Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy. When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution. In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers. Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances. Regards Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us. A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher. In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerry® -----Original Message----- From: bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: <bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy. When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution. In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers. Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances. Regards Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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Stephen, Even if termination rates goes to Zero, international call rates out of Kenya remains high. It is important to know that this was not a knee jerk reaction as many may think. The debate has been in public domain and indeed there were similar initiatives that were not challenged. I think we applying double standards in this matter. I will therefore not comment on this issue any further. Regards. Ndemo. Sent from my BlackBerry® -----Original Message----- From: "Stephen Mutoro" <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 16:34:03 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Reply-To: stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us. A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher. In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerry® -----Original Message----- From: bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: <bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy. When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution. In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers. Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances. Regards Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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Hi all, In the interest of those of us that might not be privy to the principles of the "underlying economic policy" that would dictate such intervention and to avoid uninformed conclusions, what are the tenets of it (in simple English).....also in the spirit of responsible journalism, was this appropriately referenced/sited in the article? Edwin -----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+eonchari=lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+eonchari=lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of bitange@jambo.co.ke Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 10:13 PM To: Edwin Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Stephen, Even if termination rates goes to Zero, international call rates out of Kenya remains high. It is important to know that this was not a knee jerk reaction as many may think. The debate has been in public domain and indeed there were similar initiatives that were not challenged. I think we applying double standards in this matter. I will therefore not comment on this issue any further. Regards. Ndemo. Sent from my BlackBerryR -----Original Message----- From: "Stephen Mutoro" <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 16:34:03 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Reply-To: stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us. A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher. In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerryR -----Original Message----- From: bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: <bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy. When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution. In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers. Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances. Regards Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerryR
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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we are talking about 2 types of termination rates (a) national and (b) international, both which affect end-user tariffs. my humble view is that cck as a responsible organ of government must be responsive to the effect its regulations have on the economy, such as stability and long-term sustainability. i cannot think of any reasonable person who stands to gain from the consequences of collapse of the telecom sector. neither is it right for cck to remain fixated on driving termination rates to the floor because for me mtr is neither the sole determinant of end-user rates, nor the lone beacon for the state of industry competition. i support the pragmatic government direction that aims at restoring sanity in this sector. my two cents worth On 9 June 2011 23:01, Edwin Onchari <eonchari@lynxbits.com> wrote:
Hi all,
In the interest of those of us that might not be privy to the principles of the "underlying economic policy" that would dictate such intervention and to avoid uninformed conclusions, what are the tenets of it (in simple English).....also in the spirit of responsible journalism, was this appropriately referenced/sited in the article?
Edwin
-----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+eonchari=lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+eonchari=lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of bitange@jambo.co.ke Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 10:13 PM To: Edwin Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Stephen, Even if termination rates goes to Zero, international call rates out of Kenya remains high.
It is important to know that this was not a knee jerk reaction as many may think. The debate has been in public domain and indeed there were similar initiatives that were not challenged. I think we applying double standards in this matter. I will therefore not comment on this issue any further.
Regards.
Ndemo.
Sent from my BlackBerryR
-----Original Message----- From: "Stephen Mutoro" <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 16:34:03 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Reply-To: stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us.
A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher.
In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerryR
-----Original Message----- From: bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: <bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy.
When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution.
In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers.
Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances.
