Re: [kictanet] [Skunkworks] Are we letting the PS get away with this too?
Well it is within the democratic right of the PS to comment on the issue at least he gave an opinion which i tend to agree with but need some more education on the pricing of calls, i also think CCK has attained a certain level of independence contrary to what our good friend Brainiac says, (i stand to be corrected on this) we need input from economists on the long term effects of this price changes to the industry considering the fact that we have not yet attained Universal Access, there are some parts like Archers Post in Eastern that dont have very good coverage, i have an uncanny feeling they might not be sustainable in the long run, i would love to hear the opinion of technocrats on this lists, either way the government needs to set a level playing field to guarantee stability of businesses. Best Regards On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:43 PM, Solomon Mburu Kamau <solo.mburu@gmail.com>wrote:
The PS should have said the government will get less tax and not derailment of the constitution implementation.
I think this is just a way of making Kenyans guilty of swtiching to a lower tarrif, lest the 'constitution will not be implemented'.
Seriously, how many taxes do we pay directly and or indirectly to the government?
Talk about a selfish government.
low pricing = less tax collected
If im paying 3 bob per minute and the govt takes 10%(just as an example) thats 30cts per minute for govt if its 10% of 1 bob thats 10 cts per minute
When everyone if forced to take prices down to 1 bob.....then less revenue overrall
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:29 PM, <ashok+skunkworks@parliaments.info <ashok%2Bskunkworks@parliaments.info> <ashok%2Bskunkworks@parliaments.info<ashok%252Bskunkworks@parliaments.info>
wrote:
This is more an economic discussion than it is a digital one What he means is that the price war will deny the govt of revenues
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:11 PM, Joram Mwinamo < joram.mwinamo@gmail.com> wrote: through
Tax which is needed heavily to finance the new constitutions implementation
How will a mobile price war deny government of tax revenues ? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other
On 18/01/2011, Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com> wrote: people
permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
-- *Solomon Mbũrũ Kamau*
***************************************************** *Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill!*
AND
*It is better to die in dignity than in the ignominy of ambiguous generosity! *
http://smiley2.wordpress.com http://mburu.sikika.co.ke _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Barrack O. Otieno Afriregister Ltd (Kenya) www.afrire <http://www.afriregister.com>gister.bi, www.afriregister.com<http://www.afriergister.com> <http://www.afriregister.com>ICANN accredited registrar +254721325277 +254-20-2498789 Skype: barrack.otieno
@barrack I have not torn into CCK at any point in my discourse, just expressed my exasperation at the inaction. But just tell me so i understand, 1: Is the tax rate that GOK has on safaricom higher than the one levied on other similarly strained (resources, support...e.t.c) providers? 2: Is it proper (in the natural justice realm) to assuage these providers by giving them a "level playing field" tilted in the favour of safaricom? 3: Is whether or not the pricing model is sustainable a decision that GOK is responsible for? or is it CCK or is it the Ksh 2M++ a month CEO and management team of safaricom. The Way I see it, GOK is subverting a Strategy (Airtel has clearly declared that the pricing wars to them are a strategy to raise market share) to retain Safaricom's dominance, hence revenue (through shareholding). Just how is this good / fair / balanced action by the relevant authorities? lastly, whether the taxman is meeting the targets or not should be an issue of performance and (if my memory serves me right) a constitutionally required participatory action. Tying the implementation of the constitution to the price wars in the Telko is to me drawing the line way way too far. Its politics, not economics. On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:55 PM, Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com>wrote:
Well it is within the democratic right of the PS to comment on the issue at least he gave an opinion which i tend to agree with but need some more education on the pricing of calls, i also think CCK has attained a certain level of independence contrary to what our good friend Brainiac says, (i stand to be corrected on this) we need input from economists on the long term effects of this price changes to the industry considering the fact that we have not yet attained Universal Access, there are some parts like Archers Post in Eastern that dont have very good coverage, i have an uncanny feeling they might not be sustainable in the long run, i would love to hear the opinion of technocrats on this lists, either way the government needs to set a level playing field to guarantee stability of businesses.
Best Regards
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:43 PM, Solomon Mburu Kamau < solo.mburu@gmail.com> wrote:
The PS should have said the government will get less tax and not derailment of the constitution implementation.
I think this is just a way of making Kenyans guilty of swtiching to a lower tarrif, lest the 'constitution will not be implemented'.
Seriously, how many taxes do we pay directly and or indirectly to the government?
