Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
1. That much of the BPO sector has been set up in an uncompetitive
that cannot be sustained. Businesses (for this is what they are) have been set up while factoring heavily the potential government subsidy. --- I have a friend of mine who set up here on Kenya long before the subsidy was in place, and so therefore you cannot base your claims on a few vendors who set up in a rush for the subsidy only to close shop when they realized that
Good day All, This interesting subject on BPO rather caught my attention intensely I must say :-) I have just come from the UK a couple of months back and look to setup a contact center locally, now that the industry has begun to pick up amid the hiccups here and there. And to pick up on some of Sam Regee's points as outlined below, i will also tend to share my findings as well: (My comments are in blue font in commenting to Sam Regee's comments) framework the bandwidth wasnt forth-coming at all.Meaning they got in the industry on a wrong foot. There are several which are still operating and have been on since even before the subsidy issue.
2. That the private sector players in the industry are too dependent on government (through the Kenya ICT Board) for marketing and business. Essentially there is too much government in the business of outsourcing here - not from a legislative perspective but from an operational perspective
This is clearly untenable because, having glanced at the Kenya ICT Board's strategy as articulated by its officials severally, their mandate goes much further than BPO - as at the time they were set up, that is. For sure, I perceive them as a marketing organization but marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.---- Sam if you look clearly, you will realise private sector are not that dependent on government/ICT Board at all. Have you even walked around the existing centers and seen how developed most are? Did government/ICT Board help them get to the levels of development they are in? I think not. If I were you I would visit existing centers first before I leap to claiming the private sector are dependant on government/ICT Board. Or maybe you can shade some light for us on what exactly you mean by ' too dependent' :-) and also it is obvious government has to be involved because if you have been keen on what has been going on since you arrived in the country, you will realise BPO is one of the 5 pillars of the set Vision 2030 which is a government initiative. So whether we like it or not, government has a major role to play in ensuring this industry picks up here in Kenya.
3. That the private sector umbrella body, the Kenya BPO Society - and I have read the discussions by the chairman of the Society here - seems to not articulate well its programmes (at least to my understanding) what they are about overally.---- From my point, the chairman of the society clearly laid out who they are overally, and what they do. And for such a young society, I say kudos to where they are now. You can visit their offices and I am sure they will be more than glad to tell you on a one-on-one basis what
On the note of ICT Board's role in marketing, if you have been keen on all organised BPO/Contact Center events, ICT Board itself has always put itself on the frontline in this events, meaning they themselves are the ones focusing too much on the BPO/Contact center industry and putting so much energy on it, (which is a good thing anyway) , while there are so many ICT things to market on. So I agree with you that ICT Board should focus on marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services. they are all about. For all I know, they are doing a great job, and I wish them all the best as they continue to drwa the industry to high depths. Just to give you a bit of what they have achieved so far, so that you can apprecaiate they are on the right direction, they recently launched the Standards & Ethics guidelines for the industry, which I say is a very brilliant step, considering how young the industry is here in Kenya. So it is with such laid guidelines that the BPO industry in Kenya will be able to be laid in a firm solid foundation that is based on international operation standards in BPO & Contact Center industy.
If I were to turn to the BPO Services Association Unlimited ( http://www.bsau.org/), I can see a marketing campaign and a marketing position that they have taken. This came from the outsourcing private sector - and some of their programmes have support from the Phillipino government but the drive is from the private sector. If I look at NASSCOM, I can see that they are private sector led and their main purpose is the promotion of India as the leader in BPO services globally. In fact, they start by saying that they are a global organization - which is a position of strength.
Has the BPO Society attained such a level of pedigree - which starts in the mind with strategy - that would enable them to lead the sector to prosperity? I have not heard it in their discussions at the few events where I have had a chance to listen to the Chairperson and other officials of the society.-----My friend, it seems you have really been behind the screens with the society updates. Next week they will be launching their 3 year marketing strategy plan. This is indeed another brilliant step they will have taken as young an association as they are.From one of their forums, I remember them mentioning that one of their strategies is to join hands with several associations globally. This shows great initiative in making sure the industry gets recognized globaly through such relations. It rather unfortunate that the society did not get to participate at the EXPO ZARAGORA 2008 Spain event which from my research had many international associations attending the event such that it could have been an ideal place to network and form relations with the other international associations. I hear the society was to participate but they got a critical hiccup at the last minute (maybe the society chairman can fill us in on what exactly happened for them to miss such a crucial beneficial event). But I hear the CEO of ICT Board Mr Paul Kukubo and a local call center director,attended the event, maybe they can shed more light for us (if they are in the mailing list) what exactly went on in the Spain event and if they managed to secure any opportunities from the event. It is at such events that the society looks to the government support in ensuring they and also some industry players get to attend such events as Kenyan political figures were also present at the event as well as government officials. Such is where much lobbying can take place and the society can lobby their way to getting in beneficial relations with other international associations as well us get prospective clienst for industry players at some point.
c) Has the BPO Society (or the Kenya ICT Board since they are so much in
thick of things here) done a comprehensive marketing plan for the sector - or do they each have one? ---- For all I know, I hear the Kenya BPO society has a marketing strategy which they are launching some time next week. Maybe you should find our more details about it from the society itself, so that you can be able to attend and maybe you will get your answers there. I will be attending, and would really like to meet you there Sam Regee so that we can chit chat about this industry in a more comprehensive way. What do you say? I sure hope to see you there. I never miss society events as they give me hope that there is a light at the end of
Hi all,
As a recently returned (to Kenya) academic and entrepreneur, with an interest in the BPO sector - explicitly: I want to set up a legal transcription facility here. As I go about my research, I have been to see one or two operations, while I was in my previous engagement a few months ago and I am saddened to note that quite a number of the BPO operations
were in existence a few months ago are no more.
having spoken to a few people in the industry, I am led to form some preliminary conclusions (which I hope to validate here): I apologise in advance, if I offend, but it is in a positive spirit, that I advance these thoughts here.
1. That much of the BPO sector has been set up in an uncompetitive
that cannot be sustained. Businesses (for this is what they are) have been set up while factoring heavily the potential government subsidy.
2. That the private sector players in the industry are too dependent on government (through the Kenya ICT Board) for marketing and business. Essentially there is too much government in the business of outsourcing here - not from a legislative perspective but from an operational perspective.
This is clearly untenable because, having glanced at the Kenya ICT Board's strategy as articulated by its officials severally, their mandate goes much further than BPO - as at the time they were set up, that is. For sure, I perceive them as a marketing organization but marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.
3. That the private sector umbrella body, the Kenya BPO Society - and I have read the discussions by the chairman of the Society here - seems to not articulate well its programmes (at least to my understanding) what they are about overally.
If I were to turn to the BPO Services Association Unlimited ( http://www.bsau.org/), I can see a marketing campaign and a marketing position that they have taken. This came from the outsourcing private sector - and some of their programmes have support from the Phillipino government but the drive is from the private sector. If I look at NASSCOM, I can see that they are private sector led and their main purpose is the promotion of India as the leader in BPO services globally. In fact, they start by saying that they are a global organization - which is a position of strength.
Has the BPO Society attained such a level of pedigree - which starts in
mind with strategy - that would enable them to lead the sector to prosperity? I have not heard it in their discussions at the few events where I have had a chance to listen to the Chairperson and other officials of
society.
These are preliminary thoughts that I have developed and I would be happy to see them examined and torn apart and validated as the case may be.
meanwhile, some pointed questions:
a) Is there any science to a slice of the $310 Billion opportunity presented by the society? This is to ask, how many seats would we need to have to have a 1% slice of the opportunity?
b) How many BPO operators are there now - and more pointedly - how many are actually functional?
c) Has the BPO Society (or the Kenya ICT Board since they are so much in
thick of things here) done a comprehensive marketing plan for the sector - or do they each have one?
This is a very good discussion.
------------------------------- Dr. Sam Regee ZBI
null
This message bounced back yesterday - seems the listserver is having some constipation....
Brian
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Brian Munyao Longwe <blongwe@gmail.com> Date: Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 5:35 PM Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:) To: Liko Agosta <likoa@verviant.com> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Hi Liko,
Sorry, I was driving with one hand n texting with the other (usinistaki). Thus the v brief response. Pls so feel free to share your views with the rest of the list, we NEED to hear from practitioners! As mentioned, this discussion should help she'd some light on this relatively 'new' industry so that inner and outer stakeholders can develop a better understanding.
It would also be great to hear from the ICT Board (hint hint) - although they're probably a bit gun-shy right because they don't want to be flamed.
On your point regarding the CEO being 'seconded' to the USA for an extended period... Hmmm... Maybe not... BUT.... Your suggestion about high level representation makes sense. How about a full fledged office, maybe with Dep.CEO ranking.... Dunno...just thoughts....
Nway, please do share ur thoughts, ideas, suggestions, challenges, headaches, the lot!
Brian
Sent from my iPhone
On 03 Sep 2008, at 4:37 PM, "Liko Agosta" <likoa@verviant.com> wrote:
Brian
I don't mind taking a call from you to explain what has happened and where Kenya is and some ideas about the best way forward
Obviously, I will be looking at life from a providers point of view …
Also, which organization do you represent ?
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
<http://www.verviant.com>www.verviant.com
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: 9193891551@txt.att.net
*From:* kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [ mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+likoa= verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] *On Behalf Of *Gilda Odera *Sent:* Wednesday, September 03, 2008 4:16 AM *To:* Liko Agosta *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Hi Brian,
If you recall, initially the ICT Board was created mainly " to market Kenya as an outsourcing destination". I think many other things were lumped onto the board without putting structures in place ie. personnel and budgets.
On another note, I am surprised you are still asking about the role and obligations of KBPOCCS after the lengthy emails.
Maybe you should re-read them?:)
It is true there is more shouting from BPO players in KICTANET,media, everwhere..... maybe the others are content or indifferent....
That should not stop the BPO Sector from airing views or making demands. Remember your ISP days? You and some others in the ISP arena were very vocal and that impacted on various other sub-sectors who benefited.
I say, if there is an issue that needs attention, it needs to be known. I would suggest that the other sub-sectors also start shouting out their issues that they want to see being resolved. We are all inter-connected so any gains will benefit all others.
Can someone from the ICT Board please say something? Is it true you are being blamed by others for focusing too much on BPO and if so, how are you balancing the act?
Best
Gilda
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Brian Munyao Longwe <brian@caret.net>
*To:* Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke>
*Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 03, 2008 8:55 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Great input Lika. Seems like you have a real handle on this industry. If I may recap:
Clients (I presume these are international) gauge a BPO provider based on four main criteria:
a) Capability: This speaks to an area of skillset matching across industry
On 09/04/2008 "Brian Longwe" <blongwe@gmail.com> wrote: -
do we have enough "intel" on the necessary skillsets so that if someone wants to outsource their transcription of recorded audio court records or psychiatric interviews - the BPO operators personnel understand enough about the subject matter to capture the relevant language (don't know if this is a good example but it's what comes to mind)
b) Cost-cutting potential: If the customer is the one asking this question, then it seems that they expect the BPO operator to have alread studied to some extent their business, at` least enough to understand ways in which savings can be accrued.
c) Referenceable clients
If the CEO of the ICT board calls the CEO of ATT he is more likely to get a meeting and business as opposed to the CEO of Kamau Wanjala Outsourcers … again, I don't know what the ICT Board has been doing (am sure they have done a lot … may be like top secret strategy stuff) but in my opinion
CEO of that board should be based in US for like 90% of the year .. talk to clients, be a rain maker, schmooze, play golf and open doors.
This belies the assumptions and perceptions on which I initiated this thread. For some reason there seems to be some kind of implicit expectation that the ICT Board exists to servie the BPO industry - why is that? Kenya's ICT is definitely much more than just BPO (as Gilda clearly pointed out).
On this list we have heard a lot of complaints (largely from BPO
about the ICT Board's lack of support for the BPO industry, while on the other hand other sector players saying that the Board pays too much attention to BPO. What should the role and obligation of the board in
BPO sector be? Could it be strategic?
What can we say is the role of the BPO/CC Society and it's obligations (both to internal and external stakeholders) in the larger scheme of things?
Regards,
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 11:07 PM, Liko Agosta wrote:
All that you guys are talking about is good ... but when I talk to clients they ask the following questions
a. Can you do the job ?
b. How much will you save me ?
c. Have you done this for anyone else (especially in my sector/country) ?
d. Can I talk to references
1-3 page executive proposals work better than 50 page proposals. C level execs never go past page 3 of proposals. They really don't care where I am working from
Only 1 client asked about Kenyan copyright laws .. and our lawyer gave a sufficient answer... we got the work and have saved them over USD 500,000
About Safaricom and Land Registry and all this projects that keep breaking our hearts and hurting our feelings :) ....
Let's assume Safaricom is has 400 customer services reps .... would
be
an ideal client for any BPO in Kenya ? if they pay their employees 50k
month .. a BPO would have to charge them 100k per month FOR THE SAME EMPLOYEE across town.
Now, maybe I have all this wrong but there are more than 10000 companies in the developed world with over 400 "clerical employees" who they pay an average of 3000$ per month. If you went and targeted these companies .... you can get 100k per employee, pay the employee 50k etc and the client will be happy, you happy, employee happy ...
Many local clients take 60-90 days to pay invoices. In US for example, depending on state, it's illegal to hold a vendors payment when work has been done ….
My point ... BPOs, Software Providers have to be willing to ignore the local market and focus on external sources of business. The local market is too small, too complicated and the waters are very muddied.
About brokers and "consultants". I have been approached by quite a few. People who claim to have connections, venture capital and all that good stuff. I learnt early to say no… early. They are a waste of time in my book
Kenya will not become a better outsourcing destination if we come up with ethics guidelines, an act of parliament and the like … now, those will not hurt … but we will benefit more if the ICT Board flanked companies when they are pitching their services to potential clients.
By flanking I mean fly to meet the client, do research on financials, help with financing - have a conference in US and invite 100 potential and vetted clients to meet Kenyan providers …. This works like a charm here .. (if GOK spends 500k on tickets and 30 Kenyans are hired making 50k … - ROI is there pretty fast)
If the CEO of the ICT board calls the CEO of ATT he is more likely to get a meeting and business as opposed to the CEO of Kamau Wanjala Outsourcers … again, I don't know what the ICT Board has been doing (am sure they have done a lot … may be like top secret strategy stuff) but in my opinion
Hey and dont you think you are being too harsh on the society by comparing them with giant international BPO industries which definately have giant associations as well? I say give some credit to the Kenya BPO Society this far they have come. So instead of comparing them with big giants, look more into working with them into becoming a giant as well. Kenya BPO society is also private sector led, its only that the ICT Board takes much of the show (and we are not saying this is a bad thing) hence I think this ends up confusing industry players, and it always ends up looking like the industry is government driven, if you get my point. The government should be there just to support maybe in terms of funding society-organsised BPO events, which are beneficial to all industry players for instance in marketing the country as a BPO destination, etc. But what the government/ICT Board should not do is brand all BPO related shows to be government/ICT Board shows, as this is what makes it all look like the industry in Kenya is government/ICT Board-driven and govt/ICT Board dependant, in stead of being private sector-driven. the the tunnel in this BPO industry here in Kenya. As for ICT Board, I have not heard of any so far. I hope this has helped you gauge the phase we are at now in this new industry in Kenya. On a lighter note, what does the ZBI from you signature stand for? Regards, Justin that framework the the the the players) the they per the
CEO of that board should be based in US for like 90% of the year .. talk to clients, be a rain maker, schmooze, play golf and open doors.
I have always felt that the ICT Board should headhunt and hire people with C level experience from either US or UK … people from the bigger consulting companies Bain, BCG, Accenture, Avanade, EDS … these guys work on million dollar outsourcing deals and have very good contacts. They also would be able to come up with a strategy immediately
As Gilda has shown, the harvest is plentiful …
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
www.verviant.com
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: <9193891551@txt.att.net>9193891551@txt.att.net
-----Original Message-----
From: kictanet-bounces+likoa= <verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [<kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+likoa= verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of David Otwoma
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:45 AM
To: Liko Agosta
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Dear Brian,
Looks like you are fully re-charged after last weeks retreat in
Naivasha on Strategy. Tell us some more of what is not confidential.
Otherwise my wish is to take the baton from my able Chair and respond
on bullet 3 in your beautiful rejoinder.
As Chair of the Standards and Ethics Committee of the KBPOCCS we (are
7 members) did come up with Standards and Ethics Guidelines which took
over eight (8) months to prepare and on June 22nd 2008 the Permanent
Secretary of the Ministry of Information & Communication led us
(KBPOCCS members, KICTB who graciously sponsored the event at KICC,
CCK, CSK, members of the public who have an interest in BPO&CC pie)
into adopting the S&E Guidelines.
The next milestone we wish to aim for is have the Guidelines upgraded
into a Regulation or an Act of Parliament. Either achievement would be
binding to all and sundry who operate in the BPO&CC world. A world
which is moving the advancement of the human race from industrial age
into information age. Just imagine Kenya having a binding law on
Standards and a slice of the USD$310 Billion industry. It would make
our young people, because they are the future force in the knowledge
economy we keep talking about.
What are the next immediate steps. Cozy relations between the Private
Public Partnership.
Another bullet I will let you peer into what you have been seeing but
refuse to acknowledge is bullet No. 7. It was KPLC who introduced me
to the world of BPO&CC when they sought S. African expertise to deal
with their in-house contact centre better known to the general public
(read Brian et al) as Customer Care Centre or Customer Relations
Management. Ever wondered when power disappears at any time of the day
or night where that 'frustrated' call 'agrily demanding 'where is
power?' goes? Yes to a call center owned and managed
by KPLC. KPLC as of 2005 when we engaged had a call centre running
24/7 with 210 seats in Nairobi alone. Telecom has a bigger one.
Safaricom is soon overtaking Telecom with that news flash. Water
companies have. So do all the banks, insurance, etc. companies both
private and public owned.
Since we have very able Chairs for Training, Marketing etc. I will
stop there and go for my dear bottle.....tusker.
David
On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 6:12 PM, Brian Munyao Longwe < <brian@caret.net> brian@caret.net> wrote:
Excellent Feedback Gilda,
So I see a few very clear issues arising out of your response:
1) There is a distinct global opportunity - but that calls for
appropriate positioning as well as preparation on Kenya's part
2) Capacity issues need to be addressed - knowledge transfer could be
on way - but that implies finding someone who is willing to impart
the knowledge - do they come from inside or outside?
3) Global standards must be recognised and adhered to in order to
ensure entry and competitiveness - what are these standards are they
clearly documented somewhere?
4) Many local operations have not had the exposure necessary/needed
to develop expertise/efficiency/etc - what kind of interventions can
facilitate this?
5) BPO is not the "Holy Grail" as some perceive it, but one piece of
the ICT puzzle that needs to be solved in order to help Kenya attain
it's ambitious goal of becoming a global ICT hub
6) There is a distinct and precise training need for personnel to
supply the Kenyan BPO industry with "bodies to put on seats",
presumably to allow the BPO industry to harness and deliver against
the global opportunity - what interventions (planned or otherwise)
are we taking to meet this target? How accurate is this estimate and
can it be verified?
7) Local Players - your website (must say it's very cute) lists quite
a number (28) - but I must say that I'm quite surprised at some of
the names I find there - didn't know KPLC was offering BPO services
for example - but maybe I'm mistaken in my assumptions....
8) Local opportunities: seems many/most local companies are looking
outside to outsource certain functions or simply "self-provisioning"
- why would Safaricom claim that it's too expensive to outsource
locally based on the price estimates that they got from industry. Is
there a need for our local BPO industry to do some kind of soul
searching and find ways of making themselves/their services more
palatable to local companies?
9) The industry for some reason seems to have attracted brokers - who
are watering down/diluting the true opportunity - what kind of
interventions do we need to "eliminate the middleman" - a seemingly
consistent argument in many sector e.g. tea, coffee, flowers, tourism
etc.....
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 4:10 PM, Gilda Odera wrote:
Hi Brian,
You have raised very pertinent questions in your email below.
Let me answer your queries.
Firstly, it is true that BPO has taken centre stage in many
discussions surrounding Kenya's ICT development and growth and it
is a good thing, here's why:
We are looking at a USD$310 Billion industry by next year, up for
grabs for any destinations that get it right. India is currently
taking up 45% of the total share and China and Phillipines are
steadily growing. And what's more, it can only grow, with the fuel
prices soaring each year,what choice is there for the companies out
there to look for more affordable means of operating.
