Re: [kictanet] Does cashless matatu system have a regulatory framework?
True that Adam, Monopolies are not necessarily bad since they can ensure a consolidated market to justify investments. HOWEVER "Private monopolies" rather than "Public monopolies" is a different ball game altogether. From my limited travels into the developed North, most (the bulk) of their transport system is under the Public Metropolitan/County government - with room for private sector intervention and innovations. In Kenya we seem to have got it upside down. Private sector single handedly runs our public transport system - and you can see where this landed us. I miss the days when I was just 10years old and was allowed to use the Public transport aka Kenya Bus Service in 1980s to go alone to public primary school (now @MbuguaNjihia has confirmed am ancient :-) Indeed I am quite suprised by the loud silence from the Nairobi County government. Perhaps they are also lost in terms of how, where, when and if they could get involved in this cashless payment system. The big picture (regulatory/market structure) seems to be in limited circulation. walu. -------------------------------------------- On Tue, 11/11/14, Adam Nelson via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Subject: Re: [kictanet] Does cashless matatu system have a regulatory framework? To: jwalu@yahoo.com Date: Tuesday, November 11, 2014, 1:00 PM It's not unreasonable to have a single, mandated card for this purpose. New York's MetroCard is a great example (as is the Oyster Card). Virtually every city I've been to has one and only one card for mass transportation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MetroCard_(New_York_City) As with most things, NYC Transit outsources most of the underlying infrastructure to a private company: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cubic_Transportation_Systems As long as the margins are well defined, there is little in-house fraud, and the system generally works, the lack of competition isn't such a big deal. The most important thing is that the numbers are published and audited regularly and that the underlying vendor can be replaced in the future (i.e. Nairobi County maintains intellectual property over key assets so there's no vendor lock-in beyond the contract period). -Adam --Kili - Cloud for Africa: kili.io Musings: twitter.com/varudMore Musings: varud.comAbout Adam: www.linkedin.com/in/adamcnelson On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 12:41 PM, Mwendwa Kivuva via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Thanks Walu. You certainly ask valid questions. What comes to mind is consumer protection, and ensuring data collected about consumers is not used in ways that the consumer does not ascent to. I'm assuming we will read the terms of service. I don't expect any player in the industry to be a monopoly, and certaily my1963 card wil operate alongside BebaPay and AbiriaCard. What I would also like to see is the ability to pay with our NFC enabled debit and credit cards. Consumers should have a choice. Cofek's appeal is mostly based on Article 10 of the constitution where government is expected to involve all stakeholders holders (yes multistakeholderism is here to stay) in decision making. If there was a stakeholders forum, many of these questions would have been asked there. Well, the cashles system has worked before in Kenya hitherto with mixed reactions from the commuters. I support it bearing in mind the many times I've forgotten my change. As agents of changes in society, we should support the initiative, and let it mature. We can learn from other cities, especially Transport for London which has a very successful Oyster Card. Regards On Tuesday, 11 November 2014, Barrack Otieno via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Hi Walu, We are in interesting times, what happens to the squad fellows? They normally get a tenth of the fare for their touting. I wonder whether a feasibility study was done. The Matatu culture is too complicated , this system would work with a more organized Nyayo Bus or KBS kind of system. My 2 cents On 11/11/14, Walubengo J via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
The President launched the cashless matatu payment system in style last
week.
Boarding a matatu from State House to the City Centre,
the President used
the payment card “My1963” to pay his fare as the smiling Safaricom CEO, Bob
Collymore, the Matatu Owners association Chairman, Simon Kimutai and the
Cabinet Secretary for Transport and Infrastructure, Eng Michael Kamau all
watched.
Read more @
http://www.nation.co.ke/oped/blogs/dot9/walubengo/-/2274560/2518070/-/10vedr...
---------------------------
Additionally, you can read a bare knuckle view from Cofek
** 7 reasons why Cofek will fight to stop the #My1963 PSV's cashless payment
fraud
The National Transport Safety Authority (NTSA) plan to go cashless on fare
payments effective December 1, 2014 though welcome cannot escape public
scrutiny.