Talk about a selfish government.
low pricing = less tax collected
If im paying 3 bob per minute and the govt takes 10%(just as an example) thats 30cts per minute for govt if its 10% of 1 bob thats 10 cts per minute
When everyone if forced to take prices down to 1 bob.....then less revenue overrall
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:29 PM, <ashok+skunkworks@parliaments.info<ashok%2Bskunkworks@parliaments.info> <ashok%2Bskunkworks@parliaments.info<ashok%252Bskunkworks@parliaments.info>
wrote:
This is more an economic discussion than it is a digital one What he means is that the price war will deny the govt of revenues
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:11 PM, Joram Mwinamo < joram.mwinamo@gmail.com> wrote: through
Tax which is needed heavily to finance the new constitutions implementation
How will a mobile price war deny government of tax revenues ? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other
On 18/01/2011, Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com> wrote: people
permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
-- *Solomon Mbũrũ Kamau*
***************************************************** *Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill!*
AND
*It is better to die in dignity than in the ignominy of ambiguous generosity! *
http://smiley2.wordpress.com http://mburu.sikika.co.ke _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Barrack O. Otieno Afriregister Ltd (Kenya) www.afrire <http://www.afriregister.com>gister.bi, www.afriregister.com<http://www.afriergister.com> <http://www.afriregister.com>ICANN accredited registrar +254721325277 +254-20-2498789 Skype: barrack.otieno
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- *“The twentieth century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: the growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy”* ~ Alex Carey ~
You have a point Brainiac, there are many factors in your argument which need to be tackled and as such we may need expert opinion on some issues, a corporate entity is treated as a person and as the saying goes one mans meat is another mans poison, what are the implications of certain moves on new market entrants? How will the other Telcos survive in the market?, this is where regulation comes in to ensure a piece of cake for everyone. On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 1:09 PM, [Brainiac] <arebacollins@gmail.com> wrote:
@barrack I have not torn into CCK at any point in my discourse, just expressed my exasperation at the inaction. But just tell me so i understand,
1: Is the tax rate that GOK has on safaricom higher than the one levied on other similarly strained (resources, support...e.t.c) providers? 2: Is it proper (in the natural justice realm) to assuage these providers by giving them a "level playing field" tilted in the favour of safaricom? 3: Is whether or not the pricing model is sustainable a decision that GOK is responsible for? or is it CCK or is it the Ksh 2M++ a month CEO and management team of safaricom.
The Way I see it, GOK is subverting a Strategy (Airtel has clearly declared that the pricing wars to them are a strategy to raise market share) to retain Safaricom's dominance, hence revenue (through shareholding). Just how is this good / fair / balanced action by the relevant authorities?
lastly, whether the taxman is meeting the targets or not should be an issue of performance and (if my memory serves me right) a constitutionally required participatory action. Tying the implementation of the constitution to the price wars in the Telko is to me drawing the line way way too far. Its politics, not economics.
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:55 PM, Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com
wrote:
Well it is within the democratic right of the PS to comment on the issue at least he gave an opinion which i tend to agree with but need some more education on the pricing of calls, i also think CCK has attained a certain level of independence contrary to what our good friend Brainiac says, (i stand to be corrected on this) we need input from economists on the long term effects of this price changes to the industry considering the fact that we have not yet attained Universal Access, there are some parts like Archers Post in Eastern that dont have very good coverage, i have an uncanny feeling they might not be sustainable in the long run, i would love to hear the opinion of technocrats on this lists, either way the government needs to set a level playing field to guarantee stability of businesses.
Best Regards
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:43 PM, Solomon Mburu Kamau < solo.mburu@gmail.com> wrote:
The PS should have said the government will get less tax and not derailment of the constitution implementation.
I think this is just a way of making Kenyans guilty of swtiching to a lower tarrif, lest the 'constitution will not be implemented'.
Seriously, how many taxes do we pay directly and or indirectly to the government?