It is a fact that the western countries are looking for new
alternative destinations to Asia so they do not put all their eggs
in one basket, not with the terrorism threats all over. Where else
but Africa. Why would Kenya not put its house in order to take a
piece of this pie?
Now in regard to your comment on BPO taking centre stage in ICT
development, I would say one thing we need in this country is
opportunity for knowledge transfer done right here. We may produce
more technology oriented personnel but as long as we operate within
the Kenyan way of operating, we are not developing our personnel to
the global standards we want them to attain.Not because we are not
capable, but because many operations have not had the exposure.
I would beg to differ (and government can speak for itself) that we
are putting all eggs in one basket. BPO is but one sub-sector in
the ICT arena. Many other sub-sectors within the sector are quite
active. Software development is coming up and I keep reading
debates on KICTANET. There is an interest.
Content development is also being encouraged. The
telecommunications sector is busy preparing for real competition
and we the consumers can't wait for the benefits, they will have to
have great value adds and affordable pricing.
What steps are we taking to enhance BPO? I leave the ICT Board to
answer that although as Kenya BPO and Contact Centre Society, we
have presented to them the need to train not less than 10,000 per
year, specifically for this sector. Frost and Sullivan who are
normally 90% accurate in their new destination analysis says Kenya
will by 2012 have a BPO sector employing about 120,000 direct jobs
( you can add indirect by another 3-5) as long as the fibre optic
infrastructure is in place on time next year and marketing of the
country takes root.
Who are the players? Our members are on our website
<http://www.kenyabposociety.or.ke>www.kenyabposociety.or.ke . There are ofcourse others quietly
operating.
What are the local opportunities- Our biggest challenge is getting
local companies to outsource though some have started. We expected
the giants like Safaricom to play a role even if it is a CSR role
to demonstrate a level of confidence in the local companies. This
is possible, other companies work with those they outsource to for
a given period, and leave them running efficiently as they require.
All is not lost. Some local companies are outsourcing BPO work and
I wish to challenge Safaricom to outsource part of their BPO work
if they say local outsourcing is not competitive.
The international opportunities are the ones that I have mentioned
are worth $310 Billion. The ball is in our court as Kenyans to
market Kenya as a destination if we are to make any gains. We need
to attract direct clients and not the current brokers who are
exploiting the existing centres,much as their contracts are keeping
some of the centres going.
I hope I have addressed your queries.
Gilda Odera
Chair, Kenya BPO and Contact Centre Society
----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Munyao Longwe"
< <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net>
To: "Gilda Odera" < <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke>
Cc: "KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions" < < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:12 AM
Subject: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Hi All,
It is interesting that BPO seems to have taken a centre stage in many
discussions surrounding Kenya's ICT development and growth. While I
do believe that BPO/KPO has huge potential. I am a bit skeptical
about this "silver bullet" approach which might be akin to putting
all our eggs in one basket.
What if the basket gets stepped on by some giant like Malaysia, South
Africa or others?
I would be very interested in taking a much closer look at the BPO
industry in Kenya. Who are the players? What are the opportunities?
What is the potential for growth? What steps are we taking to enhance/
develop/increase capacity in BPO/KPO? What kind(s) of investments are
required to make this industry boom? What are the local opportunities
for BPO/KPO? What are the international opportunities for BPO/KPO?
I think that answers to these and many other questions will help
other like me who are a bit unclear in their minds as to how BPO will
be our saviour have a clearer view. It might also just show that BPO
is a contributing factor and not necessarily the holy grail that at
the moment seems to be the general perception.
Regards,
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 8:25 AM, David Otwoma wrote:
Dear All,
"Comments from BPO operators and of course other Stakeholders"
please.
Safaricom in Sh1bn customer care plan (see Daily Nation page 28)
-------------------------------------------------
Many companies have been turning to BPOs as the financial benefits of
outsourcing continue to make it compelling, with cost savings and
efficiency improvements being the dominant reasons companies use such
services. However, companies biggest concerns on outsourcing
relate to
data security.
-----------------------------------------------------
The move, seen a precautionary measure in the face of growing
competition, marks a complete turnaround by the mobile provider which
in July last year had sought quotations from local Business Process
Outsourcing (BPO) firms.
"Outsourcing the customer care function proved to be too expensive
for
the kind of quality that we required. We will just have to run the
service in-house," said Safaricom chief executive Michael Joseph.
<http://www.nation.co.ke/business/news/-/1006/466372/-/jiyt3xz/-/> http://www.nation.co.ke/business/news/-/1006/466372/-/jiyt3xz/-/
index.html
On Mon, Sep 1, 2008 at 8:58 PM, Sean Moroney
< <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com> wrote:
Dear Liko,
We would like to invite you to make a presentation at the
forthcoming
Outsourcing & Contact Centre Conference, which we will be holding
over 4-5
November under the auspices of the Ministry of Information &
Communications
and in partnership with the ICT Board. The programme of confirmed
presentations so far is attached.
It would be great if you would be willing to share your experience
with the
other participants.
Yours sincerely,
Sean Moroney
Chairman
AITEC Africa
<seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com
UK Tel: +44(0)1480-880774
UK Fax: +44(0)1480-880765
UK Mobile: +44(0)7973-499224
Kenya Mobile: +254(0)721-845674
Mozambique Mobile: +258-82-6181618
Nigeria Mobile: +234(0)802-0571766
SA Mobile: +27(0)724-577887
Skype: seanmoroney
Please visit our discussion group on The Banking Technology sector
in Africa
at: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/africanbankingtech> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/africanbankingtech
AITEC Africa is the trading name of AITEC Conferences Limited
UK Company registration number: 4698475
________________________________
From: kictanet-bounces+seanm= <aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
[ <kictanet-bounces>mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>
+seanm= <aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On
Behalf Of Peres Were
Sent: 01 September 2008 12:23
To: <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com
Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions'
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Stakeholder Queries:
Liko,
It would be great to hear from you and others, your insights into
sales and
marketing insights that can benefit the BPO, KPO sector. We can
continue the
discussion off the list.
Kind regards
Peres Were
________________________________
From: kictanet-bounces+pwere= <cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
[ <kictanet-bounces+pwere=cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+pwere= cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke]
On Behalf
Of Liko Agosta
Sent: 01 September 2008 10:33
To: <pwere@cascadegl.com>pwere@cascadegl.com
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Stakeholder Queries:
About ICT Board and all these Boards …
Do they ever have open sessions where stakeholders can review
strategy,
advice, brainstorm ?
As CEO of verviant, I have been able to get business … I feel like
I have
insights into the sales and marketing process that can benefit other
software/ICT providers …
Thanks
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: <9193891551@txt.att.net>9193891551@txt.att.net
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Brian Longwe < <blongwe@gmail.com>blongwe@gmail.com>
Date: Aug 29, 2008 9:31 AM
Subject: Re: [kictanet] ICT Board Strategy a Farce
To: <wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk>wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk
Very strong language - but I think you should relax as your
concerns are
unfounded.
I am at the Strategic retreat. Unfortunately Gilda Odera -
Chairperson of
BPO, who was supposed to be present had to cancel at the last
minute.
Brian
On 8/29/08, Wambui Wakarema < <wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk> wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
I have read with surprise the Kictanet mailout from the ICT Board
claiming
they are going for a stakeholders strategy workshop in Naivasha.
Who are these stakeholders? Are there any representing the BPO
sector?? I
ask this because I have contacted the industry association and
they dont
seem
to be in the know either. This is quite bizarre, especially since
BPO is a
key sector of the ICT Board's mandate.
Who are the stakeholders from the other ICT sectors? Shouldnt the
Board be
getting input from key stakeholders at this workshop.
They are wasting government resources going to write strategies
and then
'presenting' to stakeholders, yet stakeholders should have been
involved
from the word go.
The
--
David Otwoma,
Chief Science Secretary,
National Council for Science and Technology,
Utalii House 9th Floor,
Mobile tel: +254 722 141771,
Office tel: +254 (0)20 2346915,
P. O. Box 29899 - 00100, Nairobi, Kenya
email: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com & <otwoma@ncst.go.ke> otwoma@ncst.go.ke
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/
mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/
mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40sky <http://web.co.ke>web.co.ke
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com
Unsubscribe or change your options at < http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/otwomad%40gmail.com> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/otwomad%40gmail.com
--
David Otwoma,
Chief Science Secretary,
National Council for Science and Technology,
Utalii House 9th Floor,
Mobile tel: +254 722 141771,
Office tel: +254 (0)20 2346915,
P. O. Box 29899 - 00100, Nairobi, Kenya
email: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com & <otwoma@ncst.go.ke> otwoma@ncst.go.ke
www.ncst.go.ke
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <likoa@verviant.com>likoa@verviant.com
Unsubscribe or change your options at < http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/likoa%40verviant.com
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/likoa%40verviant.com
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net
------------------------------
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke Unsubscribe or change your options at <
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40skyweb.co.ke
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40skyweb.co.ke
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <blongwe@gmail.com>blongwe@gmail.com Unsubscribe or change your options at <
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/blongwe%40gmail.com>
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/blongwe%40gmail.com
-- Brian Munyao Longwe e-mail: blongwe@gmail.com cell: + 254 722 518 744 blog : http://zinjlog.blogspot.com meta-blog: http://mashilingi.blogspot.com
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: lmwatibo.ktd@gmail.com Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/lmwatibo.ktd%40gmail.co...
Justin It is good to hear that you are investing in the BPO Sector. We believe that this sector will grow to become a strong revenue generator, and result in job creation and economic growth. It is true that Society was unable to participate at the Zaragoza, Spain event, due to lack of funding. However, we were able to send our members marketing materials over to Spain, and these were distributed at the event, by the Export Promotion Council. Some of these materials are with the Zaragoza Chamber of Commerce and members may get direct contact from potential clients who are referred to them by the Chamber of Commerce. I must point out, here that this was just but one event in our calendar. I cannot speak for the ICT Board, however, I do wish to point out their involvement and support in some of our marketing activities. Currently, BPO Society, is working closely with the ICT Board towards our participation at Call Centre Expo, Birmingham. Call Centre Expo is the biggest show for the call centre industry worldwide. This is going to be held on 16th and 17th September, in Birmingham UK. This is one of the events which we suggested to the ICT Board, as critical for Kenya to participate in, and they did take on board our suggestion. As a result, Kenya will have a stand at this show, funded by the ICT Board. There will also be two side events. One where Kenya will host senior executives from the UK Contact Centre industry to give them Kenya’s value proposition as an outsourcing destination, and the other where we will host Kenyans in the Diaspora who are looking for investment opportunities in the BPO Sector back in Kenya. Again, these are being facilitated and funded by the ICT Board. Last year we exhibited at the Outsource World Expo in New York, which was funded by the Ministry of Information and Communications and the ICT Board. We are working together towards other marketing activities. This notwithstanding, the BPO Society, currently is working hard to raise its own funds to support its various activities, of which marketing is a key priority. Kind regards Peres Were Vice Chair – Marketing _____ From: kictanet-bounces+pwere=cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+pwere=cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of Justin Mburu Sent: 04 September 2008 22:19 To: pwere@cascadegl.com Cc: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:) Good day All, This interesting subject on BPO rather caught my attention intensely I must say :-) I have just come from the UK a couple of months back and look to setup a contact center locally, now that the industry has begun to pick up amid the hiccups here and there. And to pick up on some of Sam Regee's points as outlined below, i will also tend to share my findings as well: (My comments are in blue font in commenting to Sam Regee's comments)
1. That much of the BPO sector has been set up in an uncompetitive framework that cannot be sustained. Businesses (for this is what they are) have been set up while factoring heavily the potential government subsidy. --- I have a friend of mine who set up here on Kenya long before the subsidy was in place, and so therefore you cannot base your claims on a few vendors who set up in a rush for the subsidy only to close shop when they realized that the bandwidth wasnt forth-coming at all.Meaning they got in the industry on a wrong foot. There are several which are still operating and have been on since even before the subsidy issue.
2. That the private sector players in the industry are too dependent on government (through the Kenya ICT Board) for marketing and business. Essentially there is too much government in the business of outsourcing here - not from a legislative perspective but from an operational perspective
This is clearly untenable because, having glanced at the Kenya ICT Board's strategy as articulated by its officials severally, their mandate goes much further than BPO - as at the time they were set up, that is. For sure, I perceive them as a marketing organization but marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.---- Sam if you look clearly, you will realise private sector are not that dependent on government/ICT Board at all. Have you even walked around the existing centers and seen how developed most are? Did government/ICT Board help them get to the levels of development they are in? I think not. If I were you I would visit existing centers first before I leap to claiming the private sector are dependant on government/ICT Board. Or maybe you can shade some light for us on what exactly you mean by ' too dependent' :-) and also it is obvious government has to be involved because if you have been keen on what has been going on since you arrived in the country, you will realise BPO is one of the 5 pillars of the set Vision 2030 which is a government initiative. So whether we like it or not, government has a major role to play in ensuring this industry picks up here in Kenya.
On the note of ICT Board's role in marketing, if you have been keen on all organised BPO/Contact Center events, ICT Board itself has always put itself on the frontline in this events, meaning they themselves are the ones focusing too much on the BPO/Contact center industry and putting so much energy on it, (which is a good thing anyway) , while there are so many ICT things to market on. So I agree with you that ICT Board should focus on marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.
3. That the private sector umbrella body, the Kenya BPO Society - and I have read the discussions by the chairman of the Society here - seems to not articulate well its programmes (at least to my understanding) what they are about overally.---- From my point, the chairman of the society clearly laid out who they are overally, and what they do. And for such a young society, I say kudos to where they are now. You can visit their offices and I am sure they will be more than glad to tell you on a one-on-one basis what they are all about. For all I know, they are doing a great job, and I wish them all the best as they continue to drwa the industry to high depths. Just to give you a bit of what they have achieved so far, so that you can apprecaiate they are on the right direction, they recently launched the Standards & Ethics guidelines for the industry, which I say is a very brilliant step, considering how young the industry is here in Kenya. So it is with such laid guidelines that the BPO industry in Kenya will be able to be laid in a firm solid foundation that is based on international operation standards in BPO & Contact Center industy.
If I were to turn to the BPO Services Association Unlimited ( http://www.bsau.org/), I can see a marketing campaign and a marketing position that they have taken. This came from the outsourcing private sector - and some of their programmes have support from the Phillipino government but the drive is from the private sector. If I look at NASSCOM, I can see that they are private sector led and their main purpose is the promotion of India as the leader in BPO services globally. In fact, they start by saying that they are a global organization - which is a position of strength.
Has the BPO Society attained such a level of pedigree - which starts in the mind with strategy - that would enable them to lead the sector to prosperity? I have not heard it in their discussions at the few events where I have had a chance to listen to the Chairperson and other officials of the society.-----My friend, it seems you have really been behind the screens with the society updates. Next week they will be launching their 3 year marketing strategy plan. This is indeed another brilliant step they will have taken as young an association as they are.From one of their forums, I remember them mentioning that one of their strategies is to join hands with several associations globally. This shows great initiative in making sure the industry gets recognized globaly through such relations. It rather unfortunate that the society did not get to participate at the EXPO ZARAGORA 2008 Spain event which from my research had many international associations attending the event such that it could have been an ideal place to network and form relations with the other international associations. I hear the society was to participate but they got a critical hiccup at the last minute (maybe the society chairman can fill us in on what exactly happened for them to miss such a crucial beneficial event). But I hear the CEO of ICT Board Mr Paul Kukubo and a local call center director,attended the event, maybe they can shed more light for us (if they are in the mailing list) what exactly went on in the Spain event and if they managed to secure any opportunities from the event. It is at such events that the society looks to the government support in ensuring they and also some industry players get to attend such events as Kenyan political figures were also present at the event as well as government officials. Such is where much lobbying can take place and the society can lobby their way to getting in beneficial relations with other international associations as well us get prospective clienst for industry players at some point.
Hey and dont you think you are being too harsh on the society by comparing them with giant international BPO industries which definately have giant associations as well? I say give some credit to the Kenya BPO Society this far they have come. So instead of comparing them with big giants, look more into working with them into becoming a giant as well. Kenya BPO society is also private sector led, its only that the ICT Board takes much of the show (and we are not saying this is a bad thing) hence I think this ends up confusing industry players, and it always ends up looking like the industry is government driven, if you get my point. The government should be there just to support maybe in terms of funding society-organsised BPO events, which are beneficial to all industry players for instance in marketing the country as a BPO destination, etc. But what the government/ICT Board should not do is brand all BPO related shows to be government/ICT Board shows, as this is what makes it all look like the industry in Kenya is government/ICT Board-driven and govt/ICT Board dependant, in stead of being private sector-driven.
c) Has the BPO Society (or the Kenya ICT Board since they are so much in the thick of things here) done a comprehensive marketing plan for the sector - or do they each have one? ---- For all I know, I hear the Kenya BPO society has a marketing strategy which they are launching some time next week. Maybe you should find our more details about it from the society itself, so that you can be able to attend and maybe you will get your answers there. I will be attending, and would really like to meet you there Sam Regee so that we can chit chat about this industry in a more comprehensive way. What do you say? I sure hope to see you there. I never miss society events as they give me hope that there is a light at the end of the tunnel in this BPO industry here in Kenya.
As for ICT Board, I have not heard of any so far. I hope this has helped you gauge the phase we are at now in this new industry in Kenya. On a lighter note, what does the ZBI from you signature stand for? Regards, Justin
Hi all,
As a recently returned (to Kenya) academic and entrepreneur, with an interest in the BPO sector - explicitly: I want to set up a legal transcription facility here. As I go about my research, I have been to see one or two operations, while I was in my previous engagement a few months ago and I am saddened to note that quite a number of the BPO operations that were in existence a few months ago are no more.
having spoken to a few people in the industry, I am led to form some preliminary conclusions (which I hope to validate here): I apologise in advance, if I offend, but it is in a positive spirit, that I advance these thoughts here.
1. That much of the BPO sector has been set up in an uncompetitive framework that cannot be sustained. Businesses (for this is what they are) have been set up while factoring heavily the potential government subsidy.
2. That the private sector players in the industry are too dependent on government (through the Kenya ICT Board) for marketing and business. Essentially there is too much government in the business of outsourcing here - not from a legislative perspective but from an operational perspective.
This is clearly untenable because, having glanced at the Kenya ICT Board's strategy as articulated by its officials severally, their mandate goes much further than BPO - as at the time they were set up, that is. For sure, I perceive them as a marketing organization but marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.
3. That the private sector umbrella body, the Kenya BPO Society - and I have read the discussions by the chairman of the Society here - seems to not articulate well its programmes (at least to my understanding) what they are about overally.
If I were to turn to the BPO Services Association Unlimited ( http://www.bsau.org/), I can see a marketing campaign and a marketing position that they have taken. This came from the outsourcing private sector - and some of their programmes have support from the Phillipino government but the drive is from the private sector. If I look at NASSCOM, I can see that they are private sector led and their main purpose is the promotion of India as the leader in BPO services globally. In fact, they start by saying that they are a global organization - which is a position of strength.
Has the BPO Society attained such a level of pedigree - which starts in the mind with strategy - that would enable them to lead the sector to prosperity? I have not heard it in their discussions at the few events where I have had a chance to listen to the Chairperson and other officials of the society.
These are preliminary thoughts that I have developed and I would be happy to see them examined and torn apart and validated as the case may be.
meanwhile, some pointed questions:
a) Is there any science to a slice of the $310 Billion opportunity presented by the society? This is to ask, how many seats would we need to have to have a 1% slice of the opportunity?
b) How many BPO operators are there now - and more pointedly - how many are actually functional?
c) Has the BPO Society (or the Kenya ICT Board since they are so much in the thick of things here) done a comprehensive marketing plan for the sector - or do they each have one?
This is a very good discussion.
------------------------------- Dr. Sam Regee ZBI
null
This message bounced back yesterday - seems the listserver is having some constipation....
Brian
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Brian Munyao Longwe <blongwe@gmail.com> Date: Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 5:35 PM Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:) To: Liko Agosta <likoa@verviant.com> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Hi Liko,
Sorry, I was driving with one hand n texting with the other (usinistaki). Thus the v brief response. Pls so feel free to share your views with the rest of the list, we NEED to hear from practitioners! As mentioned, this discussion should help she'd some light on this relatively 'new' industry so that inner and outer stakeholders can develop a better understanding.
It would also be great to hear from the ICT Board (hint hint) - although they're probably a bit gun-shy right because they don't want to be flamed.
