters claiming haki yao on malili technopolis. Being fenced to keep land grabbers away!!

Pamela

*From:* kictanet-bounces+pamela=cardiacimplants.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke[mailto: kictanet-bounces+pamela <kictanet-bounces%2Bpamela>=cardiacimplants.com@ lists.kictanet.or.ke] *On Behalf Of *robert yawe *Sent:* Monday, April 12, 2010 6:48 PM *To:* pamela@cardiacimplants.com *Cc:* KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

Hi,

Fencing 5,000 acres of land, we might as well fence the CBD, please note that the one in Egypt is 600 acres and Egypt is a very different place from Kenya they have the brotherhood who will blow up anything just because someone sneezed in a way to suggest.

Silicon valley is not fenced, just because we fenced the Aberdare forest does not justify fencing every inch of the country. Have we thought of the cost of doing this and of what benefit will it be to the development of Kenya as a technology destination?

Also note that the parks are being fenced to keep the animals in, mmmmm.

Regards

PS. Just thought it might to of interest

Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya

Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696

------------------------------

*From:* Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com> *To:* robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> *Cc:* KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Fri, 9 April, 2010 12:47:25 *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

Bob,

That is Private Property, i suppose that is the right thing to do, i am sure we are going to have Mini Malilis in Malili, it is good to distinguish them. I havent been to the smart village in Egypt but i had a chance to look at the dummy and noticed it was controled, i guess that is the standard take a look at http://www.smart-villages.com/docs/cairo.aspx. Unless i didnt understand your query

Regards

On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 10:57 AM, robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

...

Hi Listers, I have just found out that the Technology Park in Malili is to be fenced, interesting Regards

Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya

Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696

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...

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Robert, I support your concern on this matter. Who was the author of such an idea anyway? My guess is that this could be an idea outside Daktari Ndemo's docket. Politicts aside; by fencing off the area, you would be sending a wrong signal to the investors that the project does not have the community support, which might lead some of them to keep off. Of course you will have the Chinese investors and other with similar hearts remain on board. The civilised world today requires the community's support and participation in any project undertaken whithin their location. How much awareness creation campaigns has been done among the Ukambani community on the benefits of the project, instead of threatening them with a fence. Fencing can take place later, but first you must win their hearts. On the other hand, I find the talk of moving the project to Thika mischievious, given millions of taxpayers funds have been sunk in the Malili land. Stick to the plan. Regards, Akich Kwach ----- Original Message ----- From: robert yawe To: kwach@archway-productions.com Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2010 7:56 PM Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Hi, I need to seriously understand the rational behind fencing 5,000 acres of land unless PS Ndemo has decided to effect his threat to turn the plot into a cattle holding ground because of the bickering by the politicians from the area and that the park is officially moved to Thika. Fencing is a barbaric way of demarcation, its similar to having ones wife or daughters wear a chastity belt, you utilise institutions to secure land rights or any other rights and not physical barriers. I believe the government could find better use of the money, the rest is wastage of the taxes, the same amount could be used to setup a wired convention centre where we could go to brainstorm the future of the park and also to indicate to prospective local and foreign investors (in that order) that we have begun the journey. Even the Minister for Lands, Hon. Orengo, clear indicated that the fencing of a plot and the sinking of a pit latrine does not constitute development. Fencing Malili does not constitute development, so lets make better use of those funds. REgards Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: Pamela <pamela@cardiacimplants.com> To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Tue, 13 April, 2010 10:46:25 Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Land encroachment, private developers, squatters, IDPs etc, land unlike in countries like Egypt and Silicone valley is a very emotive subject, a clear demarcation (although expensive) is a wise thing to do. Otherwise tomorrow, we will have squatters claiming haki yao on malili technopolis. Being fenced to keep land grabbers away!! Pamela From: kictanet-bounces+pamela=cardiacimplants.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+pamela=cardiacimplants.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of robert yawe Sent: Monday, April 12, 2010 6:48 PM To: pamela@cardiacimplants.com Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Hi, Fencing 5,000 acres of land, we might as well fence the CBD, please note that the one in Egypt is 600 acres and Egypt is a very different place from Kenya they have the brotherhood who will blow up anything just because someone sneezed in a way to suggest. Silicon valley is not fenced, just because we fenced the Aberdare forest does not justify fencing every inch of the country. Have we thought of the cost of doing this and of what benefit will it be to the development of Kenya as a technology destination? Also note that the parks are being fenced to keep the animals in, mmmmm. Regards PS. Just thought it might to of interest Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com> To: robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Fri, 9 April, 2010 12:47:25 Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Bob, That is Private Property, i suppose that is the right thing to do, i am sure we are going to have Mini Malilis in Malili, it is good to distinguish them. I havent been to the smart village in Egypt but i had a chance to look at the dummy and noticed it was controled, i guess that is the standard take a look at http://www.smart-villages.com/docs/cairo.aspx. Unless i didnt understand your query Regards On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 10:57 AM, robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