Regards
Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerryR
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
bandwidth,
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Thank you. BR, Eng. K. Gicohi
Kin'gori, Thanks for simplifying it for me. I might have missed part of this discussion at some point, but my question then becomes, was CCK well informed when they made the decision? i.e did they seek advice from the relevant ministries on the possible impact on the economy this aggressive price reductions will have? Did all the Telcos participate in the discussions and all agreed on some model(s) to be used for the price reductions? Edwin From: kictanet-bounces+eonchari=lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+eonchari=lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of King'ori Gicohi Sent: Friday, June 10, 2011 11:19 AM To: Edwin Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars we are talking about 2 types of termination rates (a) national and (b) international, both which affect end-user tariffs. my humble view is that cck as a responsible organ of government must be responsive to the effect its regulations have on the economy, such as stability and long-term sustainability. i cannot think of any reasonable person who stands to gain from the consequences of collapse of the telecom sector. neither is it right for cck to remain fixated on driving termination rates to the floor because for me mtr is neither the sole determinant of end-user rates, nor the lone beacon for the state of industry competition. i support the pragmatic government direction that aims at restoring sanity in this sector. my two cents worth On 9 June 2011 23:01, Edwin Onchari <eonchari@lynxbits.com> wrote: Hi all, In the interest of those of us that might not be privy to the principles of the "underlying economic policy" that would dictate such intervention and to avoid uninformed conclusions, what are the tenets of it (in simple English).....also in the spirit of responsible journalism, was this appropriately referenced/sited in the article? Edwin -----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+eonchari=lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+eonchari <mailto:kictanet-bounces%2Beonchari> =lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of bitange@jambo.co.ke Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 10:13 PM To: Edwin Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Stephen, Even if termination rates goes to Zero, international call rates out of Kenya remains high. It is important to know that this was not a knee jerk reaction as many may think. The debate has been in public domain and indeed there were similar initiatives that were not challenged. I think we applying double standards in this matter. I will therefore not comment on this issue any further. Regards. Ndemo. Sent from my BlackBerryR -----Original Message----- From: "Stephen Mutoro" <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 16:34:03 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Reply-To: stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us. A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher. In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerryR -----Original Message----- From: bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: <bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy. When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution. In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers. Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances. Regards Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerryR
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Jambo MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------- "easy access to the world"
---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Jambo MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------- "easy access to the world" ---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Jambo MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------- "easy access to the world" _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/eonchari%40lynxbits.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/k.gicohi%40googlemail.c om The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Thank you. BR, Eng. K. Gicohi
Reminds me of Exodus - how Moses and Aaron had to put up with the constant kvetching of the querulous Israelites :-) On 9 June 2011 22:12, <bitange@jambo.co.ke> wrote:
Stephen, Even if termination rates goes to Zero, international call rates out of Kenya remains high.
It is important to know that this was not a knee jerk reaction as many may think. The debate has been in public domain and indeed there were similar initiatives that were not challenged. I think we applying double standards in this matter. I will therefore not comment on this issue any further.
Regards.
Ndemo.
Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: "Stephen Mutoro" <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 16:34:03 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Reply-To: stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us.
A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher.
In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: <bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions< kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy.
When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution.
In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers.
Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances.
Regards
Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
bandwidth,
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
bandwidth,
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Jambo MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------- "easy access to the world"
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
Nice humor..? PRO On Jun 10, 2011, at 2:58 PM, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
Reminds me of Exodus - how Moses and Aaron had to put up with the constant kvetching of the querulous Israelites :-)
On 9 June 2011 22:12, <bitange@jambo.co.ke> wrote: Stephen, Even if termination rates goes to Zero, international call rates out of Kenya remains high.
It is important to know that this was not a knee jerk reaction as many may think. The debate has been in public domain and indeed there were similar initiatives that were not challenged. I think we applying double standards in this matter. I will therefore not comment on this issue any further.
Regards.
Ndemo.
Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: "Stephen Mutoro" <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 16:34:03 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Reply-To: stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us.
A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher.
In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: <bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy.
When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution.
In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers.
Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances.