On your point regarding the CEO being 'seconded' to the USA for an extended period... Hmmm... Maybe not... BUT.... Your suggestion about high level representation makes sense. How about a full fledged office, maybe with Dep.CEO ranking.... Dunno...just thoughts....
Nway, please do share ur thoughts, ideas, suggestions, challenges, headaches, the lot!
Brian
Sent from my iPhone
On 03 Sep 2008, at 4:37 PM, "Liko Agosta" <likoa@verviant.com> wrote:
Brian
I don't mind taking a call from you to explain what has happened and where Kenya is and some ideas about the best way forward
Obviously, I will be looking at life from a providers point of view …
Also, which organization do you represent ?
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
<http://www.verviant.com <http://www.verviant.com/> >www.verviant.com <http://www.verviant.com/>
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: 9193891551@txt.att.net
*From:* kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com <http://verviant.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> [ mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+likoa= verviant.com <http://verviant.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> ] *On Behalf Of *Gilda Odera *Sent:* Wednesday, September 03, 2008 4:16 AM *To:* Liko Agosta *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Hi Brian,
If you recall, initially the ICT Board was created mainly " to market Kenya as an outsourcing destination". I think many other things were lumped onto the board without putting structures in place ie. personnel and budgets.
On another note, I am surprised you are still asking about the role and obligations of KBPOCCS after the lengthy emails.
Maybe you should re-read them?:)
It is true there is more shouting from BPO players in KICTANET,media, everwhere..... maybe the others are content or indifferent....
That should not stop the BPO Sector from airing views or making demands. Remember your ISP days? You and some others in the ISP arena were very vocal and that impacted on various other sub-sectors who benefited.
I say, if there is an issue that needs attention, it needs to be known. I would suggest that the other sub-sectors also start shouting out their issues that they want to see being resolved. We are all inter-connected so any gains will benefit all others.
Can someone from the ICT Board please say something? Is it true you are being blamed by others for focusing too much on BPO and if so, how are you balancing the act?
Best
Gilda
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Brian Munyao Longwe <brian@caret.net>
*To:* Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke>
*Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 03, 2008 8:55 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Great input Lika. Seems like you have a real handle on this industry. If I may recap:
Clients (I presume these are international) gauge a BPO provider based on four main criteria:
a) Capability: This speaks to an area of skillset matching across industry
do we have enough "intel" on the necessary skillsets so that if someone wants to outsource their transcription of recorded audio court records or psychiatric interviews - the BPO operators personnel understand enough about the subject matter to capture the relevant language (don't know if this is a good example but it's what comes to mind)
b) Cost-cutting potential: If the customer is the one asking this question, then it seems that they expect the BPO operator to have alread studied to some extent their business, at` least enough to understand ways in which savings can be accrued.
c) Referenceable clients
If the CEO of the ICT board calls the CEO of ATT he is more likely to get a meeting and business as opposed to the CEO of Kamau Wanjala Outsourcers … again, I don't know what the ICT Board has been doing (am sure they have done a lot … may be like top secret strategy stuff) but in my opinion the CEO of that board should be based in US for like 90% of the year .. talk to clients, be a rain maker, schmooze, play golf and open doors.
This belies the assumptions and perceptions on which I initiated this thread. For some reason there seems to be some kind of implicit expectation that the ICT Board exists to servie the BPO industry - why is that? Kenya's ICT is definitely much more than just BPO (as Gilda clearly pointed out).
On this list we have heard a lot of complaints (largely from BPO players) about the ICT Board's lack of support for the BPO industry, while on the other hand other sector players saying that the Board pays too much attention to BPO. What should the role and obligation of the board in the BPO sector be? Could it be strategic?
What can we say is the role of the BPO/CC Society and it's obligations (both to internal and external stakeholders) in the larger scheme of things?
Regards,
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 11:07 PM, Liko Agosta wrote:
All that you guys are talking about is good ... but when I talk to clients they ask the following questions
a. Can you do the job ?
b. How much will you save me ?
c. Have you done this for anyone else (especially in my sector/country) ?
d. Can I talk to references
1-3 page executive proposals work better than 50 page proposals. C level execs never go past page 3 of proposals. They really don't care where I am working from
Only 1 client asked about Kenyan copyright laws .. and our lawyer gave a sufficient answer... we got the work and have saved them over USD 500,000
About Safaricom and Land Registry and all this projects that keep breaking our hearts and hurting our feelings :) ....
Let's assume Safaricom is has 400 customer services reps .... would they be an ideal client for any BPO in Kenya ? if they pay their employees 50k per month .. a BPO would have to charge them 100k per month FOR THE SAME EMPLOYEE across town.
Now, maybe I have all this wrong but there are more than 10000 companies in the developed world with over 400 "clerical employees" who they pay an average of 3000$ per month. If you went and targeted these companies .... you can get 100k per employee, pay the employee 50k etc and the client will be happy, you happy, employee happy ...
Many local clients take 60-90 days to pay invoices. In US for example, depending on state, it's illegal to hold a vendors payment when work has been done ….
My point ... BPOs, Software Providers have to be willing to ignore the local market and focus on external sources of business. The local market is too small, too complicated and the waters are very muddied.
About brokers and "consultants". I have been approached by quite a few. People who claim to have connections, venture capital and all that good stuff. I learnt early to say no… early. They are a waste of time in my book
Kenya will not become a better outsourcing destination if we come up with ethics guidelines, an act of parliament and the like … now, those will not hurt … but we will benefit more if the ICT Board flanked companies when
are pitching their services to potential clients.
By flanking I mean fly to meet the client, do research on financials, help with financing - have a conference in US and invite 100 potential and vetted clients to meet Kenyan providers …. This works like a charm here .. (if GOK spends 500k on tickets and 30 Kenyans are hired making 50k … - ROI is
On 09/04/2008 "Brian Longwe" <blongwe@gmail.com> wrote: - they there
pretty fast)
If the CEO of the ICT board calls the CEO of ATT he is more likely to get a meeting and business as opposed to the CEO of Kamau Wanjala Outsourcers … again, I don't know what the ICT Board has been doing (am sure they have done a lot … may be like top secret strategy stuff) but in my opinion the CEO of that board should be based in US for like 90% of the year .. talk to clients, be a rain maker, schmooze, play golf and open doors.
I have always felt that the ICT Board should headhunt and hire people with C level experience from either US or UK … people from the bigger consulting companies Bain, BCG, Accenture, Avanade, EDS … these guys work on million dollar outsourcing deals and have very good contacts. They also would be able to come up with a strategy immediately
As Gilda has shown, the harvest is plentiful …
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
www.verviant.com <http://www.verviant.com/>
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: <9193891551@txt.att.net>9193891551@txt.att.net
-----Original Message-----
From: kictanet-bounces+likoa= <verviant.com <http://verviant.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> > verviant.com <http://verviant.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> [<kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com <http://verviant.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> > mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+likoa= verviant.com <http://verviant.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> ] On Behalf Of David Otwoma
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:45 AM
To: Liko Agosta
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Dear Brian,
Looks like you are fully re-charged after last weeks retreat in
Naivasha on Strategy. Tell us some more of what is not confidential.
Otherwise my wish is to take the baton from my able Chair and respond
on bullet 3 in your beautiful rejoinder.
As Chair of the Standards and Ethics Committee of the KBPOCCS we (are
7 members) did come up with Standards and Ethics Guidelines which took
over eight (8) months to prepare and on June 22nd 2008 the Permanent
Secretary of the Ministry of Information & Communication led us
(KBPOCCS members, KICTB who graciously sponsored the event at KICC,
CCK, CSK, members of the public who have an interest in BPO&CC pie)
into adopting the S&E Guidelines.
The next milestone we wish to aim for is have the Guidelines upgraded
into a Regulation or an Act of Parliament. Either achievement would be
binding to all and sundry who operate in the BPO&CC world. A world
which is moving the advancement of the human race from industrial age
into information age. Just imagine Kenya having a binding law on
Standards and a slice of the USD$310 Billion industry. It would make
our young people, because they are the future force in the knowledge
economy we keep talking about.
What are the next immediate steps. Cozy relations between the Private
Public Partnership.
Another bullet I will let you peer into what you have been seeing but
refuse to acknowledge is bullet No. 7. It was KPLC who introduced me
to the world of BPO&CC when they sought S. African expertise to deal
with their in-house contact centre better known to the general public
(read Brian et al) as Customer Care Centre or Customer Relations
Management. Ever wondered when power disappears at any time of the day
or night where that 'frustrated' call 'agrily demanding 'where is
power?' goes? Yes to a call center owned and managed
by KPLC. KPLC as of 2005 when we engaged had a call centre running
24/7 with 210 seats in Nairobi alone. Telecom has a bigger one.
Safaricom is soon overtaking Telecom with that news flash. Water
companies have. So do all the banks, insurance, etc. companies both
private and public owned.
Since we have very able Chairs for Training, Marketing etc. I will
stop there and go for my dear bottle.....tusker.
David
On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 6:12 PM, Brian Munyao Longwe < <brian@caret.net> brian@caret.net> wrote:
Excellent Feedback Gilda,
So I see a few very clear issues arising out of your response:
1) There is a distinct global opportunity - but that calls for
appropriate positioning as well as preparation on Kenya's part
2) Capacity issues need to be addressed - knowledge transfer could be
on way - but that implies finding someone who is willing to impart
the knowledge - do they come from inside or outside?
3) Global standards must be recognised and adhered to in order to
ensure entry and competitiveness - what are these standards are they
clearly documented somewhere?
4) Many local operations have not had the exposure necessary/needed
to develop expertise/efficiency/etc - what kind of interventions can
facilitate this?
5) BPO is not the "Holy Grail" as some perceive it, but one piece of
the ICT puzzle that needs to be solved in order to help Kenya attain
it's ambitious goal of becoming a global ICT hub
6) There is a distinct and precise training need for personnel to
supply the Kenyan BPO industry with "bodies to put on seats",
presumably to allow the BPO industry to harness and deliver against
the global opportunity - what interventions (planned or otherwise)
are we taking to meet this target? How accurate is this estimate and
can it be verified?
7) Local Players - your website (must say it's very cute) lists quite
a number (28) - but I must say that I'm quite surprised at some of
the names I find there - didn't know KPLC was offering BPO services
for example - but maybe I'm mistaken in my assumptions....
8) Local opportunities: seems many/most local companies are looking
outside to outsource certain functions or simply "self-provisioning"
- why would Safaricom claim that it's too expensive to outsource
locally based on the price estimates that they got from industry. Is
there a need for our local BPO industry to do some kind of soul
searching and find ways of making themselves/their services more
palatable to local companies?
9) The industry for some reason seems to have attracted brokers - who
are watering down/diluting the true opportunity - what kind of
interventions do we need to "eliminate the middleman" - a seemingly
consistent argument in many sector e.g. tea, coffee, flowers, tourism
etc.....
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 4:10 PM, Gilda Odera wrote:
Hi Brian,
You have raised very pertinent questions in your email below.
Let me answer your queries.
Firstly, it is true that BPO has taken centre stage in many
discussions surrounding Kenya's ICT development and growth and it
is a good thing, here's why:
We are looking at a USD$310 Billion industry by next year, up for
grabs for any destinations that get it right. India is currently
taking up 45% of the total share and China and Phillipines are
steadily growing. And what's more, it can only grow, with the fuel
prices soaring each year,what choice is there for the companies out
there to look for more affordable means of operating.
It is a fact that the western countries are looking for new
alternative destinations to Asia so they do not put all their eggs
in one basket, not with the terrorism threats all over. Where else
but Africa. Why would Kenya not put its house in order to take a
piece of this pie?
Now in regard to your comment on BPO taking centre stage in ICT
development, I would say one thing we need in this country is
opportunity for knowledge transfer done right here. We may produce
more technology oriented personnel but as long as we operate within
the Kenyan way of operating, we are not developing our personnel to
the global standards we want them to attain.Not because we are not
capable, but because many operations have not had the exposure.
I would beg to differ (and government can speak for itself) that we
are putting all eggs in one basket. BPO is but one sub-sector in
the ICT arena. Many other sub-sectors within the sector are quite
active. Software development is coming up and I keep reading
debates on KICTANET. There is an interest.
Content development is also being encouraged. The
telecommunications sector is busy preparing for real competition
and we the consumers can't wait for the benefits, they will have to
have great value adds and affordable pricing.
What steps are we taking to enhance BPO? I leave the ICT Board to
answer that although as Kenya BPO and Contact Centre Society, we
have presented to them the need to train not less than 10,000 per
year, specifically for this sector. Frost and Sullivan who are
normally 90% accurate in their new destination analysis says Kenya
will by 2012 have a BPO sector employing about 120,000 direct jobs
( you can add indirect by another 3-5) as long as the fibre optic
infrastructure is in place on time next year and marketing of the
country takes root.
Who are the players? Our members are on our website
<http://www.kenyabposociety.or.ke <http://www.kenyabposociety.or.ke/> >www.kenyabposociety.or.ke <http://www.kenyabposociety.or.ke/> . There are ofcourse others quietly
operating.
What are the local opportunities- Our biggest challenge is getting
local companies to outsource though some have started. We expected
the giants like Safaricom to play a role even if it is a CSR role
to demonstrate a level of confidence in the local companies. This
is possible, other companies work with those they outsource to for
a given period, and leave them running efficiently as they require.
All is not lost. Some local companies are outsourcing BPO work and
I wish to challenge Safaricom to outsource part of their BPO work
if they say local outsourcing is not competitive.
The international opportunities are the ones that I have mentioned
are worth $310 Billion. The ball is in our court as Kenyans to
market Kenya as a destination if we are to make any gains. We need
to attract direct clients and not the current brokers who are
exploiting the existing centres,much as their contracts are keeping
some of the centres going.
I hope I have addressed your queries.
Gilda Odera
Chair, Kenya BPO and Contact Centre Society
----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Munyao Longwe"
< <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net>
To: "Gilda Odera" < <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke>
Cc: "KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions" < <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:12 AM
Subject: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Hi All,
It is interesting that BPO seems to have taken a centre stage in many
discussions surrounding Kenya's ICT development and growth. While I
do believe that BPO/KPO has huge potential. I am a bit skeptical
about this "silver bullet" approach which might be akin to putting
all our eggs in one basket.
What if the basket gets stepped on by some giant like Malaysia, South
Africa or others?
I would be very interested in taking a much closer look at the BPO
industry in Kenya. Who are the players? What are the opportunities?
What is the potential for growth? What steps are we taking to enhance/
develop/increase capacity in BPO/KPO? What kind(s) of investments are
required to make this industry boom? What are the local opportunities
for BPO/KPO? What are the international opportunities for BPO/KPO?
I think that answers to these and many other questions will help
other like me who are a bit unclear in their minds as to how BPO will
be our saviour have a clearer view. It might also just show that BPO
is a contributing factor and not necessarily the holy grail that at
the moment seems to be the general perception.
Regards,
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 8:25 AM, David Otwoma wrote:
Dear All,
"Comments from BPO operators and of course other Stakeholders"
please.
Safaricom in Sh1bn customer care plan (see Daily Nation page 28)
-------------------------------------------------
Many companies have been turning to BPOs as the financial benefits of
outsourcing continue to make it compelling, with cost savings and
efficiency improvements being the dominant reasons companies use such
services. However, companies biggest concerns on outsourcing
relate to
data security.
-----------------------------------------------------
The move, seen a precautionary measure in the face of growing
competition, marks a complete turnaround by the mobile provider which
in July last year had sought quotations from local Business Process
Outsourcing (BPO) firms.
"Outsourcing the customer care function proved to be too expensive
for
the kind of quality that we required. We will just have to run the
service in-house," said Safaricom chief executive Michael Joseph.
<http://www.nation.co.ke/business/news/-/1006/466372/-/jiyt3xz/-/> http://www.nation.co.ke/business/news/-/1006/466372/-/jiyt3xz/-/
index.html
On Mon, Sep 1, 2008 at 8:58 PM, Sean Moroney
< <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com> wrote:
Dear Liko,
We would like to invite you to make a presentation at the
forthcoming
Outsourcing & Contact Centre Conference, which we will be holding
over 4-5
November under the auspices of the Ministry of Information &
Communications
and in partnership with the ICT Board. The programme of confirmed
presentations so far is attached.
It would be great if you would be willing to share your experience
with the
other participants.
Yours sincerely,
Sean Moroney
Chairman
AITEC Africa
<seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com
UK Tel: +44(0)1480-880774
UK Fax: +44(0)1480-880765
UK Mobile: +44(0)7973-499224
Kenya Mobile: +254(0)721-845674
Mozambique Mobile: +258-82-6181618
Nigeria Mobile: +234(0)802-0571766
SA Mobile: +27(0)724-577887
Skype: seanmoroney
<http://www.aitecafrica.com <http://www.aitecafrica.com/> >www.aitecafrica.com <http://www.aitecafrica.com/>
Please visit our discussion group on The Banking Technology sector
in Africa
at: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/africanbankingtech> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/africanbankingtech
AITEC Africa is the trading name of AITEC Conferences Limited
UK Company registration number: 4698475
________________________________
From: kictanet-bounces+seanm= <aitecafrica.com <http://aitecafrica.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> > aitecafrica.com <http://aitecafrica.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/>
[ <kictanet-bounces>mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>
+seanm= <aitecafrica.com <http://aitecafrica.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> > aitecafrica.com <http://aitecafrica.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> ] On
Behalf Of Peres Were
Sent: 01 September 2008 12:23
To: <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com
Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions'
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Stakeholder Queries:
Liko,
It would be great to hear from you and others, your insights into
sales and
marketing insights that can benefit the BPO, KPO sector. We can
continue the
discussion off the list.
Kind regards
Peres Were
________________________________
From: kictanet-bounces+pwere= <cascadegl.com <http://cascadegl.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> > cascadegl.com <http://cascadegl.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/>
[ <kictanet-bounces+pwere=cascadegl.com <http://cascadegl.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> > mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+pwere= cascadegl.com <http://cascadegl.com/> @lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> ]
On Behalf
Of Liko Agosta
Sent: 01 September 2008 10:33
To: <pwere@cascadegl.com>pwere@cascadegl.com
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Stakeholder Queries:
About ICT Board and all these Boards …
Do they ever have open sessions where stakeholders can review
strategy,
advice, brainstorm ?
As CEO of verviant, I have been able to get business … I feel like
I have
insights into the sales and marketing process that can benefit other
software/ICT providers …
Thanks
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
<http://www.verviant.com <http://www.verviant.com/> >www.verviant.com <http://www.verviant.com/>
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: <9193891551@txt.att.net>9193891551@txt.att.net
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Brian Longwe < <blongwe@gmail.com>blongwe@gmail.com>
Date: Aug 29, 2008 9:31 AM
Subject: Re: [kictanet] ICT Board Strategy a Farce
To: <wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk>wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk
Very strong language - but I think you should relax as your
concerns are
unfounded.
I am at the Strategic retreat. Unfortunately Gilda Odera -
Chairperson of
BPO, who was supposed to be present had to cancel at the last
minute.
Brian
On 8/29/08, Wambui Wakarema < <wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk> wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
I have read with surprise the Kictanet mailout from the ICT Board
claiming
they are going for a stakeholders strategy workshop in Naivasha.
Who are these stakeholders? Are there any representing the BPO
sector?? I
ask this because I have contacted the industry association and
they dont
seem
to be in the know either. This is quite bizarre, especially since
BPO is a
key sector of the ICT Board's mandate.
Who are the stakeholders from the other ICT sectors? Shouldnt the
Board be
getting input from key stakeholders at this workshop.
They are wasting government resources going to write strategies
and then
'presenting' to stakeholders, yet stakeholders should have been
involved
from the word go.