Clearly, majority commuters are not ready thanks to the very poor and less
than transparent handling of the cashless fare payments for Public Service
Vehicles (PSV’s).
If digital migration switch-off of analogue TV signal could go to the
Supreme Court, then the architects behind the so-called #My1963 fraud must
not celebrate just yet. Why?
READ more @
http://www.cofek.co.ke/index.php/14-news/872-7-reasons-why-cofek-will-fight-...
--------
walu.
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-- Barrack O. Otieno +254721325277 +254-20-2498789 Skype: barrack.otieno http://www.otienobarrack.me.ke/ _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/kivuva%40transworldafr... The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- ______________________ Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya L: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lordmwesh B: http://lord.me.ke/ T: twitter.com/lordmwesh "There are some men who lift the age they inhabit, till all men walk on higher ground in that lifetime." - Maxwell Anderson _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/adam%40varud.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/jwalu%40yahoo.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Adam, Do you know we even have no idea who is exactly behind the My1963 card? That's how open our systems are. Also, the roughshod implementation of this ignoring various stakeholders will just result in another bribe soliciting channel for police officers - where matatus will just ignore the Abiria card and factor non-compliance as a cost that needs to be added to their weekly remittances to the police force. Also, matatu hijackings are now primarily targeting passengers and their belongings. There are even special purpose vehicles which are formed for only one purpose of luring unsuspecting pedestrians to board a rogue matatu for them to be hijacked. Also, again, there are so many matatu initiatives headed to different routes - even the government appears to lack a single, coherent policy. Wish us luck as we are jostled inside this policy matatu. On Tue Nov 11 2014 at 14:20:45 Walubengo J via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
True that Adam,
Monopolies are not necessarily bad since they can ensure a consolidated market to justify investments. HOWEVER "Private monopolies" rather than "Public monopolies" is a different ball game altogether. From my limited travels into the developed North, most (the bulk) of their transport system is under the Public Metropolitan/County government - with room for private sector intervention and innovations.
In Kenya we seem to have got it upside down. Private sector single handedly runs our public transport system - and you can see where this landed us. I miss the days when I was just 10years old and was allowed to use the Public transport aka Kenya Bus Service in 1980s to go alone to public primary school (now @MbuguaNjihia has confirmed am ancient :-)
Indeed I am quite suprised by the loud silence from the Nairobi County government. Perhaps they are also lost in terms of how, where, when and if they could get involved in this cashless payment system. The big picture (regulatory/market structure) seems to be in limited circulation.
walu.
-------------------------------------------- On Tue, 11/11/14, Adam Nelson via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Does cashless matatu system have a regulatory framework? To: jwalu@yahoo.com Date: Tuesday, November 11, 2014, 1:00 PM
It's not unreasonable to have a single, mandated card for this purpose. New York's MetroCard is a great example (as is the Oyster Card). Virtually every city I've been to has one and only one card for mass transportation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MetroCard_(New_York_City)
As with most things, NYC Transit outsources most of the underlying infrastructure to a private company: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cubic_Transportation_Systems
As long as the margins are well defined, there is little in-house fraud, and the system generally works, the lack of competition isn't such a big deal. The most important thing is that the numbers are published and audited regularly and that the underlying vendor can be replaced in the future (i.e. Nairobi County maintains intellectual property over key assets so there's no vendor lock-in beyond the contract period). -Adam --Kili - Cloud for Africa: kili.io Musings: twitter.com/varudMore Musings: varud.comAbout Adam: www.linkedin.com/in/adamcnelson
On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 12:41 PM, Mwendwa Kivuva via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Thanks Walu. You certainly ask valid questions. What comes to mind is consumer protection, and ensuring data collected about consumers is not used in ways that the consumer does not ascent to. I'm assuming we will read the terms of service. I don't expect any player in the industry to be a monopoly, and certaily my1963 card wil operate alongside BebaPay and AbiriaCard. What I would also like to see is the ability to pay with our NFC enabled debit and credit cards. Consumers should have a choice. Cofek's appeal is mostly based on Article 10 of the constitution where government is expected to involve all stakeholders holders (yes multistakeholderism is here to stay) in decision making. If there was a stakeholders forum, many of these questions would have been asked there. Well, the cashles system has worked before in Kenya hitherto with mixed reactions from the commuters. I support it bearing in mind the many times I've forgotten my change. As agents of changes in society, we should support the initiative, and let it mature. We can learn from other cities, especially Transport for London which has a very successful Oyster Card. Regards
On Tuesday, 11 November 2014, Barrack Otieno via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Hi Walu,
We are in interesting times, what happens to the squad fellows? They
normally get a tenth of the fare for their touting. I wonder whether a
feasibility study was done. The Matatu culture is too complicated ,
this system would work with a more organized Nyayo Bus or KBS kind of
system.