Regards
Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/bitange%40jambo.co.ke
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Jambo MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------- "easy access to the world"
---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Jambo MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------- "easy access to the world"
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Well Roy, maybe a half hearted attempt at humour - I support Daktari - its not the first time he is getting drawn into these things. In the last 5-7 years the telecom sector has come a very very long way. Unless mobile services become part of a welfare scheme that can be subsidised by the government, there is no need to let the market atrophy by further lowering termination rates - the rates as they stand are OK IMHO. To lower the rates further would have a negative effect - less investment by operators, less taxes to the government (to build roads, hospitals, schools.....and pay MPs, etc). The ICT sector is increasingly becoming a major contributor to economic growth. As consumers we should be happy to be here. Never mind the independence of CCK being called into question - I think its about the bigger picture. We've seen the top three players in the market either report losses or lower profits. lets remember one of the players is a listed company (just as much as Uchumi was). At the same time consumers are becoming more sophisticated and making demands on their service providers (quality of service, coverage, speed, etc). If revenues continue to drop further, then there is no way operators can invest in these areas. Unless of course we want to be content with sub standard mediocre services in the years ahead... On 10 June 2011 15:43, Paul Roy <roykoikai@gmail.com> wrote:
Nice humor..?
PRO
On Jun 10, 2011, at 2:58 PM, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
Reminds me of Exodus - how Moses and Aaron had to put up with the constant kvetching of the querulous Israelites :-)
On 9 June 2011 22:12, < <bitange@jambo.co.ke>bitange@jambo.co.ke> wrote:
Stephen, Even if termination rates goes to Zero, international call rates out of Kenya remains high.
It is important to know that this was not a knee jerk reaction as many may think. The debate has been in public domain and indeed there were similar initiatives that were not challenged. I think we applying double standards in this matter. I will therefore not comment on this issue any further.
Regards.
Ndemo.
Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: "Stephen Mutoro" < <stephen@cofek.co.ke>stephen@cofek.co.ke> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 16:34:03 To: < <bitange@jambo.co.ke>bitange@jambo.co.ke> Reply-To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke>stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions< <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us.
A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher.
In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: <bitange@jambo.co.ke>bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: < <stephen@cofek.co.ke>stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: < <bitange@jambo.co.ke>bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions< <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy.
When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution.
In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers.
Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances.
Regards
Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko < <dmbuvi@gmail.com>dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: < <stephen@cofek.co.ke>stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions< <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
Like Dr. Ndemo, I want to comment my very last on this subject. My view and that of the Consumers Federation of Kenya remains that we are NOT questioning the suitability of the decision to stop further lowering of MTR. Period. We are deeply concerned with the approach/process. And assuming State House unsolicited advice is right as most of us seem to agree, then what explanation does CCK have for the previous accelerated southwards move on MTR? In short and on the communications regulation, the buck stops with CCK and not State House - whether CCK bases its decision from State House or other quarters. Let's not attempt to hush some serious governance issues. Whether we have come a long way as a sector is not in doubt. We should be worried about where we are - and where we are likely to nose-dive to - depending on the expensive shortcuts and legal breaches we seem to be now embracing - if for nothing else to satisfy our egos of which of the MSPs is more or less "politically correct". It is the same reason the High Court seems to be (at least in the interim period) reminding Mr. Samuel Pogishio that he may be a Minister but there is what lawyers call separation of powers and clearly (well-intentioned or not) the CCK Board of Directors must have a say on the renewal of the DG's contract. I rest my case and wish you a nice weekend. Stephen From: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of Francis Hook Sent: Friday, June 10, 2011 4:09 PM To: stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Well Roy, maybe a half hearted attempt at humour - I support Daktari - its not the first time he is getting drawn into these things. In the last 5-7 years the telecom sector has come a very very long way. Unless mobile services become part of a welfare scheme that can be subsidised by the government, there is no need to let the market atrophy by further lowering termination rates - the rates as they stand are OK IMHO. To lower the rates further would have a negative effect - less investment by operators, less taxes to the government (to build roads, hospitals, schools.....and pay MPs, etc). The ICT sector is increasingly becoming a major contributor to economic growth. As consumers we should be happy to be here. Never mind the independence of CCK being called into question - I think its about the bigger picture. We've seen the top three players in the market either report losses or lower profits. lets