The
--
David Otwoma,
Chief Science Secretary,
National Council for Science and Technology,
Utalii House 9th Floor,
Mobile tel: +254 722 141771,
Office tel: +254 (0)20 2346915,
P. O. Box 29899 - 00100, Nairobi, Kenya
email: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com & <otwoma@ncst.go.ke> otwoma@ncst.go.ke
<http://www.ncst.go.ke <http://www.ncst.go.ke/> >www.ncst.go.ke <http://www.ncst.go.ke/>
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/
mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net <http://40caret.net/>
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/
mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40sky <http://web.co.ke <http://web.co.ke/> >web.co.ke <http://web.co.ke/>
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/otwomad%40gmail.com> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/otwomad%40gmail.com
--
David Otwoma,
Chief Science Secretary,
National Council for Science and Technology,
Utalii House 9th Floor,
Mobile tel: +254 722 141771,
Office tel: +254 (0)20 2346915,
P. O. Box 29899 - 00100, Nairobi, Kenya
email: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com & <otwoma@ncst.go.ke> otwoma@ncst.go.ke
www.ncst.go.ke <http://www.ncst.go.ke/>
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <likoa@verviant.com>likoa@verviant.com
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/likoa%40verviant.com
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/likoa%40verviant.com
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net
------------------------------
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke Unsubscribe or change your options at < http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40skyweb.co.ke> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40skyweb.co.ke
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <blongwe@gmail.com>blongwe@gmail.com Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/blongwe%40gmail.com> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/blongwe%40gmail.com
-- Brian Munyao Longwe e-mail: blongwe@gmail.com cell: + 254 722 518 744 blog : http://zinjlog.blogspot.com <http://zinjlog.blogspot.com/> meta-blog: http://mashilingi.blogspot.com <http://mashilingi.blogspot.com/>
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: lmwatibo.ktd@gmail.com Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/lmwatibo.ktd%40gmail.co...
This debate is starting to sound well choreographed or is it orchestrated. On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 6:45 AM, Peres Were <pwere@cascadegl.com> wrote:
It is true that Society was unable to participate at the Zaragoza, Spain event, due to lack of funding.
I would like to correct this statement below Peres, if you don't mind. The ICT Board did send one member of the Society to Spain for this event at their own cost. May I also ask some of the new operators whose names I have been seeing on this list to attend next week's breakfast meeting? It would be good to put a face to your names. ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Kagai To: Gilda Odera Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 8:41 AM Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:) This debate is starting to sound well choreographed or is it orchestrated. On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 6:45 AM, Peres Were <pwere@cascadegl.com> wrote: It is true that Society was unable to participate at the Zaragoza, Spain event, due to lack of funding. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet This message was sent to: godera@skyweb.co.ke Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40skyweb.co.ke
Justin, I am disappointed by your responses. The fact that some investor went and spent a lot of money of fitting out their operations does not make them developed, just well equipped. The fact that they closed shop as soon as the bandwidth closed (in the case of your friend - elaborates the issue of concern) We need to think sequentially for a moment. Everytime you hear the ICT Board mentioned here one can clearly see that the perspective being expressed - sometimes between the lines - is what we want for them to pay for us (BPO practitioners) etc. When I listen to people talking about what it takes to set up a BPO facility, you'd think that it will cost a mere couple of hundred thousand shillings. Certainly I have received a consultant's report that suggested that it will take less than kshs. 1 million to set up. No mention of the marketing function and costs. It is shallow to suggest that Kenya is competing with Phillipines and India but the corresponding organisations cannot be compared. We are kidding ourselves if we do not expect of the society and the board to operate at the same strategic levels as India,Phillipines, South African etc organisations. I get the sense that people just have not internalised what it would mean to take a significant slice of the global market - otherwise, we really should be talking mathematics - "it will take (for example) 100,000 seats operating at full capacity for us to be managing 1% of the global BPO revenues.." Our story at that point stops being - as Peres says - merely a "strong revenue generator", that will result in "job creation". Our language would morph from "we couldn't go because of funding..." and other general platitudes. Competing with the rest of the world requires an uncompromising expectation andunderstanding of what it takes to win and therefore the prize is not for amount of work but results... I don't know - does anyone feel me? --------------- Dr. Sam Regeee ZBI I organised my thoughts if you will notice around the subject of business - not just having the office with computers and bandwidth. In my calculations so far, bandwidth only seems to take 16-19% of the business costs and this is calibrated depending on usage (whether work is there or not). over 30% is HR costs. At least 35% is marketing costs. In this sort of thinking one is able to calcuate just what one must invest and over what period of time. On 09/04/2008 "Justin Mburu" <jt.alliance@gmail.com> wrote:
Good day All,
This interesting subject on BPO rather caught my attention intensely I must say :-)
I have just come from the UK a couple of months back and look to setup a contact center locally, now that the industry has begun to pick up amid the hiccups here and there.
And to pick up on some of Sam Regee's points as outlined below, i will also tend to share my findings as well: (My comments are in blue font in commenting to Sam Regee's comments)
1. That much of the BPO sector has been set up in an uncompetitive framework that cannot be sustained. Businesses (for this is what they are) have been set up while factoring heavily the potential government subsidy. --- I have a friend of mine who set up here on Kenya long before the subsidy was in place, and so therefore you cannot base your claims on a few vendors who set up in a rush for the subsidy only to close shop when they realized that the bandwidth wasnt forth-coming at all.Meaning they got in the industry on a wrong foot. There are several which are still operating and have been on since even before the subsidy issue.
2. That the private sector players in the industry are too dependent on government (through the Kenya ICT Board) for marketing and business. Essentially there is too much government in the business of outsourcing here - not from a legislative perspective but from an operational perspective
This is clearly untenable because, having glanced at the Kenya ICT Board's strategy as articulated by its officials severally, their mandate goes much further than BPO - as at the time they were set up, that is. For sure, I perceive them as a marketing organization but marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.---- Sam if you look clearly, you will realise private sector are not that dependent on government/ICT Board at all. Have you even walked around the existing centers and seen how developed most are? Did government/ICT Board help them get to the levels of development they are in? I think not. If I were you I would visit existing centers first before I leap to claiming the private sector are dependant on government/ICT Board. Or maybe you can shade some light for us on what exactly you mean by ' too dependent' :-) and also it is obvious government has to be involved because if you have been keen on what has been going on since you arrived in the country, you will realise BPO is one of the 5 pillars of the set Vision 2030 which is a government initiative. So whether we like it or not, government has a major role to play in ensuring this industry picks up here in Kenya.
On the note of ICT Board's role in marketing, if you have been keen on all organised BPO/Contact Center events, ICT Board itself has always put itself on the frontline in this events, meaning they themselves are the ones focusing too much on the BPO/Contact center industry and putting so much energy on it, (which is a good thing anyway) , while there are so many ICT things to market on. So I agree with you that ICT Board should focus on marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.
3. That the private sector umbrella body, the Kenya BPO Society - and I have read the discussions by the chairman of the Society here - seems to not articulate well its programmes (at least to my understanding) what they are about overally.---- From my point, the chairman of the society clearly laid out who they are overally, and what they do. And for such a young society, I say kudos to where they are now. You can visit their offices and I am sure they will be more than glad to tell you on a one-on-one basis what they are all about. For all I know, they are doing a great job, and I wish them all the best as they continue to drwa the industry to high depths. Just to give you a bit of what they have achieved so far, so that you can apprecaiate they are on the right direction, they recently launched the Standards & Ethics guidelines for the industry, which I say is a very brilliant step, considering how young the industry is here in Kenya. So it is with such laid guidelines that the BPO industry in Kenya will be able to be laid in a firm solid foundation that is based on international operation standards in BPO & Contact Center industy.
If I were to turn to the BPO Services Association Unlimited ( http://www.bsau.org/), I can see a marketing campaign and a marketing position that they have taken. This came from the outsourcing private sector - and some of their programmes have support from the Phillipino government but the drive is from the private sector. If I look at NASSCOM, I can see that they are private sector led and their main purpose is the promotion of India as the leader in BPO services globally. In fact, they start by saying that they are a global organization - which is a position of strength.
Has the BPO Society attained such a level of pedigree - which starts in the mind with strategy - that would enable them to lead the sector to prosperity? I have not heard it in their discussions at the few events where I have had a chance to listen to the Chairperson and other officials of the society.-----My friend, it seems you have really been behind the screens with the society updates. Next week they will be launching their 3 year marketing strategy plan. This is indeed another brilliant step they will have taken as young an association as they are.From one of their forums, I remember them mentioning that one of their strategies is to join hands with several associations globally. This shows great initiative in making sure the industry gets recognized globaly through such relations. It rather unfortunate that the society did not get to participate at the EXPO ZARAGORA 2008 Spain event which from my research had many international associations attending the event such that it could have been an ideal place to network and form relations with the other international associations. I hear the society was to participate but they got a critical hiccup at the last minute (maybe the society chairman can fill us in on what exactly happened for them to miss such a crucial beneficial event). But I hear the CEO of ICT Board Mr Paul Kukubo and a local call center director,attended the event, maybe they can shed more light for us (if they are in the mailing list) what exactly went on in the Spain event and if they managed to secure any opportunities from the event. It is at such events that the society looks to the government support in ensuring they and also some industry players get to attend such events as Kenyan political figures were also present at the event as well as government officials. Such is where much lobbying can take place and the society can lobby their way to getting in beneficial relations with other international associations as well us get prospective clienst for industry players at some point.
Hey and dont you think you are being too harsh on the society by comparing them with giant international BPO industries which definately have giant associations as well? I say give some credit to the Kenya BPO Society this far they have come. So instead of comparing them with big giants, look more into working with them into becoming a giant as well.
Kenya BPO society is also private sector led, its only that the ICT Board takes much of the show (and we are not saying this is a bad thing) hence I think this ends up confusing industry players, and it always ends up looking like the industry is government driven, if you get my point. The government should be there just to support maybe in terms of funding society-organsised BPO events, which are beneficial to all industry players for instance in marketing the country as a BPO destination, etc. But what the government/ICT Board should not do is brand all BPO related shows to be government/ICT Board shows, as this is what makes it all look like the industry in Kenya is government/ICT Board-driven and govt/ICT Board dependant, in stead of being private sector-driven.
c) Has the BPO Society (or the Kenya ICT Board since they are so much in the thick of things here) done a comprehensive marketing plan for the sector - or do they each have one? ---- For all I know, I hear the Kenya BPO society has a marketing strategy which they are launching some time next week. Maybe you should find our more details about it from the society itself, so that you can be able to attend and maybe you will get your answers there. I will be attending, and would really like to meet you there Sam Regee so that we can chit chat about this industry in a more comprehensive way. What do you say? I sure hope to see you there. I never miss society events as they give me hope that there is a light at the end of the tunnel in this BPO industry here in Kenya.
As for ICT Board, I have not heard of any so far.
I hope this has helped you gauge the phase we are at now in this new industry in Kenya.
On a lighter note, what does the ZBI from you signature stand for?
Regards,
Justin
Hi all,
As a recently returned (to Kenya) academic and entrepreneur, with an interest in the BPO sector - explicitly: I want to set up a legal transcription facility here. As I go about my research, I have been to see one or two operations, while I was in my previous engagement a few months ago and I am saddened to note that quite a number of the BPO operations that were in existence a few months ago are no more.
having spoken to a few people in the industry, I am led to form some preliminary conclusions (which I hope to validate here): I apologise in advance, if I offend, but it is in a positive spirit, that I advance these thoughts here.
1. That much of the BPO sector has been set up in an uncompetitive framework that cannot be sustained. Businesses (for this is what they are) have been set up while factoring heavily the potential government subsidy.
2. That the private sector players in the industry are too dependent on government (through the Kenya ICT Board) for marketing and business. Essentially there is too much government in the business of outsourcing here - not from a legislative perspective but from an operational perspective.
This is clearly untenable because, having glanced at the Kenya ICT Board's strategy as articulated by its officials severally, their mandate goes much further than BPO - as at the time they were set up, that is. For sure, I perceive them as a marketing organization but marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.
3. That the private sector umbrella body, the Kenya BPO Society - and I have read the discussions by the chairman of the Society here - seems to not articulate well its programmes (at least to my understanding) what they are about overally.
If I were to turn to the BPO Services Association Unlimited ( http://www.bsau.org/), I can see a marketing campaign and a marketing position that they have taken. This came from the outsourcing private sector - and some of their programmes have support from the Phillipino government but the drive is from the private sector. If I look at NASSCOM, I can see that they are private sector led and their main purpose is the promotion of India as the leader in BPO services globally. In fact, they start by saying that they are a global organization - which is a position of strength.
Has the BPO Society attained such a level of pedigree - which starts in the mind with strategy - that would enable them to lead the sector to prosperity? I have not heard it in their discussions at the few events where I have had a chance to listen to the Chairperson and other officials of the society.
These are preliminary thoughts that I have developed and I would be happy to see them examined and torn apart and validated as the case may be.
meanwhile, some pointed questions:
a) Is there any science to a slice of the $310 Billion opportunity presented by the society? This is to ask, how many seats would we need to have to have a 1% slice of the opportunity?
b) How many BPO operators are there now - and more pointedly - how many are actually functional?
c) Has the BPO Society (or the Kenya ICT Board since they are so much in the thick of things here) done a comprehensive marketing plan for the sector - or do they each have one?
This is a very good discussion.
------------------------------- Dr. Sam Regee ZBI
null
This message bounced back yesterday - seems the listserver is having some constipation....
Brian
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Brian Munyao Longwe <blongwe@gmail.com> Date: Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 5:35 PM Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:) To: Liko Agosta <likoa@verviant.com> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Hi Liko,
Sorry, I was driving with one hand n texting with the other (usinistaki). Thus the v brief response. Pls so feel free to share your views with the rest of the list, we NEED to hear from practitioners! As mentioned, this discussion should help she'd some light on this relatively 'new' industry so that inner and outer stakeholders can develop a better understanding.
It would also be great to hear from the ICT Board (hint hint) - although they're probably a bit gun-shy right because they don't want to be flamed.
On your point regarding the CEO being 'seconded' to the USA for an extended period... Hmmm... Maybe not... BUT.... Your suggestion about high level representation makes sense. How about a full fledged office, maybe with Dep.CEO ranking.... Dunno...just thoughts....
Nway, please do share ur thoughts, ideas, suggestions, challenges, headaches, the lot!
Brian
Sent from my iPhone
On 03 Sep 2008, at 4:37 PM, "Liko Agosta" <likoa@verviant.com> wrote:
Brian
I don't mind taking a call from you to explain what has happened and where Kenya is and some ideas about the best way forward
Obviously, I will be looking at life from a providers point of view …
Also, which organization do you represent ?
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
<http://www.verviant.com>www.verviant.com
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: 9193891551@txt.att.net
*From:* kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [ mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+likoa= verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] *On Behalf Of *Gilda Odera *Sent:* Wednesday, September 03, 2008 4:16 AM *To:* Liko Agosta *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Hi Brian,
If you recall, initially the ICT Board was created mainly " to market Kenya as an outsourcing destination". I think many other things were lumped onto the board without putting structures in place ie. personnel and budgets.
On another note, I am surprised you are still asking about the role and obligations of KBPOCCS after the lengthy emails.
Maybe you should re-read them?:)
It is true there is more shouting from BPO players in KICTANET,media, everwhere..... maybe the others are content or indifferent....
That should not stop the BPO Sector from airing views or making demands. Remember your ISP days? You and some others in the ISP arena were very vocal and that impacted on various other sub-sectors who benefited.
I say, if there is an issue that needs attention, it needs to be known. I would suggest that the other sub-sectors also start shouting out their issues that they want to see being resolved. We are all inter-connected so any gains will benefit all others.
Can someone from the ICT Board please say something? Is it true you are being blamed by others for focusing too much on BPO and if so, how are you balancing the act?
Best
Gilda
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Brian Munyao Longwe <brian@caret.net>
*To:* Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke>
*Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 03, 2008 8:55 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Great input Lika. Seems like you have a real handle on this industry. If I may recap:
Clients (I presume these are international) gauge a BPO provider based on four main criteria:
a) Capability: This speaks to an area of skillset matching across industry
do we have enough "intel" on the necessary skillsets so that if someone wants to outsource their transcription of recorded audio court records or psychiatric interviews - the BPO operators personnel understand enough about the subject matter to capture the relevant language (don't know if this is a good example but it's what comes to mind)
b) Cost-cutting potential: If the customer is the one asking this question, then it seems that they expect the BPO operator to have alread studied to some extent their business, at` least enough to understand ways in which savings can be accrued.
c) Referenceable clients
If the CEO of the ICT board calls the CEO of ATT he is more likely to get a meeting and business as opposed to the CEO of Kamau Wanjala Outsourcers … again, I don't know what the ICT Board has been doing (am sure they have done a lot … may be like top secret strategy stuff) but in my opinion
CEO of that board should be based in US for like 90% of the year .. talk to clients, be a rain maker, schmooze, play golf and open doors.
This belies the assumptions and perceptions on which I initiated this thread. For some reason there seems to be some kind of implicit expectation that the ICT Board exists to servie the BPO industry - why is that? Kenya's ICT is definitely much more than just BPO (as Gilda clearly pointed out).
On this list we have heard a lot of complaints (largely from BPO
about the ICT Board's lack of support for the BPO industry, while on the other hand other sector players saying that the Board pays too much attention to BPO. What should the role and obligation of the board in
BPO sector be? Could it be strategic?
What can we say is the role of the BPO/CC Society and it's obligations (both to internal and external stakeholders) in the larger scheme of things?
Regards,
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 11:07 PM, Liko Agosta wrote:
All that you guys are talking about is good ... but when I talk to clients they ask the following questions
a. Can you do the job ?
b. How much will you save me ?
c. Have you done this for anyone else (especially in my sector/country) ?
d. Can I talk to references
1-3 page executive proposals work better than 50 page proposals. C level execs never go past page 3 of proposals. They really don't care where I am working from
Only 1 client asked about Kenyan copyright laws .. and our lawyer gave a sufficient answer... we got the work and have saved them over USD 500,000
About Safaricom and Land Registry and all this projects that keep breaking our hearts and hurting our feelings :) ....
Let's assume Safaricom is has 400 customer services reps .... would
an ideal client for any BPO in Kenya ? if they pay their employees 50k
month .. a BPO would have to charge them 100k per month FOR THE SAME EMPLOYEE across town.
Now, maybe I have all this wrong but there are more than 10000 companies in the developed world with over 400 "clerical employees" who they pay an average of 3000$ per month. If you went and targeted these companies .... you can get 100k per employee, pay the employee 50k etc and the client will be happy, you happy, employee happy ...
Many local clients take 60-90 days to pay invoices. In US for example, depending on state, it's illegal to hold a vendors payment when work has been done ….
My point ... BPOs, Software Providers have to be willing to ignore the local market and focus on external sources of business. The local market is too small, too complicated and the waters are very muddied.
About brokers and "consultants". I have been approached by quite a few. People who claim to have connections, venture capital and all that good stuff. I learnt early to say no… early. They are a waste of time in my book
Kenya will not become a better outsourcing destination if we come up with ethics guidelines, an act of parliament and the like … now, those will not hurt … but we will benefit more if the ICT Board flanked companies when
are pitching their services to potential clients.
By flanking I mean fly to meet the client, do research on financials, help with financing - have a conference in US and invite 100 potential and vetted clients to meet Kenyan providers …. This works like a charm here .. (if GOK spends 500k on tickets and 30 Kenyans are hired making 50k … - ROI is
pretty fast)
If the CEO of the ICT board calls the CEO of ATT he is more likely to get a meeting and business as opposed to the CEO of Kamau Wanjala Outsourcers … again, I don't know what the ICT Board has been doing (am sure they have done a lot … may be like top secret strategy stuff) but in my opinion
On 09/04/2008 "Brian Longwe" <blongwe@gmail.com> wrote: - the players) the they be per they there the
CEO of that board should be based in US for like 90% of the year .. talk to clients, be a rain maker, schmooze, play golf and open doors.
I have always felt that the ICT Board should headhunt and hire people with C level experience from either US or UK … people from the bigger consulting companies Bain, BCG, Accenture, Avanade, EDS … these guys work on million dollar outsourcing deals and have very good contacts. They also would be able to come up with a strategy immediately
As Gilda has shown, the harvest is plentiful …
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
www.verviant.com
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: <9193891551@txt.att.net>9193891551@txt.att.net
-----Original Message-----
From: kictanet-bounces+likoa= <verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [<kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+likoa= verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of David Otwoma
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:45 AM
To: Liko Agosta
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Dear Brian,
Looks like you are fully re-charged after last weeks retreat in
Naivasha on Strategy. Tell us some more of what is not confidential.
Otherwise my wish is to take the baton from my able Chair and respond
on bullet 3 in your beautiful rejoinder.
As Chair of the Standards and Ethics Committee of the KBPOCCS we (are
7 members) did come up with Standards and Ethics Guidelines which took
over eight (8) months to prepare and on June 22nd 2008 the Permanent
Secretary of the Ministry of Information & Communication led us
(KBPOCCS members, KICTB who graciously sponsored the event at KICC,
CCK, CSK, members of the public who have an interest in BPO&CC pie)
into adopting the S&E Guidelines.