My 2 cents
On 11/11/14, Walubengo J via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
The President launched the cashless matatu payment system in style last
week.
Boarding a matatu from State House to the City Centre, the President used
the payment card "My1963" to pay his fare as the smiling Safaricom CEO, Bob
Collymore, the Matatu Owners association Chairman, Simon Kimutai and the
Cabinet Secretary for Transport and Infrastructure, Eng Michael Kamau all
watched.
Read more @
http://www.nation.co.ke/oped/blogs/dot9/walubengo/-/ 2274560/2518070/-/10vedrez/-/index.html
---------------------------
Additionally, you can read a bare knuckle view from Cofek
** 7 reasons why Cofek will fight to stop the #My1963 PSV's cashless payment
fraud
The National Transport Safety Authority (NTSA) plan to go cashless on fare
payments effective December 1, 2014 though welcome cannot escape public
scrutiny.
Clearly, majority commuters are not ready thanks to the very poor and less
than transparent handling of the cashless fare payments for Public Service
Vehicles (PSV's).
If digital migration switch-off of analogue TV signal could go to the
Supreme Court, then the architects behind the so-called #My1963 fraud must
not celebrate just yet. Why?
READ more @
http://www.cofek.co.ke/index.php/14-news/872-7-reasons-why- cofek-will-fight-to-stop-the-my1963-psv-s-cashless-payment-fraud
--------
walu.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for
people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
--
Barrack O. Otieno
+254721325277
+254-20-2498789
Skype: barrack.otieno
http://www.otienobarrack.me.ke/
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- ______________________ Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya L: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lordmwesh B: http://lord.me.ke/ T: twitter.com/lordmwesh
"There are some men who lift the age they inhabit, till all men walk on higher ground in that lifetime." - Maxwell Anderson
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Walu, We're drifting here but I don't understand either why Nairobi government doesn't stand up about this - even for their own selfish reasons. This is such an obvious place for devolution to be used by Nairobi County to assert themselves and take over the mass transportation system (for better or for worse). It's not like Germany runs the Berlin transport system, or the US runs the New York system, or the UK runs the London system. Each metro area runs its own system (typically). -Adam -- Kili - Cloud for Africa: kili.io Musings: twitter.com/varud <https://twitter.com/varud> More Musings: varud.com About Adam: www.linkedin.com/in/adamcnelson On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 2:20 PM, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
True that Adam,
Monopolies are not necessarily bad since they can ensure a consolidated market to justify investments. HOWEVER "Private monopolies" rather than "Public monopolies" is a different ball game altogether. From my limited travels into the developed North, most (the bulk) of their transport system is under the Public Metropolitan/County government - with room for private sector intervention and innovations.
In Kenya we seem to have got it upside down. Private sector single handedly runs our public transport system - and you can see where this landed us. I miss the days when I was just 10years old and was allowed to use the Public transport aka Kenya Bus Service in 1980s to go alone to public primary school (now @MbuguaNjihia has confirmed am ancient :-)
Indeed I am quite suprised by the loud silence from the Nairobi County government. Perhaps they are also lost in terms of how, where, when and if they could get involved in this cashless payment system. The big picture (regulatory/market structure) seems to be in limited circulation.
walu.