remember one of the players is a listed company (just as much as Uchumi was). At the same time consumers are becoming more sophisticated and making demands on their service providers (quality of service, coverage, speed, etc). If revenues continue to drop further, then there is no way operators can invest in these areas. Unless of course we want to be content with sub standard mediocre services in the years ahead... On 10 June 2011 15:43, Paul Roy <roykoikai@gmail.com> wrote: Nice humor..? PRO On Jun 10, 2011, at 2:58 PM, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote: Reminds me of Exodus - how Moses and Aaron had to put up with the constant kvetching of the querulous Israelites :-) On 9 June 2011 22:12, <bitange@jambo.co.ke> wrote: Stephen, Even if termination rates goes to Zero, international call rates out of Kenya remains high. It is important to know that this was not a knee jerk reaction as many may think. The debate has been in public domain and indeed there were similar initiatives that were not challenged. I think we applying double standards in this matter. I will therefore not comment on this issue any further. Regards. Ndemo. Sent from my BlackBerryR -----Original Message----- From: "Stephen Mutoro" <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 16:34:03 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Reply-To: stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us. A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher. In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerryR -----Original Message----- From: bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: <bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy. When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution. In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers. Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances. Regards Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerryR
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Jambo MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------- "easy access to the world" ---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Jambo MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------- "easy access to the world" _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/francis.hook%40gmail.co m The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Francis Hook +254 733 504561 _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/roykoikai%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
Francis, I take issue with one part of your comment "that with lower call rates, operators will pay less taxes to the government thus less roads, less hospitals... the argument goes" This is trickle down economic theory that believes that economies only do well when the biggest producers are doing well (and paying high taxes). Kenya has much more to benefit if lower call rates spur economic activity for the smallest businesses. If these small business can become more productive, the increase in employment and money in the hands of many people will do a lot more for the economy. A recent world bank study found that for every 10% increase in mobile phone penetration, there is an economic growth increase of 0.81%. The government can find other ways to help operators protect their revenues e.g. by sharing equipment, but let the small man benefit from lower call rates for it is in his hands that economic growth lies. Regards, Harry Karanja Sent from my iPhone On Jun 10, 2011, at 4:09 PM, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
Well Roy, maybe a half hearted attempt at humour - I support Daktari - its not the first time he is getting drawn into these things.
In the last 5-7 years the telecom sector has come a very very long way. Unless mobile services become part of a welfare scheme that can be subsidised by the government, there is no need to let the market atrophy by further lowering termination rates - the rates as they stand are OK IMHO. To lower the rates further would have a negative effect - less investment by operators, less taxes to the government (to build roads, hospitals, schools.....and pay MPs, etc). The ICT sector is increasingly becoming a major contributor to economic growth.
As consumers we should be happy to be here. Never mind the independence of CCK being called into question - I think its about the bigger picture.
We've seen the top three players in the market either report losses or lower profits. lets remember one of the players is a listed company (just as much as Uchumi was). At the same time consumers are becoming more sophisticated and making demands on their service providers (quality of service, coverage, speed, etc). If revenues continue to drop further, then there is no way operators can invest in these areas. Unless of course we want to be content with sub standard mediocre services in the years ahead...
On 10 June 2011 15:43, Paul Roy <roykoikai@gmail.com> wrote: Nice humor..?
PRO
On Jun 10, 2011, at 2:58 PM, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
Reminds me of Exodus - how Moses and Aaron had to put up with the constant kvetching of the querulous Israelites :-)
On 9 June 2011 22:12, <bitange@jambo.co.ke> wrote: Stephen, Even if termination rates goes to Zero, international call rates out of Kenya remains high.
It is important to know that this was not a knee jerk reaction as many may think. The debate has been in public domain and indeed there were similar initiatives that were not challenged. I think we applying double standards in this matter. I will therefore not comment on this issue any further.
Regards.
Ndemo.
Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: "Stephen Mutoro" <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 16:34:03 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Reply-To: stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us.
A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher.
In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: <bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy.
When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution.
In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers.
Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances.