The next milestone we wish to aim for is have the Guidelines upgraded
into a Regulation or an Act of Parliament. Either achievement would be
binding to all and sundry who operate in the BPO&CC world. A world
which is moving the advancement of the human race from industrial age
into information age. Just imagine Kenya having a binding law on
Standards and a slice of the USD$310 Billion industry. It would make
our young people, because they are the future force in the knowledge
economy we keep talking about.
What are the next immediate steps. Cozy relations between the Private
Public Partnership.
Another bullet I will let you peer into what you have been seeing but
refuse to acknowledge is bullet No. 7. It was KPLC who introduced me
to the world of BPO&CC when they sought S. African expertise to deal
with their in-house contact centre better known to the general public
(read Brian et al) as Customer Care Centre or Customer Relations
Management. Ever wondered when power disappears at any time of the day
or night where that 'frustrated' call 'agrily demanding 'where is
power?' goes? Yes to a call center owned and managed
by KPLC. KPLC as of 2005 when we engaged had a call centre running
24/7 with 210 seats in Nairobi alone. Telecom has a bigger one.
Safaricom is soon overtaking Telecom with that news flash. Water
companies have. So do all the banks, insurance, etc. companies both
private and public owned.
Since we have very able Chairs for Training, Marketing etc. I will
stop there and go for my dear bottle.....tusker.
David
On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 6:12 PM, Brian Munyao Longwe < <brian@caret.net> brian@caret.net> wrote:
Excellent Feedback Gilda,
So I see a few very clear issues arising out of your response:
1) There is a distinct global opportunity - but that calls for
appropriate positioning as well as preparation on Kenya's part
2) Capacity issues need to be addressed - knowledge transfer could be
on way - but that implies finding someone who is willing to impart
the knowledge - do they come from inside or outside?
3) Global standards must be recognised and adhered to in order to
ensure entry and competitiveness - what are these standards are they
clearly documented somewhere?
4) Many local operations have not had the exposure necessary/needed
to develop expertise/efficiency/etc - what kind of interventions can
facilitate this?
5) BPO is not the "Holy Grail" as some perceive it, but one piece of
the ICT puzzle that needs to be solved in order to help Kenya attain
it's ambitious goal of becoming a global ICT hub
6) There is a distinct and precise training need for personnel to
supply the Kenyan BPO industry with "bodies to put on seats",
presumably to allow the BPO industry to harness and deliver against
the global opportunity - what interventions (planned or otherwise)
are we taking to meet this target? How accurate is this estimate and
can it be verified?
7) Local Players - your website (must say it's very cute) lists quite
a number (28) - but I must say that I'm quite surprised at some of
the names I find there - didn't know KPLC was offering BPO services
for example - but maybe I'm mistaken in my assumptions....
8) Local opportunities: seems many/most local companies are looking
outside to outsource certain functions or simply "self-provisioning"
- why would Safaricom claim that it's too expensive to outsource
locally based on the price estimates that they got from industry. Is
there a need for our local BPO industry to do some kind of soul
searching and find ways of making themselves/their services more
palatable to local companies?
9) The industry for some reason seems to have attracted brokers - who
are watering down/diluting the true opportunity - what kind of
interventions do we need to "eliminate the middleman" - a seemingly
consistent argument in many sector e.g. tea, coffee, flowers, tourism
etc.....
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 4:10 PM, Gilda Odera wrote:
Hi Brian,
You have raised very pertinent questions in your email below.
Let me answer your queries.
Firstly, it is true that BPO has taken centre stage in many
discussions surrounding Kenya's ICT development and growth and it
is a good thing, here's why:
We are looking at a USD$310 Billion industry by next year, up for
grabs for any destinations that get it right. India is currently
taking up 45% of the total share and China and Phillipines are
steadily growing. And what's more, it can only grow, with the fuel
prices soaring each year,what choice is there for the companies out
there to look for more affordable means of operating.
It is a fact that the western countries are looking for new
alternative destinations to Asia so they do not put all their eggs
in one basket, not with the terrorism threats all over. Where else
but Africa. Why would Kenya not put its house in order to take a
piece of this pie?
Now in regard to your comment on BPO taking centre stage in ICT
development, I would say one thing we need in this country is
opportunity for knowledge transfer done right here. We may produce
more technology oriented personnel but as long as we operate within
the Kenyan way of operating, we are not developing our personnel to
the global standards we want them to attain.Not because we are not
capable, but because many operations have not had the exposure.
I would beg to differ (and government can speak for itself) that we
are putting all eggs in one basket. BPO is but one sub-sector in
the ICT arena. Many other sub-sectors within the sector are quite
active. Software development is coming up and I keep reading
debates on KICTANET. There is an interest.
Content development is also being encouraged. The
telecommunications sector is busy preparing for real competition
and we the consumers can't wait for the benefits, they will have to
have great value adds and affordable pricing.
What steps are we taking to enhance BPO? I leave the ICT Board to
answer that although as Kenya BPO and Contact Centre Society, we
have presented to them the need to train not less than 10,000 per
year, specifically for this sector. Frost and Sullivan who are
normally 90% accurate in their new destination analysis says Kenya
will by 2012 have a BPO sector employing about 120,000 direct jobs
( you can add indirect by another 3-5) as long as the fibre optic
infrastructure is in place on time next year and marketing of the
country takes root.
Who are the players? Our members are on our website
<http://www.kenyabposociety.or.ke>www.kenyabposociety.or.ke . There are ofcourse others quietly
operating.
What are the local opportunities- Our biggest challenge is getting
local companies to outsource though some have started. We expected
the giants like Safaricom to play a role even if it is a CSR role
to demonstrate a level of confidence in the local companies. This
is possible, other companies work with those they outsource to for
a given period, and leave them running efficiently as they require.
All is not lost. Some local companies are outsourcing BPO work and
I wish to challenge Safaricom to outsource part of their BPO work
if they say local outsourcing is not competitive.
The international opportunities are the ones that I have mentioned
are worth $310 Billion. The ball is in our court as Kenyans to
market Kenya as a destination if we are to make any gains. We need
to attract direct clients and not the current brokers who are
exploiting the existing centres,much as their contracts are keeping
some of the centres going.
I hope I have addressed your queries.
Gilda Odera
Chair, Kenya BPO and Contact Centre Society
----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Munyao Longwe"
< <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net>
To: "Gilda Odera" < <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke>
Cc: "KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions" < < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:12 AM
Subject: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Hi All,
It is interesting that BPO seems to have taken a centre stage in many
discussions surrounding Kenya's ICT development and growth. While I
do believe that BPO/KPO has huge potential. I am a bit skeptical
about this "silver bullet" approach which might be akin to putting
all our eggs in one basket.
What if the basket gets stepped on by some giant like Malaysia, South
Africa or others?
I would be very interested in taking a much closer look at the BPO
industry in Kenya. Who are the players? What are the opportunities?
What is the potential for growth? What steps are we taking to enhance/
develop/increase capacity in BPO/KPO? What kind(s) of investments are
required to make this industry boom? What are the local opportunities
for BPO/KPO? What are the international opportunities for BPO/KPO?
I think that answers to these and many other questions will help
other like me who are a bit unclear in their minds as to how BPO will
be our saviour have a clearer view. It might also just show that BPO
is a contributing factor and not necessarily the holy grail that at
the moment seems to be the general perception.
Regards,
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 8:25 AM, David Otwoma wrote:
Dear All,
"Comments from BPO operators and of course other Stakeholders"
please.
Safaricom in Sh1bn customer care plan (see Daily Nation page 28)
-------------------------------------------------
Many companies have been turning to BPOs as the financial benefits of
outsourcing continue to make it compelling, with cost savings and
efficiency improvements being the dominant reasons companies use such
services. However, companies biggest concerns on outsourcing
relate to
data security.
-----------------------------------------------------
The move, seen a precautionary measure in the face of growing
competition, marks a complete turnaround by the mobile provider which
in July last year had sought quotations from local Business Process
Outsourcing (BPO) firms.
"Outsourcing the customer care function proved to be too expensive
for
the kind of quality that we required. We will just have to run the
service in-house," said Safaricom chief executive Michael Joseph.
<http://www.nation.co.ke/business/news/-/1006/466372/-/jiyt3xz/-/> http://www.nation.co.ke/business/news/-/1006/466372/-/jiyt3xz/-/
index.html
On Mon, Sep 1, 2008 at 8:58 PM, Sean Moroney
< <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com> wrote:
> Dear Liko,
>
>
>
> We would like to invite you to make a presentation at the
> forthcoming
> Outsourcing & Contact Centre Conference, which we will be holding
> over 4-5
> November under the auspices of the Ministry of Information &
> Communications
> and in partnership with the ICT Board. The programme of confirmed
> presentations so far is attached.
>
>
>
> It would be great if you would be willing to share your experience
> with the
> other participants.
>
>
>
> Yours sincerely,
>
>
>
> Sean Moroney
>
> Chairman
>
> AITEC Africa
>
> <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com
>
> UK Tel: +44(0)1480-880774
>
> UK Fax: +44(0)1480-880765
>
> UK Mobile: +44(0)7973-499224
>
> Kenya Mobile: +254(0)721-845674
>
> Mozambique Mobile: +258-82-6181618
>
> Nigeria Mobile: +234(0)802-0571766
>
> SA Mobile: +27(0)724-577887
>
> Skype: seanmoroney
>
>
> Please visit our discussion group on The Banking Technology sector
> in Africa
> at: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/africanbankingtech> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/africanbankingtech
>
>
>
>
>
> AITEC Africa is the trading name of AITEC Conferences Limited
> UK Company registration number: 4698475
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: kictanet-bounces+seanm= <aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
> [ <kictanet-bounces>mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>
> +seanm= <aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On
> Behalf Of Peres Were
> Sent: 01 September 2008 12:23
> To: <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com
>
> Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions'
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Stakeholder Queries:
>
>
>
> Liko,
>
>
>
> It would be great to hear from you and others, your insights into
> sales and
> marketing insights that can benefit the BPO, KPO sector. We can
> continue the
> discussion off the list.
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> Peres Were
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: kictanet-bounces+pwere= <cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
> [ <kictanet-bounces+pwere=cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+pwere= cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke]
> On Behalf
> Of Liko Agosta
> Sent: 01 September 2008 10:33
> To: <pwere@cascadegl.com>pwere@cascadegl.com
> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Stakeholder Queries:
>
>
>
> About ICT Board and all these Boards …
>
>
>
> Do they ever have open sessions where stakeholders can review
> strategy,
> advice, brainstorm ?
>
>
>
> As CEO of verviant, I have been able to get business … I feel like
> I have
> insights into the sales and marketing process that can benefit other
> software/ICT providers …
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> Liko Agosta, CEO
>
> Verviant Consulting Services.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Phone : 1-919-341-1820
>
> Fax : 1-978-268-8403
>
>
>
> Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
>
>
>
> Pager: <9193891551@txt.att.net>9193891551@txt.att.net
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Brian Longwe < <blongwe@gmail.com>blongwe@gmail.com>
> Date: Aug 29, 2008 9:31 AM
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] ICT Board Strategy a Farce
> To: <wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk>wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk
>
> Very strong language - but I think you should relax as your
> concerns are
> unfounded.
>
> I am at the Strategic retreat. Unfortunately Gilda Odera -
> Chairperson of
> BPO, who was supposed to be present had to cancel at the last
> minute.
>
> Brian
>
> On 8/29/08, Wambui Wakarema < <wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk> wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>
> I have read with surprise the Kictanet mailout from the ICT Board
> claiming
> they are going for a stakeholders strategy workshop in Naivasha.
>
> Who are these stakeholders? Are there any representing the BPO
> sector?? I
> ask this because I have contacted the industry association and
> they dont
> seem
>
> to be in the know either. This is quite bizarre, especially since
> BPO is a
> key sector of the ICT Board's mandate.
>
> Who are the stakeholders from the other ICT sectors? Shouldnt the
> Board be
> getting input from key stakeholders at this workshop.
>
> They are wasting government resources going to write strategies
> and then
> 'presenting' to stakeholders, yet stakeholders should have been
> involved
> from the word go.
>
> The
>
--
David Otwoma,
Chief Science Secretary,
National Council for Science and Technology,
Utalii House 9th Floor,
Mobile tel: +254 722 141771,
Office tel: +254 (0)20 2346915,
P. O. Box 29899 - 00100, Nairobi, Kenya
email: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com & <otwoma@ncst.go.ke> otwoma@ncst.go.ke
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/
mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/
mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40sky <http://web.co.ke>web.co.ke
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com
Unsubscribe or change your options at < http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/otwomad%40gmail.com> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/otwomad%40gmail.com
--
David Otwoma,
Chief Science Secretary,
National Council for Science and Technology,
Utalii House 9th Floor,
Mobile tel: +254 722 141771,
Office tel: +254 (0)20 2346915,
P. O. Box 29899 - 00100, Nairobi, Kenya
email: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com & <otwoma@ncst.go.ke> otwoma@ncst.go.ke
www.ncst.go.ke
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <likoa@verviant.com>likoa@verviant.com
Unsubscribe or change your options at < http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/likoa%40verviant.com
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/likoa%40verviant.com
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net
------------------------------
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke Unsubscribe or change your options at <
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40skyweb.co.ke
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40skyweb.co.ke
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <blongwe@gmail.com>blongwe@gmail.com Unsubscribe or change your options at <
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/blongwe%40gmail.com>
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/blongwe%40gmail.com
-- Brian Munyao Longwe e-mail: blongwe@gmail.com cell: + 254 722 518 744 blog : http://zinjlog.blogspot.com meta-blog: http://mashilingi.blogspot.com
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: lmwatibo.ktd@gmail.com Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/lmwatibo.ktd%40gmail.co...
Sam So when are you setting up ? Thanks Liko Agosta, CEO Verviant Consulting Services. www.verviant.com Phone : 1-919-341-1820 Fax : 1-978-268-8403 Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935 Pager: 9193891551@txt.att.net -----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of Sam regee Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 5:42 AM To: Liko Agosta Cc: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:) Justin, I am disappointed by your responses. The fact that some investor went and spent a lot of money of fitting out their operations does not make them developed, just well equipped. The fact that they closed shop as soon as the bandwidth closed (in the case of your friend - elaborates the issue of concern) We need to think sequentially for a moment. Everytime you hear the ICT Board mentioned here one can clearly see that the perspective being expressed - sometimes between the lines - is what we want for them to pay for us (BPO practitioners) etc. When I listen to people talking about what it takes to set up a BPO facility, you'd think that it will cost a mere couple of hundred thousand shillings. Certainly I have received a consultant's report that suggested that it will take less than kshs. 1 million to set up. No mention of the marketing function and costs. It is shallow to suggest that Kenya is competing with Phillipines and India but the corresponding organisations cannot be compared. We are kidding ourselves if we do not expect of the society and the board to operate at the same strategic levels as India,Phillipines, South African etc organisations. I get the sense that people just have not internalised what it would mean to take a significant slice of the global market - otherwise, we really should be talking mathematics - "it will take (for example) 100,000 seats operating at full capacity for us to be managing 1% of the global BPO revenues.." Our story at that point stops being - as Peres says - merely a "strong revenue generator", that will result in "job creation". Our language would morph from "we couldn't go because of funding..." and other general platitudes. Competing with the rest of the world requires an uncompromising expectation andunderstanding of what it takes to win and therefore the prize is not for amount of work but results... I don't know - does anyone feel me? --------------- Dr. Sam Regeee ZBI I organised my thoughts if you will notice around the subject of business - not just having the office with computers and bandwidth. In my calculations so far, bandwidth only seems to take 16-19% of the business costs and this is calibrated depending on usage (whether work is there or not). over 30% is HR costs. At least 35% is marketing costs. In this sort of thinking one is able to calcuate just what one must invest and over what period of time. On 09/04/2008 "Justin Mburu" <jt.alliance@gmail.com> wrote:
Good day All,
This interesting subject on BPO rather caught my attention intensely I must say :-)
I have just come from the UK a couple of months back and look to setup a contact center locally, now that the industry has begun to pick up amid the hiccups here and there.
And to pick up on some of Sam Regee's points as outlined below, i will also tend to share my findings as well: (My comments are in blue font in commenting to Sam Regee's comments)
1. That much of the BPO sector has been set up in an uncompetitive framework that cannot be sustained. Businesses (for this is what they are) have been set up while factoring heavily the potential government subsidy. --- I have a friend of mine who set up here on Kenya long before the subsidy was in place, and so therefore you cannot base your claims on a few vendors who set up in a rush for the subsidy only to close shop when they realized that the bandwidth wasnt forth-coming at all.Meaning they got in the industry on a wrong foot. There are several which are still operating and have been on since even before the subsidy issue.
2. That the private sector players in the industry are too dependent on government (through the Kenya ICT Board) for marketing and business. Essentially there is too much government in the business of outsourcing here - not from a legislative perspective but from an operational perspective
This is clearly untenable because, having glanced at the Kenya ICT Board's strategy as articulated by its officials severally, their mandate goes much further than BPO - as at the time they were set up, that is. For sure, I perceive them as a marketing organization but marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.---- Sam if you look clearly, you will realise private sector are not that dependent on government/ICT Board at all. Have you even walked around the existing centers and seen how developed most are? Did government/ICT Board help them get to the levels of development they are in? I think not. If I were you I would visit existing centers first before I leap to claiming the private sector are dependant on government/ICT Board. Or maybe you can shade some light for us on what exactly you mean by ' too dependent' :-) and also it is obvious government has to be involved because if you have been keen on what has been going on since you arrived in the country, you will realise BPO is one of the 5 pillars of the set Vision 2030 which is a government initiative. So whether we like it or not, government has a major role to play in ensuring this industry picks up here in Kenya.
On the note of ICT Board's role in marketing, if you have been keen on all organised BPO/Contact Center events, ICT Board itself has always put itself on the frontline in this events, meaning they themselves are the ones focusing too much on the BPO/Contact center industry and putting so much energy on it, (which is a good thing anyway) , while there are so many ICT things to market on. So I agree with you that ICT Board should focus on marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.
3. That the private sector umbrella body, the Kenya BPO Society - and I have read the discussions by the chairman of the Society here - seems to not articulate well its programmes (at least to my understanding) what they are about overally.---- From my point, the chairman of the society clearly laid out who they are overally, and what they do. And for such a young society, I say kudos to where they are now. You can visit their offices and I am sure they will be more than glad to tell you on a one-on-one basis what they are all about. For all I know, they are doing a great job, and I wish them all the best as they continue to drwa the industry to high depths. Just to give you a bit of what they have achieved so far, so that you can apprecaiate they are on the right direction, they recently launched the Standards & Ethics guidelines for the industry, which I say is a very brilliant step, considering how young the industry is here in Kenya. So it is with such laid guidelines that the BPO industry in Kenya will be able to be laid in a firm solid foundation that is based on international operation standards in BPO & Contact Center industy.
If I were to turn to the BPO Services Association Unlimited ( http://www.bsau.org/), I can see a marketing campaign and a marketing position that they have taken. This came from the outsourcing private sector - and some of their programmes have support from the Phillipino government but the drive is from the private sector. If I look at NASSCOM, I can see that they are private sector led and their main purpose is the promotion of India as the leader in BPO services globally. In fact, they start by saying that they are a global organization - which is a position of strength.
Has the BPO Society attained such a level of pedigree - which starts in the mind with strategy - that would enable them to lead the sector to prosperity? I have not heard it in their discussions at the few events where I have had a chance to listen to the Chairperson and other officials of the society.-----My friend, it seems you have really been behind the screens with the society updates. Next week they will be launching their 3 year marketing strategy plan. This is indeed another brilliant step they will have taken as young an association as they are.From one of their forums, I remember them mentioning that one of their strategies is to join hands with several associations globally. This shows great initiative in making sure the industry gets recognized globaly through such relations. It rather unfortunate that the society did not get to participate at the EXPO ZARAGORA 2008 Spain event which from my research had many international associations attending the event such that it could have been an ideal place to network and form relations with the other international associations. I hear the society was to participate but they got a critical hiccup at the last minute (maybe the society chairman can fill us in on what exactly happened for them to miss such a crucial beneficial event). But I hear the CEO of ICT Board Mr Paul Kukubo and a local call center director,attended the event, maybe they can shed more light for us (if they are in the mailing list) what exactly went on in the Spain event and if they managed to secure any opportunities from the event. It is at such events that the society looks to the government support in ensuring they and also some industry players get to attend such events as Kenyan political figures were also present at the event as well as government officials. Such is where much lobbying can take place and the society can lobby their way to getting in beneficial relations with other international associations as well us get prospective clienst for industry players at some point.