Hi Listers, I have just found out that the Technology Park in Malili is to be fenced, interesting Regards

Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya

Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696

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I think we are getting a bit lost on this debate on Malili. As far as management goes, there are the strategic issues, the tactical issues and the procedural issues. If we look out for every little matter of procedure that is being done, then we lose the big picture. This forum would do well to discuss the strategic issues that the Government gets into, and sometimes the tactical ones. otherwise we will soon be wanting to find out what was the gauge of the wire that was used to fence, and how many metres apart the poles were. It would be good to have a rough idea of the kind of infrastructure the government intends to put up there. Some investors would actually want this info so that they can be planning on how to take advantage of the opportunities that will arise. Quoting bitange@jambo.co.ke:

Mr. Kwach, The Government has no problem with its neighbours in Malili. Indeed every local person supports this National project. It is not for Wakambas only. However, the peasants who owned the land where the park is to be built have a problem with the directors on the sharing of the money. They have taken the matter to court. You recall we discussed this matter and had it settled at a town hall meeting. I shall be wasting public resources if I kept on responding to issues that have been dealt with.

On fencing. At the height of Government land grabbing and encroachment. There was a policy to fence Government land. It will not take too long before you see squarters on Malili if we do not manage it well. Those who will invade may not be aware of GPS or any technology. Fencing or no fencing, I am between two rocks. Any decision can be criticised. We have chosen to fence. As always I take full responsibility.

Knowing this country the way I understand it, I shall be proven right.

Ndemo.

Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message----- From: "Akich Kwach" <kwach@archway-productions.com> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:25:43 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

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Ikua, Thank you. I have tried to have the forum discuss the important policy on cyber security but only one person made some comments. It is unfortunate that we focus on issues that fall within the purview of auditors. Regards Ndemo.

I think we are getting a bit lost on this debate on Malili. As far as management goes, there are the strategic issues, the tactical issues and the procedural issues. If we look out for every little matter of procedure that is being done, then we lose the big picture. This forum would do well to discuss the strategic issues that the Government gets into, and sometimes the tactical ones. otherwise we will soon be wanting to find out what was the gauge of the wire that was used to fence, and how many metres apart the poles were. It would be good to have a rough idea of the kind of infrastructure the government intends to put up there. Some investors would actually want this info so that they can be planning on how to take advantage of the opportunities that will arise.

Quoting bitange@jambo.co.ke:

...

Mr. Kwach, The Government has no problem with its neighbours in Malili. Indeed every local person supports this National project. It is not for Wakambas only. However, the peasants who owned the land where the park is to be built have a problem with the directors on the sharing of the money. They have taken the matter to court. You recall we discussed this matter and had it settled at a town hall meeting. I shall be wasting public resources if I kept on responding to issues that have been dealt with.