Regards
Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Hi Harry, I'm not economist (perhaps a freakonomist at the very least) - you talk of penetration contributing directly to economic growth. if the operators have nothing left to invest in EXPANSION, penetration is not likely to increase much further and existing coverage will suffer low quality. On many trips to Kampala I know there are still pockets where there is no coverage in Kenya (between Nairobi and Busia, or NBI and Malaba). Rather than lower mobile tariffs further - how about they do something about fuel costs (which impact manufacturers, transporters, utilities, etc) and while Wanjiku pays 1.50 per minute - she pays MORE bus fare, MORE to middlemen to get her produce to the market, more for kerosene (or decides to chop down a tree instead), MORE for electricity (if she is lucky to be near the 70% uptime grid) , more for basic goods like Sugar (transport + mnfg costs directly related to fuel costs).....Sorry but I cannot see 1.50 per minute helping her....or Kenya. On 13 June 2011 15:22, Harry Karanja <kairo@softlaw.co.ke> wrote:
Francis,
I take issue with one part of your comment "that with lower call rates, operators will pay less taxes to the government thus less roads, less hospitals... the argument goes"
This is trickle down economic theory that believes that economies only do well when the biggest producers are doing well (and paying high taxes). Kenya has much more to benefit if lower call rates spur economic activity for the smallest businesses. If these small business can become more productive, the increase in employment and money in the hands of many people will do a lot more for the economy.
A recent world bank study found that for every 10% increase in mobile phone penetration, there is an economic growth increase of 0.81%. The government can find other ways to help operators protect their revenues e.g. by sharing equipment, but let the small man benefit from lower call rates for it is in his hands that economic growth lies.
Regards, Harry Karanja
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 10, 2011, at 4:09 PM, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
Well Roy, maybe a half hearted attempt at humour - I support Daktari - its not the first time he is getting drawn into these things.
In the last 5-7 years the telecom sector has come a very very long way. Unless mobile services become part of a welfare scheme that can be subsidised by the government, there is no need to let the market atrophy by further lowering termination rates - the rates as they stand are OK IMHO. To lower the rates further would have a negative effect - less investment by operators, less taxes to the government (to build roads, hospitals, schools.....and pay MPs, etc). The ICT sector is increasingly becoming a major contributor to economic growth.
As consumers we should be happy to be here. Never mind the independence of CCK being called into question - I think its about the bigger picture.
We've seen the top three players in the market either report losses or lower profits. lets remember one of the players is a listed company (just as much as Uchumi was). At the same time consumers are becoming more sophisticated and making demands on their service providers (quality of service, coverage, speed, etc). If revenues continue to drop further, then there is no way operators can invest in these areas. Unless of course we want to be content with sub standard mediocre services in the years ahead...
On 10 June 2011 15:43, Paul Roy < <roykoikai@gmail.com>roykoikai@gmail.com
wrote:
Nice humor..?
PRO
On Jun 10, 2011, at 2:58 PM, Francis Hook < <francis.hook@gmail.com> francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
Reminds me of Exodus - how Moses and Aaron had to put up with the constant kvetching of the querulous Israelites :-)
On 9 June 2011 22:12, < <bitange@jambo.co.ke> <bitange@jambo.co.ke> bitange@jambo.co.ke> wrote:
Stephen, Even if termination rates goes to Zero, international call rates out of Kenya remains high.
It is important to know that this was not a knee jerk reaction as many may think. The debate has been in public domain and indeed there were similar initiatives that were not challenged. I think we applying double standards in this matter. I will therefore not comment on this issue any further.
Regards.
Ndemo.
Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: "Stephen Mutoro" < <stephen@cofek.co.ke> <stephen@cofek.co.ke> stephen@cofek.co.ke> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 16:34:03 To: < <bitange@jambo.co.ke> <bitange@jambo.co.ke>bitange@jambo.co.ke> Reply-To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> <stephen@cofek.co.ke>stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions< <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke><kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us.
A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher.