Hey and dont you think you are being too harsh on the society by comparing them with giant international BPO industries which definately have giant associations as well? I say give some credit to the Kenya BPO Society this far they have come. So instead of comparing them with big giants, look more into working with them into becoming a giant as well.
Kenya BPO society is also private sector led, its only that the ICT Board takes much of the show (and we are not saying this is a bad thing) hence I think this ends up confusing industry players, and it always ends up looking like the industry is government driven, if you get my point. The government should be there just to support maybe in terms of funding society-organsised BPO events, which are beneficial to all industry players for instance in marketing the country as a BPO destination, etc. But what the government/ICT Board should not do is brand all BPO related shows to be government/ICT Board shows, as this is what makes it all look like the industry in Kenya is government/ICT Board-driven and govt/ICT Board dependant, in stead of being private sector-driven.
c) Has the BPO Society (or the Kenya ICT Board since they are so much in the thick of things here) done a comprehensive marketing plan for the sector - or do they each have one? ---- For all I know, I hear the Kenya BPO society has a marketing strategy which they are launching some time next week. Maybe you should find our more details about it from the society itself, so that you can be able to attend and maybe you will get your answers there. I will be attending, and would really like to meet you there Sam Regee so that we can chit chat about this industry in a more comprehensive way. What do you say? I sure hope to see you there. I never miss society events as they give me hope that there is a light at the end of the tunnel in this BPO industry here in Kenya.
As for ICT Board, I have not heard of any so far.
I hope this has helped you gauge the phase we are at now in this new industry in Kenya.
On a lighter note, what does the ZBI from you signature stand for?
Regards,
Justin
Hi all,
As a recently returned (to Kenya) academic and entrepreneur, with an interest in the BPO sector - explicitly: I want to set up a legal transcription facility here. As I go about my research, I have been to see one or two operations, while I was in my previous engagement a few months ago and I am saddened to note that quite a number of the BPO operations that were in existence a few months ago are no more.
having spoken to a few people in the industry, I am led to form some preliminary conclusions (which I hope to validate here): I apologise in advance, if I offend, but it is in a positive spirit, that I advance these thoughts here.
1. That much of the BPO sector has been set up in an uncompetitive framework that cannot be sustained. Businesses (for this is what they are) have been set up while factoring heavily the potential government subsidy.
2. That the private sector players in the industry are too dependent on government (through the Kenya ICT Board) for marketing and business. Essentially there is too much government in the business of outsourcing here - not from a legislative perspective but from an operational perspective.
This is clearly untenable because, having glanced at the Kenya ICT Board's strategy as articulated by its officials severally, their mandate goes much further than BPO - as at the time they were set up, that is. For sure, I perceive them as a marketing organization but marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.
3. That the private sector umbrella body, the Kenya BPO Society - and I have read the discussions by the chairman of the Society here - seems to not articulate well its programmes (at least to my understanding) what they are about overally.
If I were to turn to the BPO Services Association Unlimited ( http://www.bsau.org/), I can see a marketing campaign and a marketing position that they have taken. This came from the outsourcing private sector - and some of their programmes have support from the Phillipino government but the drive is from the private sector. If I look at NASSCOM, I can see that they are private sector led and their main purpose is the promotion of India as the leader in BPO services globally. In fact, they start by saying that they are a global organization - which is a position of strength.
Has the BPO Society attained such a level of pedigree - which starts in the mind with strategy - that would enable them to lead the sector to prosperity? I have not heard it in their discussions at the few events where I have had a chance to listen to the Chairperson and other officials of the society.
These are preliminary thoughts that I have developed and I would be happy to see them examined and torn apart and validated as the case may be.
meanwhile, some pointed questions:
a) Is there any science to a slice of the $310 Billion opportunity presented by the society? This is to ask, how many seats would we need to have to have a 1% slice of the opportunity?
b) How many BPO operators are there now - and more pointedly - how many are actually functional?
c) Has the BPO Society (or the Kenya ICT Board since they are so much in the thick of things here) done a comprehensive marketing plan for the sector - or do they each have one?
This is a very good discussion.
------------------------------- Dr. Sam Regee ZBI
null
This message bounced back yesterday - seems the listserver is having some constipation....
Brian
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Brian Munyao Longwe <blongwe@gmail.com> Date: Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 5:35 PM Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:) To: Liko Agosta <likoa@verviant.com> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Hi Liko,
Sorry, I was driving with one hand n texting with the other (usinistaki). Thus the v brief response. Pls so feel free to share your views with the rest of the list, we NEED to hear from practitioners! As mentioned, this discussion should help she'd some light on this relatively 'new' industry so that inner and outer stakeholders can develop a better understanding.
It would also be great to hear from the ICT Board (hint hint) - although they're probably a bit gun-shy right because they don't want to be flamed.
On your point regarding the CEO being 'seconded' to the USA for an extended period... Hmmm... Maybe not... BUT.... Your suggestion about high level representation makes sense. How about a full fledged office, maybe with Dep.CEO ranking.... Dunno...just thoughts....
Nway, please do share ur thoughts, ideas, suggestions, challenges, headaches, the lot!
Brian
Sent from my iPhone
On 03 Sep 2008, at 4:37 PM, "Liko Agosta" <likoa@verviant.com> wrote:
Brian
I don't mind taking a call from you to explain what has happened and where Kenya is and some ideas about the best way forward
Obviously, I will be looking at life from a providers point of view …
Also, which organization do you represent ?
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
<http://www.verviant.com>www.verviant.com
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: 9193891551@txt.att.net
*From:* kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [ mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+likoa= verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] *On Behalf Of *Gilda Odera *Sent:* Wednesday, September 03, 2008 4:16 AM *To:* Liko Agosta *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Hi Brian,
If you recall, initially the ICT Board was created mainly " to market Kenya as an outsourcing destination". I think many other things were lumped onto the board without putting structures in place ie. personnel and budgets.
On another note, I am surprised you are still asking about the role and obligations of KBPOCCS after the lengthy emails.
Maybe you should re-read them?:)
It is true there is more shouting from BPO players in KICTANET,media, everwhere..... maybe the others are content or indifferent....
That should not stop the BPO Sector from airing views or making demands. Remember your ISP days? You and some others in the ISP arena were very vocal and that impacted on various other sub-sectors who benefited.
I say, if there is an issue that needs attention, it needs to be known. I would suggest that the other sub-sectors also start shouting out their issues that they want to see being resolved. We are all inter-connected so any gains will benefit all others.
Can someone from the ICT Board please say something? Is it true you are being blamed by others for focusing too much on BPO and if so, how are you balancing the act?
Best
Gilda
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Brian Munyao Longwe <brian@caret.net>
*To:* Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke>
*Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 03, 2008 8:55 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Great input Lika. Seems like you have a real handle on this industry. If I may recap:
Clients (I presume these are international) gauge a BPO provider based on four main criteria:
a) Capability: This speaks to an area of skillset matching across industry
do we have enough "intel" on the necessary skillsets so that if someone wants to outsource their transcription of recorded audio court records or psychiatric interviews - the BPO operators personnel understand enough about the subject matter to capture the relevant language (don't know if this is a good example but it's what comes to mind)
b) Cost-cutting potential: If the customer is the one asking this question, then it seems that they expect the BPO operator to have alread studied to some extent their business, at` least enough to understand ways in which savings can be accrued.
c) Referenceable clients
If the CEO of the ICT board calls the CEO of ATT he is more likely to get a meeting and business as opposed to the CEO of Kamau Wanjala Outsourcers … again, I don't know what the ICT Board has been doing (am sure they have done a lot … may be like top secret strategy stuff) but in my opinion
CEO of that board should be based in US for like 90% of the year .. talk to clients, be a rain maker, schmooze, play golf and open doors.
This belies the assumptions and perceptions on which I initiated this thread. For some reason there seems to be some kind of implicit expectation that the ICT Board exists to servie the BPO industry - why is that? Kenya's ICT is definitely much more than just BPO (as Gilda clearly pointed out).
On this list we have heard a lot of complaints (largely from BPO
about the ICT Board's lack of support for the BPO industry, while on the other hand other sector players saying that the Board pays too much attention to BPO. What should the role and obligation of the board in
BPO sector be? Could it be strategic?
What can we say is the role of the BPO/CC Society and it's obligations (both to internal and external stakeholders) in the larger scheme of things?
Regards,
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 11:07 PM, Liko Agosta wrote:
All that you guys are talking about is good ... but when I talk to clients they ask the following questions
a. Can you do the job ?
b. How much will you save me ?
c. Have you done this for anyone else (especially in my sector/country) ?
d. Can I talk to references
1-3 page executive proposals work better than 50 page proposals. C level execs never go past page 3 of proposals. They really don't care where I am working from
Only 1 client asked about Kenyan copyright laws .. and our lawyer gave a sufficient answer... we got the work and have saved them over USD 500,000
About Safaricom and Land Registry and all this projects that keep breaking our hearts and hurting our feelings :) ....
Let's assume Safaricom is has 400 customer services reps .... would
an ideal client for any BPO in Kenya ? if they pay their employees 50k
month .. a BPO would have to charge them 100k per month FOR THE SAME EMPLOYEE across town.
Now, maybe I have all this wrong but there are more than 10000 companies in the developed world with over 400 "clerical employees" who they pay an average of 3000$ per month. If you went and targeted these companies .... you can get 100k per employee, pay the employee 50k etc and the client will be happy, you happy, employee happy ...
Many local clients take 60-90 days to pay invoices. In US for example, depending on state, it's illegal to hold a vendors payment when work has been done ….
My point ... BPOs, Software Providers have to be willing to ignore the local market and focus on external sources of business. The local market is too small, too complicated and the waters are very muddied.
About brokers and "consultants". I have been approached by quite a few. People who claim to have connections, venture capital and all that good stuff. I learnt early to say no… early. They are a waste of time in my book
Kenya will not become a better outsourcing destination if we come up with ethics guidelines, an act of parliament and the like … now, those will not hurt … but we will benefit more if the ICT Board flanked companies when
are pitching their services to potential clients.
By flanking I mean fly to meet the client, do research on financials, help with financing - have a conference in US and invite 100 potential and vetted clients to meet Kenyan providers …. This works like a charm here .. (if GOK spends 500k on tickets and 30 Kenyans are hired making 50k … - ROI is
pretty fast)
If the CEO of the ICT board calls the CEO of ATT he is more likely to get a meeting and business as opposed to the CEO of Kamau Wanjala Outsourcers … again, I don't know what the ICT Board has been doing (am sure they have done a lot … may be like top secret strategy stuff) but in my opinion
On 09/04/2008 "Brian Longwe" <blongwe@gmail.com> wrote: - the players) the they be per they there the
CEO of that board should be based in US for like 90% of the year .. talk to clients, be a rain maker, schmooze, play golf and open doors.
I have always felt that the ICT Board should headhunt and hire people with C level experience from either US or UK … people from the bigger consulting companies Bain, BCG, Accenture, Avanade, EDS … these guys work on million dollar outsourcing deals and have very good contacts. They also would be able to come up with a strategy immediately
As Gilda has shown, the harvest is plentiful …
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
www.verviant.com
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: <9193891551@txt.att.net>9193891551@txt.att.net
-----Original Message-----
From: kictanet-bounces+likoa= <verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [<kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+likoa= verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of David Otwoma
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:45 AM
To: Liko Agosta
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Dear Brian,
Looks like you are fully re-charged after last weeks retreat in
Naivasha on Strategy. Tell us some more of what is not confidential.
Otherwise my wish is to take the baton from my able Chair and respond
on bullet 3 in your beautiful rejoinder.
As Chair of the Standards and Ethics Committee of the KBPOCCS we (are
7 members) did come up with Standards and Ethics Guidelines which took
over eight (8) months to prepare and on June 22nd 2008 the Permanent
Secretary of the Ministry of Information & Communication led us
(KBPOCCS members, KICTB who graciously sponsored the event at KICC,
CCK, CSK, members of the public who have an interest in BPO&CC pie)
into adopting the S&E Guidelines.
The next milestone we wish to aim for is have the Guidelines upgraded
into a Regulation or an Act of Parliament. Either achievement would be
binding to all and sundry who operate in the BPO&CC world. A world
which is moving the advancement of the human race from industrial age
into information age. Just imagine Kenya having a binding law on
Standards and a slice of the USD$310 Billion industry. It would make
our young people, because they are the future force in the knowledge
economy we keep talking about.
What are the next immediate steps. Cozy relations between the Private
Public Partnership.
Another bullet I will let you peer into what you have been seeing but
refuse to acknowledge is bullet No. 7. It was KPLC who introduced me
to the world of BPO&CC when they sought S. African expertise to deal
with their in-house contact centre better known to the general public
(read Brian et al) as Customer Care Centre or Customer Relations
Management. Ever wondered when power disappears at any time of the day
or night where that 'frustrated' call 'agrily demanding 'where is
power?' goes? Yes to a call center owned and managed
by KPLC. KPLC as of 2005 when we engaged had a call centre running
24/7 with 210 seats in Nairobi alone. Telecom has a bigger one.
Safaricom is soon overtaking Telecom with that news flash. Water
companies have. So do all the banks, insurance, etc. companies both
private and public owned.
Since we have very able Chairs for Training, Marketing etc. I will
stop there and go for my dear bottle.....tusker.
David
On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 6:12 PM, Brian Munyao Longwe < <brian@caret.net> brian@caret.net> wrote:
Excellent Feedback Gilda,
So I see a few very clear issues arising out of your response:
1) There is a distinct global opportunity - but that calls for
appropriate positioning as well as preparation on Kenya's part
2) Capacity issues need to be addressed - knowledge transfer could be
on way - but that implies finding someone who is willing to impart
the knowledge - do they come from inside or outside?
3) Global standards must be recognised and adhered to in order to
ensure entry and competitiveness - what are these standards are they
clearly documented somewhere?
4) Many local operations have not had the exposure necessary/needed
to develop expertise/efficiency/etc - what kind of interventions can
facilitate this?
5) BPO is not the "Holy Grail" as some perceive it, but one piece of
the ICT puzzle that needs to be solved in order to help Kenya attain
it's ambitious goal of becoming a global ICT hub
6) There is a distinct and precise training need for personnel to
supply the Kenyan BPO industry with "bodies to put on seats",
presumably to allow the BPO industry to harness and deliver against
the global opportunity - what interventions (planned or otherwise)
are we taking to meet this target? How accurate is this estimate and
can it be verified?
7) Local Players - your website (must say it's very cute) lists quite
a number (28) - but I must say that I'm quite surprised at some of
the names I find there - didn't know KPLC was offering BPO services
for example - but maybe I'm mistaken in my assumptions....
8) Local opportunities: seems many/most local companies are looking
outside to outsource certain functions or simply "self-provisioning"
- why would Safaricom claim that it's too expensive to outsource
locally based on the price estimates that they got from industry. Is
there a need for our local BPO industry to do some kind of soul
searching and find ways of making themselves/their services more
palatable to local companies?
9) The industry for some reason seems to have attracted brokers - who
are watering down/diluting the true opportunity - what kind of
interventions do we need to "eliminate the middleman" - a seemingly
consistent argument in many sector e.g. tea, coffee, flowers, tourism
etc.....
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 4:10 PM, Gilda Odera wrote:
Hi Brian,
You have raised very pertinent questions in your email below.
Let me answer your queries.
Firstly, it is true that BPO has taken centre stage in many
discussions surrounding Kenya's ICT development and growth and it
is a good thing, here's why:
We are looking at a USD$310 Billion industry by next year, up for
grabs for any destinations that get it right. India is currently
taking up 45% of the total share and China and Phillipines are
steadily growing. And what's more, it can only grow, with the fuel
prices soaring each year,what choice is there for the companies out
there to look for more affordable means of operating.
It is a fact that the western countries are looking for new
alternative destinations to Asia so they do not put all their eggs
in one basket, not with the terrorism threats all over. Where else
but Africa. Why would Kenya not put its house in order to take a
piece of this pie?
Now in regard to your comment on BPO taking centre stage in ICT
development, I would say one thing we need in this country is
opportunity for knowledge transfer done right here. We may produce
more technology oriented personnel but as long as we operate within
the Kenyan way of operating, we are not developing our personnel to
the global standards we want them to attain.Not because we are not
capable, but because many operations have not had the exposure.
I would beg to differ (and government can speak for itself) that we
are putting all eggs in one basket. BPO is but one sub-sector in
the ICT arena. Many other sub-sectors within the sector are quite
active. Software development is coming up and I keep reading
debates on KICTANET. There is an interest.
Content development is also being encouraged. The
telecommunications sector is busy preparing for real competition
and we the consumers can't wait for the benefits, they will have to
have great value adds and affordable pricing.
What steps are we taking to enhance BPO? I leave the ICT Board to
answer that although as Kenya BPO and Contact Centre Society, we
have presented to them the need to train not less than 10,000 per
year, specifically for this sector. Frost and Sullivan who are
normally 90% accurate in their new destination analysis says Kenya
will by 2012 have a BPO sector employing about 120,000 direct jobs
( you can add indirect by another 3-5) as long as the fibre optic
infrastructure is in place on time next year and marketing of the
country takes root.
Who are the players? Our members are on our website
<http://www.kenyabposociety.or.ke>www.kenyabposociety.or.ke . There are ofcourse others quietly
operating.
What are the local opportunities- Our biggest challenge is getting
local companies to outsource though some have started. We expected
the giants like Safaricom to play a role even if it is a CSR role
to demonstrate a level of confidence in the local companies. This
is possible, other companies work with those they outsource to for
a given period, and leave them running efficiently as they require.
All is not lost. Some local companies are outsourcing BPO work and
I wish to challenge Safaricom to outsource part of their BPO work
if they say local outsourcing is not competitive.
The international opportunities are the ones that I have mentioned
are worth $310 Billion. The ball is in our court as Kenyans to
market Kenya as a destination if we are to make any gains. We need
to attract direct clients and not the current brokers who are
exploiting the existing centres,much as their contracts are keeping
some of the centres going.
I hope I have addressed your queries.
Gilda Odera
Chair, Kenya BPO and Contact Centre Society
----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Munyao Longwe"
< <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net>
To: "Gilda Odera" < <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke>
Cc: "KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions" < < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:12 AM
Subject: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Hi All,
It is interesting that BPO seems to have taken a centre stage in many
discussions surrounding Kenya's ICT development and growth. While I
do believe that BPO/KPO has huge potential. I am a bit skeptical
about this "silver bullet" approach which might be akin to putting
all our eggs in one basket.
What if the basket gets stepped on by some giant like Malaysia, South
Africa or others?
I would be very interested in taking a much closer look at the BPO
industry in Kenya. Who are the players? What are the opportunities?
What is the potential for growth? What steps are we taking to enhance/
develop/increase capacity in BPO/KPO? What kind(s) of investments are
required to make this industry boom? What are the local opportunities
for BPO/KPO? What are the international opportunities for BPO/KPO?
I think that answers to these and many other questions will help
other like me who are a bit unclear in their minds as to how BPO will
be our saviour have a clearer view. It might also just show that BPO
is a contributing factor and not necessarily the holy grail that at
the moment seems to be the general perception.
Regards,
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 8:25 AM, David Otwoma wrote:
Dear All,
"Comments from BPO operators and of course other Stakeholders"
please.
Safaricom in Sh1bn customer care plan (see Daily Nation page 28)
-------------------------------------------------
Many companies have been turning to BPOs as the financial benefits of
outsourcing continue to make it compelling, with cost savings and
efficiency improvements being the dominant reasons companies use such
services. However, companies biggest concerns on outsourcing
relate to
data security.
-----------------------------------------------------
The move, seen a precautionary measure in the face of growing
competition, marks a complete turnaround by the mobile provider which
in July last year had sought quotations from local Business Process
Outsourcing (BPO) firms.
"Outsourcing the customer care function proved to be too expensive
for
the kind of quality that we required. We will just have to run the
service in-house," said Safaricom chief executive Michael Joseph.