On fencing. At the height of Government land grabbing and encroachment. There was a policy to fence Government land. It will not take too long before you see squarters on Malili if we do not manage it well. Those who will invade may not be aware of GPS or any technology. Fencing or no fencing, I am between two rocks. Any decision can be criticised. We have chosen to fence. As always I take full responsibility.

Knowing this country the way I understand it, I shall be proven right.

Ndemo.

Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message----- From: "Akich Kwach" <kwach@archway-productions.com> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:25:43 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

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Thanks Muriuki, I really was looking forward to hearing from you and other experts in this area, on this important subject. We await keenly, for guidance in this debate. I suppose, some time back Mr. J Wals. did some moderation on this topic also, last year. We can do well to use some of that material.. Regards, Harry -----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+harry=comtelsys.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+harry=comtelsys.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of muriuki mureithi Sent: Friday, April 16, 2010 8:53 PM To: harry@comtelsys.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: [kictanet] cyber security Dr Ndemo We are in the process of launching a serious discussion on information/cyber security policy on the list shortly. This will be based and build on the draft policy that you circulated earlier this month . we are finalising the practical issues on the moderation of the discussion as per Kictanet practice Rgds Muriuki Mureithi -----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.k e] On Behalf Of bitange@jambo.co.ke Sent: 16 April 2010 19:27 To: mureithi@summitstrategies.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Ikua, Thank you. I have tried to have the forum discuss the important policy on cyber security but only one person made some comments. It is unfortunate that we focus on issues that fall within the purview of auditors. Regards Ndemo.

I think we are getting a bit lost on this debate on Malili. As far as management goes, there are the strategic issues, the tactical issues and the procedural issues. If we look out for every little matter of procedure that is being done, then we lose the big picture. This forum would do well to discuss the strategic issues that the Government gets into, and sometimes the tactical ones. otherwise we will soon be wanting to find out what was the gauge of the wire that was used to fence, and how many metres apart the poles were. It would be good to have a rough idea of the kind of infrastructure the government intends to put up there. Some investors would actually want this info so that they can be planning on how to take advantage of the opportunities that will arise.

Quoting bitange@jambo.co.ke:

...

Mr. Kwach, The Government has no problem with its neighbours in Malili. Indeed every local person supports this National project. It is not for Wakambas only. However, the peasants who owned the land where the park is to be built have a problem with the directors on the sharing of the money. They have taken the matter to court. You recall we discussed this matter and had it settled at a town hall meeting. I shall be wasting public resources if I kept on responding to issues that have been dealt with.

On fencing. At the height of Government land grabbing and encroachment. There was a policy to fence Government land. It will not take too long before you see squarters on Malili if we do not manage it well. Those who will invade may not be aware of GPS or any technology. Fencing or no fencing, I am between two rocks. Any decision can be criticised. We have chosen to fence. As always I take full responsibility.

Knowing this country the way I understand it, I shall be proven right.

Ndemo.

Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message----- From: "Akich Kwach" <kwach@archway-productions.com> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:25:43 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

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Gichuki Shalowly ? that is not proper language for a multistakeholder forum, our interests are diverse remember ICT's are about people processes and technology, i guess this debate should be based on that premise, security is relative and means different things to different people, i look forwad to this debate on cyber security focussing on those area, even the fencing issues in Malili are part of Cyber security and i congratulate Robert for raising such issues, technology has never been a problem it is designed and tested to solve problems we are the problem Thank you On Sat, Apr 17, 2010 at 11:15 AM, Gichuki John Chuksjonia <chuksjonia@gmail.com> wrote:

I hope we don't look shallowly on this one.

On 4/16/10, Harry Delano <harry@comtelsys.co.ke> wrote:

...

Thanks Muriuki,

I really was looking forward to hearing from you and other experts in this area, on this important subject.

We await keenly, for guidance in this debate. I suppose, some time back Mr. J Wals. did some moderation on this topic also, last year. We can do well to use some of that material..