In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> <bitange@jambo.co.ke>bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: < <stephen@cofek.co.ke> <stephen@cofek.co.ke>stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: < <bitange@jambo.co.ke> <bitange@jambo.co.ke>bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions< <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke><kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy.
When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution.
In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers.
Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances.
Regards
Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerry®
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko < <dmbuvi@gmail.com> <dmbuvi@gmail.com> dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: < <stephen@cofek.co.ke> <stephen@cofek.co.ke>stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions< <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke><kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
bandwidth,
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet><http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
See the case of Uganda ---http://www.monitor.co.ug/News/National/-/688334/1179574/-/c0s240z/-/index .html cheers Muriuki Mureithi Consultant Member Society of Telecommunications Consultants summit strategies ltd , www.summitstrategies.co.ke towards demise of roaming -- see http://www.emeraldinsight.com/fwd.htm?id=aob <http://www.emeraldinsight.com/fwd.htm?id=aob&ini=aob&doi=10.1108/1463669111 1131439> &ini=aob&doi=10.1108/14636691111131439 From: kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+mureithi=summitstrategies.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.k e] On Behalf Of Francis Hook Sent: 13 June 2011 17:17 To: mureithi@summitstrategies.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Hi Harry, I'm not economist (perhaps a freakonomist at the very least) - you talk of penetration contributing directly to economic growth. if the operators have nothing left to invest in EXPANSION, penetration is not likely to increase much further and existing coverage will suffer low quality. On many trips to Kampala I know there are still pockets where there is no coverage in Kenya (between Nairobi and Busia, or NBI and Malaba). Rather than lower mobile tariffs further - how about they do something about fuel costs (which impact manufacturers, transporters, utilities, etc) and while Wanjiku pays 1.50 per minute - she pays MORE bus fare, MORE to middlemen to get her produce to the market, more for kerosene (or decides to chop down a tree instead), MORE for electricity (if she is lucky to be near the 70% uptime grid) , more for basic goods like Sugar (transport + mnfg costs directly related to fuel costs).....Sorry but I cannot see 1.50 per minute helping her....or Kenya. On 13 June 2011 15:22, Harry Karanja <kairo@softlaw.co.ke> wrote: Francis, I take issue with one part of your comment "that with lower call rates, operators will pay less taxes to the government thus less roads, less hospitals... the argument goes" This is trickle down economic theory that believes that economies only do well when the biggest producers are doing well (and paying high taxes). Kenya has much more to benefit if lower call rates spur economic activity for the smallest businesses. If these small business can become more productive, the increase in employment and money in the hands of many people will do a lot more for the economy. A recent world bank study found that for every 10% increase in mobile phone penetration, there is an economic growth increase of 0.81%. The government can find other ways to help operators protect their revenues e.g. by sharing equipment, but let the small man benefit from lower call rates for it is in his hands that economic growth lies. Regards, Harry Karanja Sent from my iPhone On Jun 10, 2011, at 4:09 PM, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote: Well Roy, maybe a half hearted attempt at humour - I support Daktari - its not the first time he is getting drawn into these things. In the last 5-7 years the telecom sector has come a very very long way. Unless mobile services become part of a welfare scheme that can be subsidised by the government, there is no need to let the market atrophy by further lowering termination rates - the rates as they stand are OK IMHO. To lower the rates further would have a negative effect - less investment by operators, less taxes to the government (to build roads, hospitals, schools.....and pay MPs, etc). The ICT sector is increasingly becoming a major contributor to economic growth. As consumers we should be happy to be here. Never mind the independence of CCK being called into question - I think its about the bigger picture. We've seen the top three players in the market either report losses or lower profits. lets remember one of the players is a listed company (just as much as Uchumi was). At the same time consumers are becoming more sophisticated and making demands on their service providers (quality of service, coverage, speed, etc). If revenues continue to drop further, then there is no way operators can invest in these areas. Unless of course we want to be content with sub standard mediocre services in the years ahead... On 10 June 2011 15:43, Paul Roy <roykoikai@gmail.com> wrote: Nice humor..? PRO On Jun 10, 2011, at 2:58 PM, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote: Reminds me of Exodus - how Moses and Aaron had to put up with the constant kvetching of the querulous Israelites :-) On 9 June 2011 22:12, <bitange@jambo.co.ke> wrote: Stephen, Even if termination rates goes to Zero, international call rates out of Kenya remains high. It is important to know that this was not a knee jerk reaction as many may think. The debate has been in public domain and indeed there were similar initiatives that were not challenged. I think we applying double standards in this matter. I will therefore not comment on this issue any further. Regards. Ndemo. Sent from my BlackBerryR -----Original Message----- From: "Stephen Mutoro" <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 16:34:03 To: <bitange@jambo.co.ke> Reply-To: stephen@cofek.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Thanks Dktr. My personal respect for you and your views notwithstanding, I beg to differ not necessarily on the suitability of the decision but the approach/process. Nothing wrong for interested parties to intervene within contexts. But lets avoid setting bad and costly precedents - through our obsession as Kenyans with shortcuts or quick fixes and selfish deals whenever it suits us. A brief story. I arrived in the country very early today. For the 5 days or so I've been away in Dakar, Senegal, my roaming bill came to about 7K not necessarily that I was making too many or long calls but the best I cld get is Sh59 per min for receiving calls and Sh108 for calling per min. Retrieving data/emails was even higher. In short, the gains Kenyans have made on ICT and telcos sector (through you and others) are too dear to be wished/eroded away. Cofek and I request to be understood in this perspective. Lets accord CCK the "independence" and have it as practically as possible stir away from partisan influences. Good night! Sent from my BlackBerryR -----Original Message----- From: bitange@jambo.co.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 19:14:03 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: <bitange@jambo.co.ke>; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars Stephen, I wish you first asked what transpired before you make such remarks. CCK gets its policy direction from the Ministry of Information and Communications. The policy emanates from the political manifesto of the ruling party. In our current case, the harmonized manifesto. Here we agreed to a free market economy. This means that any market interventions must reflect the underlying economic policy. When we had accellerated price decline in Uganda, Congo and other countries, they resulted to a floor price, in other words price control. Had we taken that direction, we shall have undermined the underlying economic policy. Instead we temporarily suspended the glide path to study the wider impact on the economy. The CCK board arrived at that solution. In my view you are misunderstanding the independence rule. Central Banks world over are independent but their decisions are based on the policy direction of the country. Even if you were to head this country you will find that it is your policies that would govern the country since the buck stops with the leadership. It will make no sense if we have several independent decision makers. Different papers reported different stories but nobody has sought clarification or offer a solution under the prevailing circumstances. Regards Ndemo.
Indeed a desperate move and one that has neither moral nor legal basis. What a mockery of a futile attempt of by-passing regulatory regime. It is CCK that will be the "loser" if it cowardly allows a clear abuse of Section 5(b) of Info and Comms Act. Cofek will be seeking clarification from concerned parties. We must never allow State House to conduct sector regulatory matters, whether pro or anti-consumer. Rgds Sent from my BlackBerryR
-----Original Message----- From: Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> Sender: kictanet-bounces+stephen=cofek.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 12:17:55 To: <stephen@cofek.co.ke> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] State House moves in to quell mobile price wars
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Jambo MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------- "easy access to the world"
---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Jambo MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------- "easy access to the world" ---------------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Jambo MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --------------------------------------------- "easy access to the world" _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/francis.hook%40gmail.co m The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Francis Hook +254 733 504561 _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/roykoikai%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Francis Hook +254 733 504561 _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/kairo%40softlaw.co.ke The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
participants (8)
-
bitange＠jambo.co.ke -
Edwin Onchari -
Francis Hook -
Harry Karanja -
King'ori Gicohi -
muriuki mureithi -
Paul Roy -
Stephen Mutoro