<http://www.nation.co.ke/business/news/-/1006/466372/-/jiyt3xz/-/> http://www.nation.co.ke/business/news/-/1006/466372/-/jiyt3xz/-/
index.html
On Mon, Sep 1, 2008 at 8:58 PM, Sean Moroney
< <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com> wrote:
> Dear Liko,
>
>
>
> We would like to invite you to make a presentation at the
> forthcoming
> Outsourcing & Contact Centre Conference, which we will be holding
> over 4-5
> November under the auspices of the Ministry of Information &
> Communications
> and in partnership with the ICT Board. The programme of confirmed
> presentations so far is attached.
>
>
>
> It would be great if you would be willing to share your experience
> with the
> other participants.
>
>
>
> Yours sincerely,
>
>
>
> Sean Moroney
>
> Chairman
>
> AITEC Africa
>
> <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com
>
> UK Tel: +44(0)1480-880774
>
> UK Fax: +44(0)1480-880765
>
> UK Mobile: +44(0)7973-499224
>
> Kenya Mobile: +254(0)721-845674
>
> Mozambique Mobile: +258-82-6181618
>
> Nigeria Mobile: +234(0)802-0571766
>
> SA Mobile: +27(0)724-577887
>
> Skype: seanmoroney
>
>
> Please visit our discussion group on The Banking Technology sector
> in Africa
> at: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/africanbankingtech> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/africanbankingtech
>
>
>
>
>
> AITEC Africa is the trading name of AITEC Conferences Limited
> UK Company registration number: 4698475
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: kictanet-bounces+seanm= <aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
> [ <kictanet-bounces>mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>
> +seanm= <aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On
> Behalf Of Peres Were
> Sent: 01 September 2008 12:23
> To: <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com
>
> Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions'
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Stakeholder Queries:
>
>
>
> Liko,
>
>
>
> It would be great to hear from you and others, your insights into
> sales and
> marketing insights that can benefit the BPO, KPO sector. We can
> continue the
> discussion off the list.
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> Peres Were
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: kictanet-bounces+pwere= <cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
> [ <kictanet-bounces+pwere=cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+pwere= cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke]
> On Behalf
> Of Liko Agosta
> Sent: 01 September 2008 10:33
> To: <pwere@cascadegl.com>pwere@cascadegl.com
> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Stakeholder Queries:
>
>
>
> About ICT Board and all these Boards …
>
>
>
> Do they ever have open sessions where stakeholders can review
> strategy,
> advice, brainstorm ?
>
>
>
> As CEO of verviant, I have been able to get business … I feel like
> I have
> insights into the sales and marketing process that can benefit other
> software/ICT providers …
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> Liko Agosta, CEO
>
> Verviant Consulting Services.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Phone : 1-919-341-1820
>
> Fax : 1-978-268-8403
>
>
>
> Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
>
>
>
> Pager: <9193891551@txt.att.net>9193891551@txt.att.net
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Brian Longwe < <blongwe@gmail.com>blongwe@gmail.com>
> Date: Aug 29, 2008 9:31 AM
> Subject: Re: [kictanet] ICT Board Strategy a Farce
> To: <wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk>wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk
>
> Very strong language - but I think you should relax as your
> concerns are
> unfounded.
>
> I am at the Strategic retreat. Unfortunately Gilda Odera -
> Chairperson of
> BPO, who was supposed to be present had to cancel at the last
> minute.
>
> Brian
>
> On 8/29/08, Wambui Wakarema < <wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk> wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>
> I have read with surprise the Kictanet mailout from the ICT Board
> claiming
> they are going for a stakeholders strategy workshop in Naivasha.
>
> Who are these stakeholders? Are there any representing the BPO
> sector?? I
> ask this because I have contacted the industry association and
> they dont
> seem
>
> to be in the know either. This is quite bizarre, especially since
> BPO is a
> key sector of the ICT Board's mandate.
>
> Who are the stakeholders from the other ICT sectors? Shouldnt the
> Board be
> getting input from key stakeholders at this workshop.
>
> They are wasting government resources going to write strategies
> and then
> 'presenting' to stakeholders, yet stakeholders should have been
> involved
> from the word go.
>
> The
>
--
David Otwoma,
Chief Science Secretary,
National Council for Science and Technology,
Utalii House 9th Floor,
Mobile tel: +254 722 141771,
Office tel: +254 (0)20 2346915,
P. O. Box 29899 - 00100, Nairobi, Kenya
email: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com & <otwoma@ncst.go.ke> otwoma@ncst.go.ke
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/
mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/
mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40sky <http://web.co.ke>web.co.ke
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com
Unsubscribe or change your options at < http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/otwomad%40gmail.com> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/otwomad%40gmail.com
--
David Otwoma,
Chief Science Secretary,
National Council for Science and Technology,
Utalii House 9th Floor,
Mobile tel: +254 722 141771,
Office tel: +254 (0)20 2346915,
P. O. Box 29899 - 00100, Nairobi, Kenya
email: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com & <otwoma@ncst.go.ke> otwoma@ncst.go.ke
www.ncst.go.ke
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <likoa@verviant.com>likoa@verviant.com
Unsubscribe or change your options at < http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/likoa%40verviant.com
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/likoa%40verviant.com
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net
Unsubscribe or change your options at <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net
------------------------------
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke Unsubscribe or change your options at <
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40skyweb.co.ke
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40skyweb.co.ke
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <blongwe@gmail.com>blongwe@gmail.com Unsubscribe or change your options at <
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/blongwe%40gmail.com>
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/blongwe%40gmail.com
-- Brian Munyao Longwe e-mail: blongwe@gmail.com cell: + 254 722 518 744 blog : http://zinjlog.blogspot.com meta-blog: http://mashilingi.blogspot.com
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: lmwatibo.ktd@gmail.com Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/lmwatibo.ktd%40gmail.co...
Sam, It is rather unfortunate that you are disappointed by my responses, but let us call a spade a spade here. I think you got me wrong, did not say my friend closed shop at all.My friend hasnt closed shop at all despite the bandwidth subsisdy being not forthcoming. His shop, infact they are two friends, their centers are doing so well and growing by the day, and they had set up before the subsidy promises flocked in. This just goes to show at least there are centers who setup BPOs for all the right reasons, and hence they are BOTH WELL DEVELOPED AND WELL EQUIPPED to offer quality services to their clients and hence the reason why they have not closed shop to now. Hope now you are less disapponited. The support the private sector needs from the governmnet in this industry comes at the point of marketing Kenya as an outsourcing destination to international markets. I mean we need to put a face of Kenya out there. So how else shall we achieve this? Of course by having great support from government to help us achieve this. and by great support, I do not mean government to pay pay pay BPO Practitioners, there are many ways the government can support for instance boosting private sector firms in attending international BPO events, in organising marketing and networking events with international buyers etc. It is true that the society and board have to come up with startegies that will put Kenya in the same levels as philipines and the rest. And the time to have this startegies in place is now. Regards, Justin On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 12:42 PM, Sam regee <sam.regee@zenbe.com> wrote:
Justin,
I am disappointed by your responses. The fact that some investor went and spent a lot of money of fitting out their operations does not make them developed, just well equipped. The fact that they closed shop as soon as the bandwidth closed (in the case of your friend - elaborates the issue of concern)
We need to think sequentially for a moment. Everytime you hear the ICT Board mentioned here one can clearly see that the perspective being expressed - sometimes between the lines - is what we want for them to pay for us (BPO practitioners) etc. When I listen to people talking about what it takes to set up a BPO facility, you'd think that it will cost a mere couple of hundred thousand shillings. Certainly I have received a consultant's report that suggested that it will take less than kshs. 1 million to set up. No mention of the marketing function and costs.
It is shallow to suggest that Kenya is competing with Phillipines and India but the corresponding organisations cannot be compared. We are kidding ourselves if we do not expect of the society and the board to operate at the same strategic levels as India,Phillipines, South African etc organisations.
I get the sense that people just have not internalised what it would mean to take a significant slice of the global market - otherwise, we really should be talking mathematics - "it will take (for example) 100,000 seats operating at full capacity for us to be managing 1% of the global BPO revenues.." Our story at that point stops being - as Peres says - merely a "strong revenue generator", that will result in "job creation". Our language would morph from "we couldn't go because of funding..." and other general platitudes.
Competing with the rest of the world requires an uncompromising expectation andunderstanding of what it takes to win and therefore the prize is not for amount of work but results...
I don't know - does anyone feel me?
--------------- Dr. Sam Regeee ZBI I organised my thoughts if you will notice around the subject of business - not just having the office with computers and bandwidth. In my calculations so far, bandwidth only seems to take 16-19% of the business costs and this is calibrated depending on usage (whether work is there or not). over 30% is HR costs. At least 35% is marketing costs. In this sort of thinking one is able to calcuate just what one must invest and over what period of time.
Good day All,
This interesting subject on BPO rather caught my attention intensely I must say :-)
I have just come from the UK a couple of months back and look to setup a contact center locally, now that the industry has begun to pick up amid
hiccups here and there.
And to pick up on some of Sam Regee's points as outlined below, i will also tend to share my findings as well: (My comments are in blue font in commenting to Sam Regee's comments)
1. That much of the BPO sector has been set up in an uncompetitive framework that cannot be sustained. Businesses (for this is what they are) have been set up while factoring heavily the potential government subsidy. --- I have a friend of mine who set up here on Kenya long before the subsidy was in place, and so therefore you cannot base your claims on a few vendors who set up in a rush for the subsidy only to close shop when they realized
the bandwidth wasnt forth-coming at all.Meaning they got in the industry on a wrong foot. There are several which are still operating and have been on since even before the subsidy issue.
2. That the private sector players in the industry are too dependent on government (through the Kenya ICT Board) for marketing and business. Essentially there is too much government in the business of outsourcing here - not from a legislative perspective but from an operational
On 09/04/2008 "Justin Mburu" <jt.alliance@gmail.com> wrote: the that perspective
This is clearly untenable because, having glanced at the Kenya ICT
strategy as articulated by its officials severally, their mandate goes much further than BPO - as at the time they were set up, that is. For sure, I perceive them as a marketing organization but marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.---- Sam if you look clearly, you will realise private sector are not that dependent on government/ICT Board at all. Have you even walked around the existing centers and seen how developed most are? Did government/ICT Board help them get to the levels of development they are in? I think not. If I were you I would visit existing centers first before I leap to claiming the private sector are dependant on government/ICT Board. Or maybe you can shade some light for us on what exactly you mean by ' too dependent' :-) and also it is obvious government has to be involved because if you have been keen on what has been going on since you arrived in the country, you will realise BPO is one of the 5 pillars of the set Vision 2030 which is a government initiative. So whether we like it or not, government has a major role to play in ensuring this industry picks up here in Kenya.
On the note of ICT Board's role in marketing, if you have been keen on all organised BPO/Contact Center events, ICT Board itself has always put itself on the frontline in this events, meaning they themselves are the ones focusing too much on the BPO/Contact center industry and putting so much energy on it, (which is a good thing anyway) , while there are so many ICT things to market on. So I agree with you that ICT Board should focus on marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.
3. That the private sector umbrella body, the Kenya BPO Society - and I have read the discussions by the chairman of the Society here - seems to not articulate well its programmes (at least to my understanding) what they are about overally.---- From my point, the chairman of the society clearly laid out who they are overally, and what they do. And for such a young society, I say kudos to where they are now. You can visit their offices and I am sure they will be more than glad to tell you on a one-on-one basis what they are all about. For all I know, they are doing a great job, and I wish them all the best as they continue to drwa the industry to high depths. Just to give you a bit of what they have achieved so far, so that you can apprecaiate they are on the right direction, they recently launched the Standards & Ethics guidelines for the industry, which I say is a very brilliant step, considering how young the industry is here in Kenya. So it is with such laid guidelines that the BPO industry in Kenya will be able to be laid in a firm solid foundation that is based on international operation standards in BPO & Contact Center industy.
If I were to turn to the BPO Services Association Unlimited ( http://www.bsau.org/), I can see a marketing campaign and a marketing position that they have taken. This came from the outsourcing private sector - and some of their programmes have support from the Phillipino government but the drive is from the private sector. If I look at NASSCOM, I can see that they are private sector led and their main purpose is the
of
India as the leader in BPO services globally. In fact, they start by saying that they are a global organization - which is a position of strength.
Has the BPO Society attained such a level of pedigree - which starts in the mind with strategy - that would enable them to lead the sector to prosperity? I have not heard it in their discussions at the few events where I have had a chance to listen to the Chairperson and other officials of the society.-----My friend, it seems you have really been behind the screens with the society updates. Next week they will be launching their 3 year marketing strategy plan. This is indeed another brilliant step they will have taken as young an association as they are.From one of their forums, I remember them mentioning that one of their strategies is to join hands with several associations globally. This shows great initiative in making sure the industry gets recognized globaly through such relations. It rather unfortunate that the society did not get to participate at the EXPO ZARAGORA 2008 Spain event which from my research had many international associations attending the event such that it could have been an ideal place to network and form relations with the other international associations. I hear the society was to participate but they got a critical hiccup at the last minute (maybe the society chairman can fill us in on what exactly happened for
to miss such a crucial beneficial event). But I hear the CEO of ICT Board Mr Paul Kukubo and a local call center director,attended the event, maybe
can shed more light for us (if they are in the mailing list) what exactly went on in the Spain event and if they managed to secure any opportunities from the event. It is at such events that the society looks to the government support in ensuring they and also some industry players get to attend such events as Kenyan political figures were also present at the event as well as government officials. Such is where much lobbying can take place and the society can lobby their way to getting in beneficial relations with other international associations as well us get prospective clienst for industry players at some point.
Hey and dont you think you are being too harsh on the society by comparing them with giant international BPO industries which definately have giant associations as well? I say give some credit to the Kenya BPO Society
far they have come. So instead of comparing them with big giants, look more into working with them into becoming a giant as well.
Kenya BPO society is also private sector led, its only that the ICT Board takes much of the show (and we are not saying this is a bad thing) hence I think this ends up confusing industry players, and it always ends up looking like the industry is government driven, if you get my point. The government should be there just to support maybe in terms of funding society-organsised BPO events, which are beneficial to all industry players for instance in marketing the country as a BPO destination, etc. But what the government/ICT Board should not do is brand all BPO related shows to be government/ICT Board shows, as this is what makes it all look like the industry in Kenya is government/ICT Board-driven and govt/ICT Board dependant, in stead of being private sector-driven.
c) Has the BPO Society (or the Kenya ICT Board since they are so much in the thick of things here) done a comprehensive marketing plan for the sector - or do they each have one? ---- For all I know, I hear the Kenya BPO society has a marketing strategy which they are launching some time next week. Maybe you should find our more details about it from the society itself, so that you can be able to attend and maybe you will get your answers there. I will be attending, and would really like to meet you
Sam Regee so that we can chit chat about this industry in a more comprehensive way. What do you say? I sure hope to see you there. I never miss society events as they give me hope that there is a light at the end of the tunnel in this BPO industry here in Kenya.
As for ICT Board, I have not heard of any so far.
I hope this has helped you gauge the phase we are at now in this new industry in Kenya.
On a lighter note, what does the ZBI from you signature stand for?
Regards,
Justin
Hi all,
As a recently returned (to Kenya) academic and entrepreneur, with an interest in the BPO sector - explicitly: I want to set up a legal transcription facility here. As I go about my research, I have been to see one or two operations, while I was in my previous engagement a few months ago and I am saddened to note that quite a number of the BPO operations that were in existence a few months ago are no more.
having spoken to a few people in the industry, I am led to form some preliminary conclusions (which I hope to validate here): I apologise in advance, if I offend, but it is in a positive spirit, that I advance
thoughts here.
1. That much of the BPO sector has been set up in an uncompetitive framework that cannot be sustained. Businesses (for this is what they are) have been set up while factoring heavily the potential government subsidy.
2. That the private sector players in the industry are too dependent on government (through the Kenya ICT Board) for marketing and business. Essentially there is too much government in the business of outsourcing here - not from a legislative perspective but from an operational
This is clearly untenable because, having glanced at the Kenya ICT
Board's
strategy as articulated by its officials severally, their mandate goes much further than BPO - as at the time they were set up, that is. For sure, I perceive them as a marketing organization but marketing Kenya's overall ICT rather than just IT enabled services.
3. That the private sector umbrella body, the Kenya BPO Society - and I have read the discussions by the chairman of the Society here - seems to not articulate well its programmes (at least to my understanding) what they are about overally.
If I were to turn to the BPO Services Association Unlimited ( http://www.bsau.org/), I can see a marketing campaign and a marketing position that they have taken. This came from the outsourcing private sector - and some of their programmes have support from the Phillipino government but the drive is from the private sector. If I look at NASSCOM, I can see that they are private sector led and their main purpose is the
India as the leader in BPO services globally. In fact, they start by saying that they are a global organization - which is a position of strength.
Has the BPO Society attained such a level of pedigree - which starts in
mind with strategy - that would enable them to lead the sector to prosperity? I have not heard it in their discussions at the few events where I have had a chance to listen to the Chairperson and other officials of
society.
These are preliminary thoughts that I have developed and I would be happy to see them examined and torn apart and validated as the case may be.
meanwhile, some pointed questions:
a) Is there any science to a slice of the $310 Billion opportunity presented by the society? This is to ask, how many seats would we need to have to have a 1% slice of the opportunity?
b) How many BPO operators are there now - and more pointedly - how many are actually functional?
c) Has the BPO Society (or the Kenya ICT Board since they are so much in
of the the the
thick of things here) done a comprehensive marketing plan for the sector - or do they each have one?
This is a very good discussion.
------------------------------- Dr. Sam Regee ZBI
null
On 09/04/2008 "Brian Longwe" <blongwe@gmail.com> wrote:
This message bounced back yesterday - seems the listserver is having some constipation....
Brian
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Brian Munyao Longwe <blongwe@gmail.com> Date: Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 5:35 PM Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:) To: Liko Agosta <likoa@verviant.com> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Hi Liko,
Sorry, I was driving with one hand n texting with the other (usinistaki). Thus the v brief response. Pls so feel free to share your views with
rest of the list, we NEED to hear from practitioners! As mentioned,
discussion should help she'd some light on this relatively 'new' industry so that inner and outer stakeholders can develop a better understanding.
It would also be great to hear from the ICT Board (hint hint) - although they're probably a bit gun-shy right because they don't want to be flamed.
On your point regarding the CEO being 'seconded' to the USA for an extended period... Hmmm... Maybe not... BUT.... Your suggestion about high level representation makes sense. How about a full fledged office, maybe with Dep.CEO ranking.... Dunno...just thoughts....
Nway, please do share ur thoughts, ideas, suggestions, challenges, headaches, the lot!
Brian
Sent from my iPhone
On 03 Sep 2008, at 4:37 PM, "Liko Agosta" <likoa@verviant.com> wrote:
Brian
I don't mind taking a call from you to explain what has happened and where Kenya is and some ideas about the best way forward
Obviously, I will be looking at life from a providers point of view …
Also, which organization do you represent ?
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
<http://www.verviant.com>www.verviant.com
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: 9193891551@txt.att.net
*From:* kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [ mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+likoa= verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] *On Behalf Of *Gilda Odera *Sent:* Wednesday, September 03, 2008 4:16 AM *To:* Liko Agosta *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Hi Brian,
If you recall, initially the ICT Board was created mainly " to market Kenya as an outsourcing destination". I think many other things were lumped onto the board without putting structures in place ie. personnel and budgets.
On another note, I am surprised you are still asking about the role and obligations of KBPOCCS after the lengthy emails.
Maybe you should re-read them?:)
It is true there is more shouting from BPO players in KICTANET,media, everwhere..... maybe the others are content or indifferent....
That should not stop the BPO Sector from airing views or making demands. Remember your ISP days? You and some others in the ISP arena were very vocal and that impacted on various other sub-sectors who benefited.
I say, if there is an issue that needs attention, it needs to be known. I would suggest that the other sub-sectors also start shouting out
issues that they want to see being resolved. We are all inter-connected so any gains will benefit all others.
Can someone from the ICT Board please say something? Is it true you are being blamed by others for focusing too much on BPO and if so, how are you balancing the act?