-------------------------------------------- On Tue, 11/11/14, Adam Nelson via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Does cashless matatu system have a regulatory framework? To: jwalu@yahoo.com Date: Tuesday, November 11, 2014, 1:00 PM
It's not unreasonable to have a single, mandated card for this purpose. New York's MetroCard is a great example (as is the Oyster Card). Virtually every city I've been to has one and only one card for mass transportation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MetroCard_(New_York_City)
As with most things, NYC Transit outsources most of the underlying infrastructure to a private company: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cubic_Transportation_Systems
As long as the margins are well defined, there is little in-house fraud, and the system generally works, the lack of competition isn't such a big deal. The most important thing is that the numbers are published and audited regularly and that the underlying vendor can be replaced in the future (i.e. Nairobi County maintains intellectual property over key assets so there's no vendor lock-in beyond the contract period). -Adam --Kili - Cloud for Africa: kili.io Musings: twitter.com/varudMore Musings: varud.comAbout Adam: www.linkedin.com/in/adamcnelson
On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 12:41 PM, Mwendwa Kivuva via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Thanks Walu. You certainly ask valid questions. What comes to mind is consumer protection, and ensuring data collected about consumers is not used in ways that the consumer does not ascent to. I'm assuming we will read the terms of service. I don't expect any player in the industry to be a monopoly, and certaily my1963 card wil operate alongside BebaPay and AbiriaCard. What I would also like to see is the ability to pay with our NFC enabled debit and credit cards. Consumers should have a choice. Cofek's appeal is mostly based on Article 10 of the constitution where government is expected to involve all stakeholders holders (yes multistakeholderism is here to stay) in decision making. If there was a stakeholders forum, many of these questions would have been asked there. Well, the cashles system has worked before in Kenya hitherto with mixed reactions from the commuters. I support it bearing in mind the many times I've forgotten my change. As agents of changes in society, we should support the initiative, and let it mature. We can learn from other cities, especially Transport for London which has a very successful Oyster Card. Regards
On Tuesday, 11 November 2014, Barrack Otieno via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Hi Walu,
We are in interesting times, what happens to the squad fellows? They
normally get a tenth of the fare for their touting. I wonder whether a
feasibility study was done. The Matatu culture is too complicated ,
this system would work with a more organized Nyayo Bus or KBS kind of
system.
My 2 cents
On 11/11/14, Walubengo J via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
The President launched the cashless matatu payment system in style last
week.
Boarding a matatu from State House to the City Centre, the President used
the payment card “My1963” to pay his fare as the smiling Safaricom CEO, Bob
Collymore, the Matatu Owners association Chairman, Simon Kimutai and the
Cabinet Secretary for Transport and Infrastructure, Eng Michael Kamau all
watched.
Read more @
http://www.nation.co.ke/oped/blogs/dot9/walubengo/-/2274560/2518070/-/10vedr...
---------------------------
Additionally, you can read a bare knuckle view from Cofek
** 7 reasons why Cofek will fight to stop the #My1963 PSV's cashless payment
fraud
The National Transport Safety Authority (NTSA) plan to go cashless on fare
payments effective December 1, 2014 though welcome cannot escape public
scrutiny.
Clearly, majority commuters are not ready thanks to the very poor and less
than transparent handling of the cashless fare payments for Public Service
Vehicles (PSV’s).
If digital migration switch-off of analogue TV signal could go to the
Supreme Court, then the architects behind the so-called #My1963 fraud must
not celebrate just yet. Why?
READ more @
http://www.cofek.co.ke/index.php/14-news/872-7-reasons-why-cofek-will-fight-...
--------
walu.
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people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
--
Barrack O. Otieno
+254721325277
+254-20-2498789
Skype: barrack.otieno
http://www.otienobarrack.me.ke/
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- ______________________ Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya L: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lordmwesh B: http://lord.me.ke/ T: twitter.com/lordmwesh
"There are some men who lift the age they inhabit, till all men walk on higher ground in that lifetime." - Maxwell Anderson
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Listers This discussion about technology in the transport sector in the country misses a major point (which I think Walu sort of touched on). The point is this:- No major economy has ever evolved to prosperity without addressing the issue of an efficient public mass transport system in a wholistic way. And one common denominator is this:- It is NOT driven by the private sector but by governments and the private sector through Public-Private Partnerships. So my sense is that although it is a model technology project I'd say we are putting the cart before the horse..Let's sort out the policy issues on mass transport systems, implement them, sort out our infrastructure issues and then ONLY then would this make sense. Ali Hussein +254 770 906375 / 0713 601113 Twitter: @AliHKassim Skype: abu-jomo LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim Blog: www.alyhussein.com "I fear the day technology will surpass human interaction. The world will have a generation of idiots". ~ Albert Einstein Sent from my iPad
On Nov 11, 2014, at 2:42 PM, Adam Nelson via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Walu,
We're drifting here but I don't understand either why Nairobi government doesn't stand up about this - even for their own selfish reasons. This is such an obvious place for devolution to be used by Nairobi County to assert themselves and take over the mass transportation system (for better or for worse).