Regards, Harry

-----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+harry=comtelsys.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+harry=comtelsys.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of muriuki mureithi Sent: Friday, April 16, 2010 8:53 PM To: harry@comtelsys.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: [kictanet] cyber security

Dr Ndemo We are in the process of launching a serious discussion on information/cyber security policy  on the list shortly.  This will be based and build on the draft policy that you circulated earlier this month .  we are finalising the practical issues  on the moderation  of the discussion  as per Kictanet practice

Rgds Muriuki Mureithi

-----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.k e] On Behalf Of bitange@jambo.co.ke Sent: 16 April 2010 19:27 To: mureithi@summitstrategies.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

Ikua, Thank you.  I have tried to have the forum discuss the important policy on cyber security but only one person made some comments.  It is unfortunate that we focus on issues that fall within the purview of auditors.

Regards

Ndemo.

...

I think we are getting a bit lost on this debate on Malili. As far as management goes, there are the strategic issues, the tactical issues and the procedural issues. If we look out for every little matter of procedure that is being done, then we lose the big picture. This forum would do well to discuss the strategic issues that the Government gets into, and sometimes the tactical ones. otherwise we will soon be wanting to find out what was the gauge of the wire that was used to fence, and how many metres apart the poles were. It would be good to have a rough idea of the kind of infrastructure the government intends to put up there. Some investors would actually want this info so that they can be planning on how to take advantage of the opportunities that will arise.

Quoting bitange@jambo.co.ke:

...

Mr. Kwach, The Government has no problem with its neighbours in Malili.  Indeed every local person supports this National project.  It is not for Wakambas only.  However, the peasants who owned the land where the park is to be built have a problem with the directors on the sharing of the money.  They have taken the matter to court.  You recall we discussed this matter and had it settled at a town hall meeting.  I shall be wasting public resources if I kept on responding to issues that have been dealt with.

On fencing.  At the height of Government land grabbing and encroachment.  There was a policy to fence Government land.  It will not take too long before you see squarters on Malili if we do not manage it well.  Those who will invade may not be aware of GPS or any technology.  Fencing or no fencing, I am between two rocks.  Any decision can be criticised.  We have chosen to fence.  As always I take full responsibility.

Knowing this country the way I understand it, I shall be proven right.

Ndemo.

Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message----- From: "Akich Kwach" <kwach@archway-productions.com> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:25:43 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

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{FORUM}http://lists.my.co.ke/pipermail/security/ http://nspkenya.blogspot.com/ http://chuksjonia.blogspot.com/

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-- Barrack O. Otieno +41767892272 Skype: barrack.otieno

Dr Ndemo I chaired the telecommunications subcommittee when preparing the current ICT policy in 2005 in kilifi ( not kilifi draft) and it was very contentious because of the fight to retain the trappings of monopoly for the incumbent. Eventually ,the ICT policy document was a comprise based on lowest common indicators to accommodate all and built on history . certainly this is not the foundation for inspiration today . the time for a new policy is now and your effort and passion is highly welcome . That policy was the first to engage a multi-stakeholder approach and the experience base is just overwhelming now and efficient to handle the new policy. Kind regards Muriuki -----Original Message----- From: bitange@jambo.co.ke [mailto:bitange@jambo.co.ke] Sent: 18 April 2010 08:17 To: mureithi@summitstrategies.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] cyber security Muriuki, Thanks. We have four other policy documents that I want to use the forum as a test bed before we organize any public forum. We also have a revised ICT Policy that may radically change the status quo. The growing interest in ITES may force to develop a number of policy papers that encourage growth. Remember that I have commited to a 10 percent ICT sector contribution to GDP by 2012. Ndemo. Sent from my BlackBerry® -----Original Message----- From: "muriuki mureithi" <mureithi@summitstrategies.co.ke> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 20:52:49 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: [kictanet] cyber security Dr Ndemo We are in the process of launching a serious discussion on information/cyber security policy on the list shortly. This will be based and build on the draft policy that you circulated earlier this month . we are finalising the practical issues on the moderation of the discussion as per Kictanet practice Rgds Muriuki Mureithi -----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.k e] On Behalf Of bitange@jambo.co.ke Sent: 16 April 2010 19:27 To: mureithi@summitstrategies.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Ikua, Thank you. I have tried to have the forum discuss the important policy on cyber security but only one person made some comments. It is unfortunate that we focus on issues that fall within the purview of auditors. Regards Ndemo.