Talk about a selfish government.
low pricing = less tax collected
If im paying 3 bob per minute and the govt takes 10%(just as an example) thats 30cts per minute for govt if its 10% of 1 bob thats 10 cts per minute
When everyone if forced to take prices down to 1 bob.....then less revenue overrall
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:29 PM, <ashok+skunkworks@parliaments.info<ashok%2Bskunkworks@parliaments.info> <ashok%2Bskunkworks@parliaments.info<ashok%252Bskunkworks@parliaments.info>
wrote:
This is more an economic discussion than it is a digital one What he means is that the price war will deny the govt of revenues
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:11 PM, Joram Mwinamo < joram.mwinamo@gmail.com> wrote: through
Tax which is needed heavily to finance the new constitutions implementation
How will a mobile price war deny government of tax revenues ? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are
beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other
On 18/01/2011, Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com> wrote: powerful people
permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
-- *Solomon Mbũrũ Kamau*
***************************************************** *Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill!*
AND
*It is better to die in dignity than in the ignominy of ambiguous generosity! *
http://smiley2.wordpress.com http://mburu.sikika.co.ke _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Barrack O. Otieno Afriregister Ltd (Kenya) www.afrire <http://www.afriregister.com>gister.bi, www.afriregister.com<http://www.afriergister.com> <http://www.afriregister.com>ICANN accredited registrar +254721325277 +254-20-2498789 Skype: barrack.otieno
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- *“The twentieth century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: the growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy”*
~ Alex Carey ~
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Barrack O. Otieno Afriregister Ltd (Kenya) www.afrire <http://www.afriregister.com>gister.bi, www.afriregister.com<http://www.afriergister.com> <http://www.afriregister.com>ICANN accredited registrar +254721325277 +254-20-2498789 Skype: barrack.otieno
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 1:18 PM, Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com>wrote:
You have a point Brainiac, there are many factors in your argument which need to be tackled and as such we may need expert opinion on some issues, a corporate entity is treated as a person and as the saying goes one mans meat is another mans poison, what are the implications of certain moves on new market entrants? How will the other Telcos survive in the market?, this is where regulation comes in to ensure a piece of cake for everyone.
Before making this debate so complicated, is Airtel's move interpreted as a means towards crippling the mobile industry? Why is this position not being applied on the Internet Service Provision industry then? We always heard promises of "prices will come down" but when they do now, the govt is gonna lose revenue? Puleease! -- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Damn!!
Here are my thoughts. The PS is right about predatory pricing never aimed at growing the Industry. For those who were "alive" at the beginning of the web-browser wars in early 1990s. Netscape was King. Then Microsoft came in and gave away its product Internet Explorer(IE) - for free. Everyone was happy - until they realized they were paying for the Microsoft IE through other means (by buying for the OS for example). But by then Netscape as a competitor was as dead as the Dodo. Microsoft Mission accomplished. Folks, Airtel is not here because they love giving free things. I am not privy to their Strategy but it can be read by anyone. Their aim is not to grow/extend the Service, but rather to eat Safaricom's lunch. At a consumer level, nothing really wrong with that and infact it is Christmas time for consumers. BUT at a national level, what you have is that the 20million subscribers you currently have in the country, will remain 20million subscriber five years later. Only that half of them will be sitting on Airtel's network and the other half will be with "Others". Net growth for Kenya? =ZERO Airtel's strategy wont kill the mobile industry, but believe you me, it will stiffle its growth in the long run, because the returns to the investors will not be sufficient to sustain operations, let alone extend the network or pay for innovation. That said, as a consumer, Airtel's offer is truly irresistible and worth considering. But as a scholar, I do know, and agree that it is not good for the industry in the long run. walu. --- On Tue, 1/18/11, Odhiambo Washington <odhiambo@gmail.com> wrote: From: Odhiambo Washington <odhiambo@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [kictanet] [Skunkworks] Are we letting the PS get away with this too? To: jwalu@yahoo.com Cc: "KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Date: Tuesday, January 18, 2011, 1:22 PM On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 1:18 PM, Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com> wrote: You have a point Brainiac, there are many factors in your argument which need to be tackled and as such we may need expert opinion on some issues, a corporate entity is treated as a person and as the saying goes one mans meat is another mans poison, what are the implications of certain moves on new market entrants? How will the other Telcos survive in the market?, this is where regulation comes in to ensure a piece of cake for everyone. Before making this debate so complicated, is Airtel's move interpreted as a means towards crippling the mobile industry?Why is this position not being applied on the Internet Service Provision industry then? We always heard promises of "prices will come down" but when they do now, the govt is gonna lose revenue? Puleease! -- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Damn!! -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet This message was sent to: jwalu@yahoo.com Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/jwalu%40yahoo.com
Here is one that doesnt require an economist to think through. Scrap all taxes that are collected at the salary stage (cause some guys have found a way to get away from them) so everyone goes home with 100% of their salary. Then using some computation spread that into VAT charged on goods and services (say even raise it to 18%) . That way the poor will pay taxes, the rich will pay taxes... On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 1:18 PM, Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com>wrote:
You have a point Brainiac, there are many factors in your argument which need to be tackled and as such we may need expert opinion on some issues, a corporate entity is treated as a person and as the saying goes one mans meat is another mans poison, what are the implications of certain moves on new market entrants? How will the other Telcos survive in the market?, this is where regulation comes in to ensure a piece of cake for everyone.