Best
Gilda
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Brian Munyao Longwe <brian@caret.net>
*To:* Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke>
*Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 03, 2008 8:55 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Great input Lika. Seems like you have a real handle on this industry. If I may recap:
Clients (I presume these are international) gauge a BPO provider
on
four main criteria:
a) Capability: This speaks to an area of skillset matching across industry
do we have enough "intel" on the necessary skillsets so that if someone wants to outsource their transcription of recorded audio court records or psychiatric interviews - the BPO operators personnel understand enough about the subject matter to capture the relevant language (don't know if
a
good example but it's what comes to mind)
b) Cost-cutting potential: If the customer is the one asking this question, then it seems that they expect the BPO operator to have alread studied to some extent their business, at` least enough to understand ways in which savings can be accrued.
c) Referenceable clients
If the CEO of the ICT board calls the CEO of ATT he is more likely to get a meeting and business as opposed to the CEO of Kamau Wanjala Outsourcers … again, I don't know what the ICT Board has been doing (am sure they have done a lot … may be like top secret strategy stuff) but in my opinion
CEO of that board should be based in US for like 90% of the year .. talk to clients, be a rain maker, schmooze, play golf and open doors.
This belies the assumptions and perceptions on which I initiated this thread. For some reason there seems to be some kind of implicit expectation that the ICT Board exists to servie the BPO industry - why is that? Kenya's ICT is definitely much more than just BPO (as Gilda clearly pointed out).
On this list we have heard a lot of complaints (largely from BPO
is the players)
about the ICT Board's lack of support for the BPO industry, while on
other hand other sector players saying that the Board pays too much attention to BPO. What should the role and obligation of the board in the BPO sector be? Could it be strategic?
What can we say is the role of the BPO/CC Society and it's obligations (both to internal and external stakeholders) in the larger scheme of
Regards,
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 11:07 PM, Liko Agosta wrote:
All that you guys are talking about is good ... but when I talk to
they ask the following questions
a. Can you do the job ?
b. How much will you save me ?
c. Have you done this for anyone else (especially in my sector/country) ?
d. Can I talk to references
1-3 page executive proposals work better than 50 page proposals. C level execs never go past page 3 of proposals. They really don't care where I am working from
Only 1 client asked about Kenyan copyright laws .. and our lawyer gave a sufficient answer... we got the work and have saved them over USD 500,000
About Safaricom and Land Registry and all this projects that keep breaking our hearts and hurting our feelings :) ....
Let's assume Safaricom is has 400 customer services reps .... would
an ideal client for any BPO in Kenya ? if they pay their employees 50k
clients they be per
month .. a BPO would have to charge them 100k per month FOR THE SAME EMPLOYEE across town.
Now, maybe I have all this wrong but there are more than 10000 companies in the developed world with over 400 "clerical employees" who they pay an average of 3000$ per month. If you went and targeted these companies .... you can get 100k per employee, pay the employee 50k etc and the client will be happy, you happy, employee happy ...
Many local clients take 60-90 days to pay invoices. In US for example, depending on state, it's illegal to hold a vendors payment when work has been done ….
My point ... BPOs, Software Providers have to be willing to ignore
market and focus on external sources of business. The local market is too small, too complicated and the waters are very muddied.
About brokers and "consultants". I have been approached by quite a few. People who claim to have connections, venture capital and all that good stuff. I learnt early to say no… early. They are a waste of time in my book
Kenya will not become a better outsourcing destination if we come up with ethics guidelines, an act of parliament and the like … now, those will not hurt … but we will benefit more if the ICT Board flanked companies when
are pitching their services to potential clients.
By flanking I mean fly to meet the client, do research on financials, help with financing - have a conference in US and invite 100 potential and vetted clients to meet Kenyan providers …. This works like a charm here .. (if GOK spends 500k on tickets and 30 Kenyans are hired making 50k … - ROI is
pretty fast)
If the CEO of the ICT board calls the CEO of ATT he is more likely to get a meeting and business as opposed to the CEO of Kamau Wanjala Outsourcers … again, I don't know what the ICT Board has been doing (am sure they have done a lot … may be like top secret strategy stuff) but in my opinion
local they there the
CEO of that board should be based in US for like 90% of the year .. talk to clients, be a rain maker, schmooze, play golf and open doors.
I have always felt that the ICT Board should headhunt and hire people with C level experience from either US or UK … people from the bigger consulting companies Bain, BCG, Accenture, Avanade, EDS … these guys work on million dollar outsourcing deals and have very good contacts. They also would be able to come up with a strategy immediately
As Gilda has shown, the harvest is plentiful …
Liko Agosta, CEO
Verviant Consulting Services.
www.verviant.com
Phone : 1-919-341-1820
Fax : 1-978-268-8403
Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
Pager: <9193891551@txt.att.net>9193891551@txt.att.net
-----Original Message-----
From: kictanet-bounces+likoa= <verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [<kictanet-bounces+likoa=verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+likoa= verviant.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of David Otwoma
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:45 AM
To: Liko Agosta
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
Subject: Re: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Dear Brian,
Looks like you are fully re-charged after last weeks retreat in
Naivasha on Strategy. Tell us some more of what is not confidential.
Otherwise my wish is to take the baton from my able Chair and respond
on bullet 3 in your beautiful rejoinder.
As Chair of the Standards and Ethics Committee of the KBPOCCS we (are
7 members) did come up with Standards and Ethics Guidelines which took
over eight (8) months to prepare and on June 22nd 2008 the Permanent
Secretary of the Ministry of Information & Communication led us
(KBPOCCS members, KICTB who graciously sponsored the event at KICC,
CCK, CSK, members of the public who have an interest in BPO&CC pie)
into adopting the S&E Guidelines.
The next milestone we wish to aim for is have the Guidelines upgraded
into a Regulation or an Act of Parliament. Either achievement would be
binding to all and sundry who operate in the BPO&CC world. A world
which is moving the advancement of the human race from industrial age
into information age. Just imagine Kenya having a binding law on
Standards and a slice of the USD$310 Billion industry. It would make
our young people, because they are the future force in the knowledge
economy we keep talking about.
What are the next immediate steps. Cozy relations between the Private
Public Partnership.
Another bullet I will let you peer into what you have been seeing but
refuse to acknowledge is bullet No. 7. It was KPLC who introduced me
to the world of BPO&CC when they sought S. African expertise to deal
with their in-house contact centre better known to the general public
(read Brian et al) as Customer Care Centre or Customer Relations
Management. Ever wondered when power disappears at any time of the day
or night where that 'frustrated' call 'agrily demanding 'where is
power?' goes? Yes to a call center owned and managed
by KPLC. KPLC as of 2005 when we engaged had a call centre running
24/7 with 210 seats in Nairobi alone. Telecom has a bigger one.
Safaricom is soon overtaking Telecom with that news flash. Water
companies have. So do all the banks, insurance, etc. companies both
private and public owned.
Since we have very able Chairs for Training, Marketing etc. I will
stop there and go for my dear bottle.....tusker.
David
On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 6:12 PM, Brian Munyao Longwe < < brian@caret.net> brian@caret.net> wrote:
Excellent Feedback Gilda,
So I see a few very clear issues arising out of your response:
1) There is a distinct global opportunity - but that calls for
appropriate positioning as well as preparation on Kenya's part
2) Capacity issues need to be addressed - knowledge transfer could be
on way - but that implies finding someone who is willing to impart
the knowledge - do they come from inside or outside?
3) Global standards must be recognised and adhered to in order to
ensure entry and competitiveness - what are these standards are
clearly documented somewhere?
4) Many local operations have not had the exposure necessary/needed
to develop expertise/efficiency/etc - what kind of interventions
can
facilitate this?
5) BPO is not the "Holy Grail" as some perceive it, but one piece
of
the ICT puzzle that needs to be solved in order to help Kenya
attain
it's ambitious goal of becoming a global ICT hub
6) There is a distinct and precise training need for personnel to
supply the Kenyan BPO industry with "bodies to put on seats",
presumably to allow the BPO industry to harness and deliver against
the global opportunity - what interventions (planned or otherwise)
are we taking to meet this target? How accurate is this estimate
and
can it be verified?
7) Local Players - your website (must say it's very cute) lists
quite
a number (28) - but I must say that I'm quite surprised at some of
the names I find there - didn't know KPLC was offering BPO services
for example - but maybe I'm mistaken in my assumptions....
8) Local opportunities: seems many/most local companies are looking
outside to outsource certain functions or simply
"self-provisioning"
- why would Safaricom claim that it's too expensive to outsource
locally based on the price estimates that they got from industry.
Is
there a need for our local BPO industry to do some kind of soul
searching and find ways of making themselves/their services more
palatable to local companies?
9) The industry for some reason seems to have attracted brokers -
who
are watering down/diluting the true opportunity - what kind of
interventions do we need to "eliminate the middleman" - a seemingly
consistent argument in many sector e.g. tea, coffee, flowers,
tourism
etc.....
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 4:10 PM, Gilda Odera wrote:
Hi Brian,
You have raised very pertinent questions in your email below.
Let me answer your queries.
Firstly, it is true that BPO has taken centre stage in many
discussions surrounding Kenya's ICT development and growth and it
is a good thing, here's why:
We are looking at a USD$310 Billion industry by next year, up for
grabs for any destinations that get it right. India is currently
taking up 45% of the total share and China and Phillipines are
steadily growing. And what's more, it can only grow, with the fuel
prices soaring each year,what choice is there for the companies
out
there to look for more affordable means of operating.
It is a fact that the western countries are looking for new
alternative destinations to Asia so they do not put all their eggs
in one basket, not with the terrorism threats all over. Where else
but Africa. Why would Kenya not put its house in order to take a
piece of this pie?
Now in regard to your comment on BPO taking centre stage in ICT
development, I would say one thing we need in this country is
opportunity for knowledge transfer done right here. We may produce
more technology oriented personnel but as long as we operate
within
the Kenyan way of operating, we are not developing our personnel
to
the global standards we want them to attain.Not because we are not
capable, but because many operations have not had the exposure.
I would beg to differ (and government can speak for itself) that
we
are putting all eggs in one basket. BPO is but one sub-sector in
the ICT arena. Many other sub-sectors within the sector are quite
active. Software development is coming up and I keep reading
debates on KICTANET. There is an interest.
Content development is also being encouraged. The
telecommunications sector is busy preparing for real competition
and we the consumers can't wait for the benefits, they will have
to
have great value adds and affordable pricing.
What steps are we taking to enhance BPO? I leave the ICT Board to
answer that although as Kenya BPO and Contact Centre Society, we
have presented to them the need to train not less than 10,000 per
year, specifically for this sector. Frost and Sullivan who are
normally 90% accurate in their new destination analysis says
Kenya
will by 2012 have a BPO sector employing about 120,000 direct jobs
( you can add indirect by another 3-5) as long as the fibre optic
infrastructure is in place on time next year and marketing of the
country takes root.
Who are the players? Our members are on our website
<http://www.kenyabposociety.or.ke>www.kenyabposociety.or.ke .
There are
ofcourse others quietly
operating.
What are the local opportunities- Our biggest challenge is getting
local companies to outsource though some have started. We expected
the giants like Safaricom to play a role even if it is a CSR role
to demonstrate a level of confidence in the local companies. This
is possible, other companies work with those they outsource to for
a given period, and leave them running efficiently as they require.
All is not lost. Some local companies are outsourcing BPO work and
I wish to challenge Safaricom to outsource part of their BPO work
if they say local outsourcing is not competitive.
The international opportunities are the ones that I have mentioned
are worth $310 Billion. The ball is in our court as Kenyans to
market Kenya as a destination if we are to make any gains. We need
to attract direct clients and not the current brokers who are
exploiting the existing centres,much as their contracts are keeping
some of the centres going.
I hope I have addressed your queries.
Gilda Odera
Chair, Kenya BPO and Contact Centre Society
----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Munyao Longwe"
< <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net>
To: "Gilda Odera" < <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke>
Cc: "KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions" < < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:12 AM
Subject: [kictanet] BPO Industry Review (was Re: Stakeholder Queries:)
Hi All,
It is interesting that BPO seems to have taken a centre stage in many
discussions surrounding Kenya's ICT development and growth. While I
do believe that BPO/KPO has huge potential. I am a bit skeptical
about this "silver bullet" approach which might be akin to putting
all our eggs in one basket.
What if the basket gets stepped on by some giant like Malaysia, South
Africa or others?
I would be very interested in taking a much closer look at the BPO
industry in Kenya. Who are the players? What are the opportunities?
What is the potential for growth? What steps are we taking to enhance/
develop/increase capacity in BPO/KPO? What kind(s) of investments are
required to make this industry boom? What are the local opportunities
for BPO/KPO? What are the international opportunities for BPO/KPO?
I think that answers to these and many other questions will help
other like me who are a bit unclear in their minds as to how BPO will
be our saviour have a clearer view. It might also just show that BPO
is a contributing factor and not necessarily the holy grail that at
the moment seems to be the general perception.
Regards,
Brian
On Sep 2, 2008, at 8:25 AM, David Otwoma wrote:
> Dear All,
>
> "Comments from BPO operators and of course other Stakeholders"
> please.
>
> Safaricom in Sh1bn customer care plan (see Daily Nation page 28)
>
> -------------------------------------------------
>
> Many companies have been turning to BPOs as the financial benefits of
> outsourcing continue to make it compelling, with cost savings and
> efficiency improvements being the dominant reasons companies use such
> services. However, companies biggest concerns on outsourcing
> relate to
> data security.
>
>
> -----------------------------------------------------
>
> The move, seen a precautionary measure in the face of growing
> competition, marks a complete turnaround by the mobile provider which
> in July last year had sought quotations from local Business Process
> Outsourcing (BPO) firms.
>
> "Outsourcing the customer care function proved to be too expensive
> for
> the kind of quality that we required. We will just have to run
> service in-house," said Safaricom chief executive Michael Joseph.
>
>
> <
http://www.nation.co.ke/business/news/-/1006/466372/-/jiyt3xz/-/>
http://www.nation.co.ke/business/news/-/1006/466372/-/jiyt3xz/-/
> index.html
>
>
> On Mon, Sep 1, 2008 at 8:58 PM, Sean Moroney
> < <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com> wrote:
>> Dear Liko,
>>
>>
>>
>> We would like to invite you to make a presentation at the
>> forthcoming
>> Outsourcing & Contact Centre Conference, which we will be holding
>> over 4-5
>> November under the auspices of the Ministry of Information &
>> Communications
>> and in partnership with the ICT Board. The programme of confirmed
>> presentations so far is attached.
>>
>>
>>
>> It would be great if you would be willing to share your experience
>> with the
>> other participants.
>>
>>
>>
>> Yours sincerely,
>>
>>
>>
>> Sean Moroney
>>
>> Chairman
>>
>> AITEC Africa
>>
>> <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com
>>
>> UK Tel: +44(0)1480-880774
>>
>> UK Fax: +44(0)1480-880765
>>
>> UK Mobile: +44(0)7973-499224
>>
>> Kenya Mobile: +254(0)721-845674
>>
>> Mozambique Mobile: +258-82-6181618
>>
>> Nigeria Mobile: +234(0)802-0571766
>>
>> SA Mobile: +27(0)724-577887
>>
>> Skype: seanmoroney
>>
>>
>> Please visit our discussion group on The Banking Technology sector
>> in Africa
>> at: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/africanbankingtech> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/africanbankingtech
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> AITEC Africa is the trading name of AITEC Conferences Limited
>> UK Company registration number: 4698475
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> From: kictanet-bounces+seanm= <aitecafrica.com@
aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
>> [ <kictanet-bounces>mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>
>> +seanm= <aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> aitecafrica.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On
>> Behalf Of Peres Were
>> Sent: 01 September 2008 12:23
>> To: <seanm@aitecafrica.com>seanm@aitecafrica.com
>>
>> Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions'
>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Stakeholder Queries:
>>
>>
>>
>> Liko,
>>
>>
>>
>> It would be great to hear from you and others, your insights
into
>> sales and
>> marketing insights that can benefit the BPO, KPO sector. We can
>> continue the
>> discussion off the list.
>>
>>
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>>
>>
>> Peres Were
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> From: kictanet-bounces+pwere= <cascadegl.com@
cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
>> [ <kictanet-bounces+pwere=cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> mailto:kictanet-bounces <kictanet-bounces>+pwere= cascadegl.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke]
>> On Behalf
>> Of Liko Agosta
>> Sent: 01 September 2008 10:33
>> To: <pwere@cascadegl.com>pwere@cascadegl.com
>> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Stakeholder Queries:
>>
>>
>>
>> About ICT Board and all these Boards …
>>
>>
>>
>> Do they ever have open sessions where stakeholders can review
>> strategy,
>> advice, brainstorm ?
>>
>>
>>
>> As CEO of verviant, I have been able to get business … I feel
>> I have
>> insights into the sales and marketing process that can benefit
other
>> software/ICT providers …
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>>
>> Liko Agosta, CEO
>>
>> Verviant Consulting Services.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Phone : 1-919-341-1820
>>
>> Fax : 1-978-268-8403
>>
>>
>>
>> Toll Free: 1-866-551-4935
>>
>>
>>
>> Pager: <9193891551@txt.att.net>9193891551@txt.att.net
>>
>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>> From: Brian Longwe < <blongwe@gmail.com>blongwe@gmail.com>
>> Date: Aug 29, 2008 9:31 AM
>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] ICT Board Strategy a Farce
>> To: <wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk>wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk
>>
>> Very strong language - but I think you should relax as your
>> concerns are
>> unfounded.
>>
>> I am at the Strategic retreat. Unfortunately Gilda Odera -
>> Chairperson of
>> BPO, who was supposed to be present had to cancel at the last
>> minute.
>>
>> Brian
>>
>> On 8/29/08, Wambui Wakarema < <wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk> wambuiwakarema@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> I have read with surprise the Kictanet mailout from the ICT
Board
>> claiming
>> they are going for a stakeholders strategy workshop in Naivasha.
>>
>> Who are these stakeholders? Are there any representing the BPO
>> sector?? I
>> ask this because I have contacted the industry association and
>> they dont
>> seem
>>
>> to be in the know either. This is quite bizarre, especially
since
>> BPO is a
>> key sector of the ICT Board's mandate.
>>
>> Who are the stakeholders from the other ICT sectors? Shouldnt
Board's promotion them they this there these perspective. promotion the this their based this the things? the they the lists.kictanet.or.ke lists.kictanet.or.ke> like the
>> Board be
>> getting input from key stakeholders at this workshop.
>>
>> They are wasting government resources going to write strategies
>> and then
>> 'presenting' to stakeholders, yet stakeholders should have been
>> involved
>> from the word go.
>>
>> The
>>
>
>
> --
> David Otwoma,
> Chief Science Secretary,
> National Council for Science and Technology,
> Utalii House 9th Floor,
> Mobile tel: +254 722 141771,
> Office tel: +254 (0)20 2346915,
> P. O. Box 29899 - 00100, Nairobi, Kenya
> email: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com & <otwoma@ncst.go.ke
otwoma@ncst.go.ke
>
> _______________________________________________
> kictanet mailing list
> <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
> <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
>
> This message was sent to: <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net
> Unsubscribe or change your options at < http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/
> mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <godera@skyweb.co.ke> godera@skyweb.co.ke
Unsubscribe or change your options at < http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/
mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40sky <http://web.co.ke>web.co.ke
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com
Unsubscribe or change your options at < http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/otwomad%40gmail.com
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/otwomad%40gmail.com
--
David Otwoma,
Chief Science Secretary,
National Council for Science and Technology,
Utalii House 9th Floor,
Mobile tel: +254 722 141771,
Office tel: +254 (0)20 2346915,
P. O. Box 29899 - 00100, Nairobi, Kenya
email: <otwomad@gmail.com>otwomad@gmail.com & <otwoma@ncst.go.ke> otwoma@ncst.go.ke
www.ncst.go.ke
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <likoa@verviant.com>likoa@verviant.com
Unsubscribe or change your options at <
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/likoa%40verviant.com
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/likoa%40verviant.com
_______________________________________________
kictanet mailing list
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
<http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <brian@caret.net>brian@caret.net
Unsubscribe or change your options at <
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net>
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/brian%40caret.net
------------------------------
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke <http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <godera@skyweb.co.ke>godera@skyweb.co.ke Unsubscribe or change your options at <
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40skyweb.co.ke
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/godera%40skyweb.co.ke
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: <blongwe@gmail.com>blongwe@gmail.com Unsubscribe or change your options at <
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/blongwe%40gmail.com
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/blongwe%40gmail.com
-- Brian Munyao Longwe e-mail: blongwe@gmail.com cell: + 254 722 518 744 blog : http://zinjlog.blogspot.com meta-blog: http://mashilingi.blogspot.com
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: lmwatibo.ktd@gmail.com Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/lmwatibo.ktd%40gmail.co...
participants (6)
-
Bill Kagai -
Gilda Odera -
Justin Mburu -
Liko Agosta -
Peres Were -
Sam regee