I think we are getting a bit lost on this debate on Malili. As far as management goes, there are the strategic issues, the tactical issues and the procedural issues. If we look out for every little matter of procedure that is being done, then we lose the big picture. This forum would do well to discuss the strategic issues that the Government gets into, and sometimes the tactical ones. otherwise we will soon be wanting to find out what was the gauge of the wire that was used to fence, and how many metres apart the poles were. It would be good to have a rough idea of the kind of infrastructure the government intends to put up there. Some investors would actually want this info so that they can be planning on how to take advantage of the opportunities that will arise.

Quoting bitange@jambo.co.ke:

...

Mr. Kwach, The Government has no problem with its neighbours in Malili. Indeed every local person supports this National project. It is not for Wakambas only. However, the peasants who owned the land where the park is to be built have a problem with the directors on the sharing of the money. They have taken the matter to court. You recall we discussed this matter and had it settled at a town hall meeting. I shall be wasting public resources if I kept on responding to issues that have been dealt with.

On fencing. At the height of Government land grabbing and encroachment. There was a policy to fence Government land. It will not take too long before you see squarters on Malili if we do not manage it well. Those who will invade may not be aware of GPS or any technology. Fencing or no fencing, I am between two rocks. Any decision can be criticised. We have chosen to fence. As always I take full responsibility.

Knowing this country the way I understand it, I shall be proven right.

Ndemo.

Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message----- From: "Akich Kwach" <kwach@archway-productions.com> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:25:43 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

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We also have a forum where we discuss ITSec issues, sister forum to skunkworks, http://lists.my.co.ke/pipermail/security/ We also have a org called Hackbattle, soon to be renamed to hacklabz, where we set up networks and scenarios on Vulnerable networks and show ways to exploit, test and learn. Rgs, ./Chuks On 4/19/10, ikua@lpakenya.org <ikua@lpakenya.org> wrote:

Dr Ndemo, The policy document that you floated here was well noted, inasmuch as it's still in the very basic draft form. I would like to point out that there is a growing number of InfoSec professionals in Kenya. On 10th of this month, the first ever CISSP exam was conducted in Kenya, hosted by K-90 on behalf of ISC2. 12 candidates sat the 6 hour exam, 1 each being from UG, TZ and Ethiopia. There is also the It security technical committee at KEBS which is discussing security standards. So there will not be a shortage of skill when discussions begin. Ikua

Quoting bitange@jambo.co.ke:

...

Muriuki, Thanks. We have four other policy documents that I want to use the forum as a test bed before we organize any public forum. We also have a revised ICT Policy that may radically change the status quo.

The growing interest in ITES may force to develop a number of policy papers that encourage growth. Remember that I have commited to a 10 percent ICT sector contribution to GDP by 2012.

Ndemo.

Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message----- From: "muriuki mureithi" <mureithi@summitstrategies.co.ke> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 20:52:49 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: [kictanet] cyber security

Dr Ndemo We are in the process of launching a serious discussion on information/cyber security policy on the list shortly. This will be based and build on the draft policy that you circulated earlier this month . we are finalising the practical issues on the moderation of the discussion as per Kictanet practice

Rgds Muriuki Mureithi

-----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.k e] On Behalf Of bitange@jambo.co.ke Sent: 16 April 2010 19:27 To: mureithi@summitstrategies.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

Ikua, Thank you. I have tried to have the forum discuss the important policy on cyber security but only one person made some comments. It is unfortunate that we focus on issues that fall within the purview of auditors.