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 1:09 PM, [Brainiac] <arebacollins@gmail.com>wrote:
@barrack I have not torn into CCK at any point in my discourse, just expressed my exasperation at the inaction. But just tell me so i understand,
1: Is the tax rate that GOK has on safaricom higher than the one levied on other similarly strained (resources, support...e.t.c) providers? 2: Is it proper (in the natural justice realm) to assuage these providers by giving them a "level playing field" tilted in the favour of safaricom? 3: Is whether or not the pricing model is sustainable a decision that GOK is responsible for? or is it CCK or is it the Ksh 2M++ a month CEO and management team of safaricom.
The Way I see it, GOK is subverting a Strategy (Airtel has clearly declared that the pricing wars to them are a strategy to raise market share) to retain Safaricom's dominance, hence revenue (through shareholding). Just how is this good / fair / balanced action by the relevant authorities?
lastly, whether the taxman is meeting the targets or not should be an issue of performance and (if my memory serves me right) a constitutionally required participatory action. Tying the implementation of the constitution to the price wars in the Telko is to me drawing the line way way too far. Its politics, not economics.
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:55 PM, Barrack Otieno < otieno.barrack@gmail.com> wrote:
Well it is within the democratic right of the PS to comment on the issue at least he gave an opinion which i tend to agree with but need some more education on the pricing of calls, i also think CCK has attained a certain level of independence contrary to what our good friend Brainiac says, (i stand to be corrected on this) we need input from economists on the long term effects of this price changes to the industry considering the fact that we have not yet attained Universal Access, there are some parts like Archers Post in Eastern that dont have very good coverage, i have an uncanny feeling they might not be sustainable in the long run, i would love to hear the opinion of technocrats on this lists, either way the government needs to set a level playing field to guarantee stability of businesses.
Best Regards
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:43 PM, Solomon Mburu Kamau < solo.mburu@gmail.com> wrote:
The PS should have said the government will get less tax and not derailment of the constitution implementation.
I think this is just a way of making Kenyans guilty of swtiching to a lower tarrif, lest the 'constitution will not be implemented'.
Seriously, how many taxes do we pay directly and or indirectly to the government?
Talk about a selfish government.
low pricing = less tax collected
If im paying 3 bob per minute and the govt takes 10%(just as an example) thats 30cts per minute for govt if its 10% of 1 bob thats 10 cts per minute
When everyone if forced to take prices down to 1 bob.....then less revenue overrall
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:29 PM, <ashok+skunkworks@parliaments.info<ashok%2Bskunkworks@parliaments.info> <ashok%2Bskunkworks@parliaments.info<ashok%252Bskunkworks@parliaments.info>
wrote:
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 12:11 PM, Joram Mwinamo < joram.mwinamo@gmail.com> wrote: > This is more an economic discussion than it is a digital one > What he means is that the price war will deny the govt of revenues through > Tax which is needed heavily to finance the new constitutions implementation >
How will a mobile price war deny government of tax revenues ? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are
beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other
On 18/01/2011, Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com> wrote: powerful people
permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
-- *Solomon Mbũrũ Kamau*
***************************************************** *Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill!*
AND
*It is better to die in dignity than in the ignominy of ambiguous generosity! *
http://smiley2.wordpress.com http://mburu.sikika.co.ke _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Barrack O. Otieno Afriregister Ltd (Kenya) www.afrire <http://www.afriregister.com>gister.bi, www.afriregister.com<http://www.afriergister.com> <http://www.afriregister.com>ICANN accredited registrar +254721325277 +254-20-2498789 Skype: barrack.otieno
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- *“The twentieth century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: the growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy”*
~ Alex Carey ~
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Barrack O. Otieno Afriregister Ltd (Kenya) www.afrire <http://www.afriregister.com>gister.bi, www.afriregister.com<http://www.afriergister.com> <http://www.afriregister.com>ICANN accredited registrar +254721325277 +254-20-2498789 Skype: barrack.otieno
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- *“The twentieth century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: the growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy”* ~ Alex Carey ~
participants (4)
-
[Brainiac] -
Barrack Otieno -
Odhiambo Washington -
Walubengo J