It's not like Germany runs the Berlin transport system, or the US runs the New York system, or the UK runs the London system. Each metro area runs its own system (typically).
-Adam
-- Kili - Cloud for Africa: kili.io Musings: twitter.com/varud More Musings: varud.com About Adam: www.linkedin.com/in/adamcnelson
On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 2:20 PM, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote: True that Adam,
Monopolies are not necessarily bad since they can ensure a consolidated market to justify investments. HOWEVER "Private monopolies" rather than "Public monopolies" is a different ball game altogether. From my limited travels into the developed North, most (the bulk) of their transport system is under the Public Metropolitan/County government - with room for private sector intervention and innovations.
In Kenya we seem to have got it upside down. Private sector single handedly runs our public transport system - and you can see where this landed us. I miss the days when I was just 10years old and was allowed to use the Public transport aka Kenya Bus Service in 1980s to go alone to public primary school (now @MbuguaNjihia has confirmed am ancient :-)
Indeed I am quite suprised by the loud silence from the Nairobi County government. Perhaps they are also lost in terms of how, where, when and if they could get involved in this cashless payment system. The big picture (regulatory/market structure) seems to be in limited circulation.
walu.
-------------------------------------------- On Tue, 11/11/14, Adam Nelson via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Does cashless matatu system have a regulatory framework? To: jwalu@yahoo.com Date: Tuesday, November 11, 2014, 1:00 PM
It's not unreasonable to have a single, mandated card for this purpose. New York's MetroCard is a great example (as is the Oyster Card). Virtually every city I've been to has one and only one card for mass transportation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MetroCard_(New_York_City)
As with most things, NYC Transit outsources most of the underlying infrastructure to a private company: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cubic_Transportation_Systems
As long as the margins are well defined, there is little in-house fraud, and the system generally works, the lack of competition isn't such a big deal. The most important thing is that the numbers are published and audited regularly and that the underlying vendor can be replaced in the future (i.e. Nairobi County maintains intellectual property over key assets so there's no vendor lock-in beyond the contract period). -Adam --Kili - Cloud for Africa: kili.io Musings: twitter.com/varudMore Musings: varud.comAbout Adam: www.linkedin.com/in/adamcnelson
On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 12:41 PM, Mwendwa Kivuva via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Thanks Walu. You certainly ask valid questions. What comes to mind is consumer protection, and ensuring data collected about consumers is not used in ways that the consumer does not ascent to. I'm assuming we will read the terms of service. I don't expect any player in the industry to be a monopoly, and certaily my1963 card wil operate alongside BebaPay and AbiriaCard. What I would also like to see is the ability to pay with our NFC enabled debit and credit cards. Consumers should have a choice. Cofek's appeal is mostly based on Article 10 of the constitution where government is expected to involve all stakeholders holders (yes multistakeholderism is here to stay) in decision making. If there was a stakeholders forum, many of these questions would have been asked there. Well, the cashles system has worked before in Kenya hitherto with mixed reactions from the commuters. I support it bearing in mind the many times I've forgotten my change. As agents of changes in society, we should support the initiative, and let it mature. We can learn from other cities, especially Transport for London which has a very successful Oyster Card. Regards
On Tuesday, 11 November 2014, Barrack Otieno via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Hi Walu,
We are in interesting times, what happens to the squad fellows? They
normally get a tenth of the fare for their touting. I wonder whether a
feasibility study was done. The Matatu culture is too complicated ,
this system would work with a more organized Nyayo Bus or KBS kind of
system.