Regards

Ndemo.

...

I think we are getting a bit lost on this debate on Malili. As far as management goes, there are the strategic issues, the tactical issues and the procedural issues. If we look out for every little matter of procedure that is being done, then we lose the big picture. This forum would do well to discuss the strategic issues that the Government gets into, and sometimes the tactical ones. otherwise we will soon be wanting to find out what was the gauge of the wire that was used to fence, and how many metres apart the poles were. It would be good to have a rough idea of the kind of infrastructure the government intends to put up there. Some investors would actually want this info so that they can be planning on how to take advantage of the opportunities that will arise.

Quoting bitange@jambo.co.ke:

...

Mr. Kwach, The Government has no problem with its neighbours in Malili. Indeed every local person supports this National project. It is not for Wakambas only. However, the peasants who owned the land where the park is to be built have a problem with the directors on the sharing of the money. They have taken the matter to court. You recall we discussed this matter and had it settled at a town hall meeting. I shall be wasting public resources if I kept on responding to issues that have been dealt with.

On fencing. At the height of Government land grabbing and encroachment. There was a policy to fence Government land. It will not take too long before you see squarters on Malili if we do not manage it well. Those who will invade may not be aware of GPS or any technology. Fencing or no fencing, I am between two rocks. Any decision can be criticised. We have chosen to fence. As always I take full responsibility.

Knowing this country the way I understand it, I shall be proven right.

Ndemo.

Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message----- From: "Akich Kwach" <kwach@archway-productions.com> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:25:43 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

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-- -- Gichuki John Ndirangu, C.E.H , C.P.T.P, O.S.C.P I.T Security Analyst and Penetration Tester infosigmer@inbox.com {FORUM}http://lists.my.co.ke/pipermail/security/ http://nspkenya.blogspot.com/ http://chuksjonia.blogspot.com/

Dr. Ndemo, This is really interesting - "Remember that I have commited to a 10 percent ICT sector contribution to GDP by 2012". It would be good to share at least with me (if you may privately but i think publicly) your formula for the yearly contribution and how it fits into the GDP calculus? If you do publicly on this list, you would get some good input and or buyin to the matrix. We are doing a similar excercise in Ghana and it would be good to not reinvent the wheel. In the scheme of things, i applaude the visit and would share it with our policy development team. Thank you. Eric here On 18 Apr 2010, at 05:17, bitange@jambo.co.ke wrote:

Muriuki, Thanks. We have four other policy documents that I want to use the forum as a test bed before we organize any public forum. We also have a revised ICT Policy that may radically change the status quo.

The growing interest in ITES may force to develop a number of policy papers that encourage growth. Remember that I have commited to a 10 percent ICT sector contribution to GDP by 2012.

Ndemo.

Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message----- From: "muriuki mureithi" <mureithi@summitstrategies.co.ke> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 20:52:49 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: [kictanet] cyber security

Dr Ndemo We are in the process of launching a serious discussion on information/cyber security policy on the list shortly. This will be based and build on the draft policy that you circulated earlier this month . we are finalising the practical issues on the moderation of the discussion as per Kictanet practice

Rgds Muriuki Mureithi

-----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.k e] On Behalf Of bitange@jambo.co.ke Sent: 16 April 2010 19:27 To: mureithi@summitstrategies.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

Ikua, Thank you. I have tried to have the forum discuss the important policy on cyber security but only one person made some comments. It is unfortunate that we focus on issues that fall within the purview of auditors.

Regards

Ndemo.

...

I think we are getting a bit lost on this debate on Malili. As far as management goes, there are the strategic issues, the tactical issues and the procedural issues. If we look out for every little matter of procedure that is being done, then we lose the big picture. This forum would do well to discuss the strategic issues that the Government gets into, and sometimes the tactical ones. otherwise we will soon be wanting to find out what was the gauge of the wire that was used to fence, and how many metres apart the poles were. It would be good to have a rough idea of the kind of infrastructure the government intends to put up there. Some investors would actually want this info so that they can be planning on how to take advantage of the opportunities that will arise.