My 2 cents
On 11/11/14, Walubengo J via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
The President launched the cashless matatu payment system in style last
week.
Boarding a matatu from State House to the City Centre, the President used
the payment card “My1963” to pay his fare as the smiling Safaricom CEO, Bob
Collymore, the Matatu Owners association Chairman, Simon Kimutai and the
Cabinet Secretary for Transport and Infrastructure, Eng Michael Kamau all
watched.
Read more @
http://www.nation.co.ke/oped/blogs/dot9/walubengo/-/2274560/2518070/-/10vedr...
---------------------------
Additionally, you can read a bare knuckle view from Cofek
** 7 reasons why Cofek will fight to stop the #My1963 PSV's cashless payment
fraud
The National Transport Safety Authority (NTSA) plan to go cashless on fare
payments effective December 1, 2014 though welcome cannot escape public
scrutiny.
Clearly, majority commuters are not ready thanks to the very poor and less
than transparent handling of the cashless fare payments for Public Service
Vehicles (PSV’s).
If digital migration switch-off of analogue TV signal could go to the
Supreme Court, then the architects behind the so-called #My1963 fraud must
not celebrate just yet. Why?
READ more @
http://www.cofek.co.ke/index.php/14-news/872-7-reasons-why-cofek-will-fight-...
--------
walu.
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
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share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
--
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+254721325277
+254-20-2498789
Skype: barrack.otieno
http://www.otienobarrack.me.ke/
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- ______________________ Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya L: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lordmwesh B: http://lord.me.ke/ T: twitter.com/lordmwesh
"There are some men who lift the age they inhabit, till all men walk on higher ground in that lifetime." - Maxwell Anderson
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@ Ali, This is what i have been trying to highlight in my interventions. Best Regards On 11/11/14, Ali Hussein via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Listers
This discussion about technology in the transport sector in the country misses a major point (which I think Walu sort of touched on). The point is this:-
No major economy has ever evolved to prosperity without addressing the issue of an efficient public mass transport system in a wholistic way. And one common denominator is this:-
It is NOT driven by the private sector but by governments and the private sector through Public-Private Partnerships.
So my sense is that although it is a model technology project I'd say we are putting the cart before the horse..Let's sort out the policy issues on mass transport systems, implement them, sort out our infrastructure issues and then ONLY then would this make sense.
Ali Hussein
+254 770 906375 / 0713 601113
Twitter: @AliHKassim Skype: abu-jomo LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim Blog: www.alyhussein.com
"I fear the day technology will surpass human interaction. The world will have a generation of idiots". ~ Albert Einstein
Sent from my iPad
On Nov 11, 2014, at 2:42 PM, Adam Nelson via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Walu,
We're drifting here but I don't understand either why Nairobi government doesn't stand up about this - even for their own selfish reasons. This is such an obvious place for devolution to be used by Nairobi County to assert themselves and take over the mass transportation system (for better or for worse).
It's not like Germany runs the Berlin transport system, or the US runs the New York system, or the UK runs the London system. Each metro area runs its own system (typically).
-Adam
-- Kili - Cloud for Africa: kili.io Musings: twitter.com/varud More Musings: varud.com About Adam: www.linkedin.com/in/adamcnelson
On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 2:20 PM, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote: True that Adam,
Monopolies are not necessarily bad since they can ensure a consolidated market to justify investments. HOWEVER "Private monopolies" rather than "Public monopolies" is a different ball game altogether. From my limited travels into the developed North, most (the bulk) of their transport system is under the Public Metropolitan/County government - with room for private sector intervention and innovations.
In Kenya we seem to have got it upside down. Private sector single handedly runs our public transport system - and you can see where this landed us. I miss the days when I was just 10years old and was allowed to use the Public transport aka Kenya Bus Service in 1980s to go alone to public primary school (now @MbuguaNjihia has confirmed am ancient :-)
Indeed I am quite suprised by the loud silence from the Nairobi County government. Perhaps they are also lost in terms of how, where, when and if they could get involved in this cashless payment system. The big picture (regulatory/market structure) seems to be in limited circulation.
walu.
-------------------------------------------- On Tue, 11/11/14, Adam Nelson via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Does cashless matatu system have a regulatory framework? To: jwalu@yahoo.com Date: Tuesday, November 11, 2014, 1:00 PM
It's not unreasonable to have a single, mandated card for this purpose. New York's MetroCard is a great example (as is the Oyster Card). Virtually every city I've been to has one and only one card for mass transportation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MetroCard_(New_York_City)
As with most things, NYC Transit outsources most of the underlying infrastructure to a private company: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cubic_Transportation_Systems
As long as the margins are well defined, there is little in-house fraud, and the system generally works, the lack of competition isn't such a big deal. The most important thing is that the numbers are published and audited regularly and that the underlying vendor can be replaced in the future (i.e. Nairobi County maintains intellectual property over key assets so there's no vendor lock-in beyond the contract period). -Adam --Kili - Cloud for Africa: kili.io Musings: twitter.com/varudMore Musings: varud.comAbout Adam: www.linkedin.com/in/adamcnelson
On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 12:41 PM, Mwendwa Kivuva via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Thanks Walu. You certainly ask valid questions. What comes to mind is consumer protection, and ensuring data collected about consumers is not used in ways that the consumer does not ascent to. I'm assuming we will read the terms of service. I don't expect any player in the industry to be a monopoly, and certaily my1963 card wil operate alongside BebaPay and AbiriaCard. What I would also like to see is the ability to pay with our NFC enabled debit and credit cards. Consumers should have a choice. Cofek's appeal is mostly based on Article 10 of the constitution where government is expected to involve all stakeholders holders (yes multistakeholderism is here to stay) in decision making. If there was a stakeholders forum, many of these questions would have been asked there. Well, the cashles system has worked before in Kenya hitherto with mixed reactions from the commuters. I support it bearing in mind the many times I've forgotten my change. As agents of changes in society, we should support the initiative, and let it mature. We can learn from other cities, especially Transport for London which has a very successful Oyster Card. Regards
On Tuesday, 11 November 2014, Barrack Otieno via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Hi Walu,
We are in interesting times, what happens to the squad fellows? They
normally get a tenth of the fare for their touting. I wonder whether a
feasibility study was done. The Matatu culture is too complicated ,
this system would work with a more organized Nyayo Bus or KBS kind of
system.
My 2 cents
On 11/11/14, Walubengo J via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
The President launched the cashless matatu payment system in style last
week.
Boarding a matatu from State House to the City Centre, the President used
the payment card “My1963” to pay his fare as the smiling Safaricom CEO, Bob
Collymore, the Matatu Owners association Chairman, Simon Kimutai and the
Cabinet Secretary for Transport and Infrastructure, Eng Michael Kamau all
watched.
Read more @
http://www.nation.co.ke/oped/blogs/dot9/walubengo/-/2274560/2518070/-/10vedr...
---------------------------
Additionally, you can read a bare knuckle view from Cofek
** 7 reasons why Cofek will fight to stop the #My1963 PSV's cashless payment
fraud
The National Transport Safety Authority (NTSA) plan to go cashless on fare
payments effective December 1, 2014 though welcome cannot escape public
scrutiny.
Clearly, majority commuters are not ready thanks to the very poor and less
than transparent handling of the cashless fare payments for Public Service
Vehicles (PSV’s).
If digital migration switch-off of analogue TV signal could go to the
Supreme Court, then the architects behind the so-called #My1963 fraud must
not celebrate just yet. Why?
READ more @
http://www.cofek.co.ke/index.php/14-news/872-7-reasons-why-cofek-will-fight-...
--------
walu.
_______________________________________________
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for
people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth,
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
--
Barrack O. Otieno
+254721325277
+254-20-2498789
Skype: barrack.otieno
http://www.otienobarrack.me.ke/
_______________________________________________
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- ______________________ Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya L: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lordmwesh B: http://lord.me.ke/ T: twitter.com/lordmwesh
"There are some men who lift the age they inhabit, till all men walk on higher ground in that lifetime." - Maxwell Anderson
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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participants (5)
-
Adam Nelson -
Ali Hussein -
Barrack Otieno -
Dennis Kioko -
Walubengo J