Quoting bitange@jambo.co.ke:

...

Mr. Kwach, The Government has no problem with its neighbours in Malili. Indeed every local person supports this National project. It is not for Wakambas only. However, the peasants who owned the land where the park is to be built have a problem with the directors on the sharing of the money. They have taken the matter to court. You recall we discussed this matter and had it settled at a town hall meeting. I shall be wasting public resources if I kept on responding to issues that have been dealt with.

On fencing. At the height of Government land grabbing and encroachment. There was a policy to fence Government land. It will not take too long before you see squarters on Malili if we do not manage it well. Those who will invade may not be aware of GPS or any technology. Fencing or no fencing, I am between two rocks. Any decision can be criticised. We have chosen to fence. As always I take full responsibility.

Knowing this country the way I understand it, I shall be proven right.

Ndemo.

Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message----- From: "Akich Kwach" <kwach@archway-productions.com> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:25:43 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

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Eric M.K Osiakwan Director Internet Research www.internetresearch.com.gh emko@internetresearch.com.gh 42 Ring Road Central, Accra-North Tel: +233.21.258800 ext 7031 Fax: +233.21.258811 Cell: +233.24.4386792

We may not be aware what a technology park is since we do not have one.  It is a major security concern even in the absence of land grabbers squaters name it.  Am not sure at what level this fencing is but it would very interesting to have a park with no security this moment when we have high scale terorist activities.  If the plan is still on course could we have it fenced immediately and have reputable company guard it.  We can have a chance of someone planting something at the moment that can destroy it ten years down the line meaning our data will be lost grounding our activities.   We intend to house large companies in the park, small companies and international companies.  Have been to the Media Plaza at Utrecht in Europe at the security measures is a wonder. Let us stop to think! Sam   ________________________________ From: "bitange@jambo.co.ke" <bitange@jambo.co.ke> To: saguyo@yahoo.com Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Fri, April 16, 2010 7:26:32 PM Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced Ikua, Thank you.  I have tried to have the forum discuss the important policy on cyber security but only one person made some comments.  It is unfortunate that we focus on issues that fall within the purview of auditors. Regards Ndemo.

I think we are getting a bit lost on this debate on Malili. As far as management goes, there are the strategic issues, the tactical issues and the procedural issues. If we look out for every little matter of procedure that is being done, then we lose the big picture. This forum would do well to discuss the strategic issues that the Government gets into, and sometimes the tactical ones. otherwise we will soon be wanting to find out what was the gauge of the wire that was used to fence, and how many metres apart the poles were. It would be good to have a rough idea of the kind of infrastructure the government intends to put up there. Some investors would actually want this info so that they can be planning on how to take advantage of the opportunities that will arise.

Quoting bitange@jambo.co.ke:

...

Mr. Kwach, The Government has no problem with its neighbours in Malili.  Indeed   every local person supports this National project.  It is not for Wakambas only.  However, the peasants who owned the land where the park is to be built have a problem with the directors on the sharing   of the money.  They have taken the matter to court.  You recall we discussed this matter and had it settled at a town hall meeting.  I shall be wasting public resources if I kept on responding to issues that have been dealt with.

On fencing.  At the height of Government land grabbing and encroachment.  There was a policy to fence Government land.  It will   not take too long before you see squarters on Malili if we do not manage it well.  Those who will invade may not be aware of GPS or any technology.  Fencing or no fencing, I am between two rocks.  Any   decision can be criticised.  We have chosen to fence.  As always I take full responsibility.

Knowing this country the way I understand it, I shall be proven right.

Ndemo.

Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message----- From: "Akich Kwach" <kwach@archway-productions.com> Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:25:43 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] FYI - Malili to be fenced

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