Under what conditions should we shut down twitter, internet, radio, TV in Kenya?
Dear listers We need to take this seriously. We have a big election coming up, and given the potential candidates, election violence is a real possibility. We have an opportunity here to prepare for the deluge. Under what conditions should we look at shutting down communication? What level of hate speech justifies it? Who determines what hate speech is? Should twitter be shut down before the election? or should we have a text to tweet system, where hate speech can be filtered? Lets crowdsource this issue!!! Yours, Warigia On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 8:31 AM, Song, Stephen <stephen.song@gmail.com>wrote:
On 3 December 2012 16:11, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
Kivuva,
On Mon, Dec 3, 2012 at 2:30 PM, Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> wrote:
That is a very detailed and philosophical approach by Walu.
Speaking for the mwananchi at the grassroots, if switching of the Internet and broadcast media can foster unity by preventing transmission of hate and unhealthy debates, then they should be switched off
Perhaps you should ask the mwananchi how they feel about having their right to communicate taken away from them in the name of "security".
As Benjamin Franklin once said: “They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”
On the one hand I agree with that quotation with all my heart, yet at the same I think it is true that if someone had managed to shut down the radio transmitters in 1994 in Rwanda millions of lives might have been saved. The Internet is an extremely powerful tool and as more and more people have affordable access to it, it becomes even more so. Ben Franklin's good friend Voltaire said "Avec le grand pouvoir vient le grand devoir" (With great power comes great responsibility). Figuring this out is going to be a long and complex discussion and I think it is unlikely that absolutes are the answer. To me it feels like we need some kind of damping mechanisms for the Internet that slow down a technological decision whether it be censorship or otherwise so that humans can catch up with the implications, so that they can be dealt with in a process, democratic, negotiated, or otherwise. It does feel like technology has run ahead of nation states and that more than anything we need more effective social and political systems that can cope with our multiple allegiances and identities these days.
-Steve
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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-- Steve Song +1 902 529 0046 +27 83 482 2088 (SMS only) http://manypossibilities.net http://villagetelco.org
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Dr. Warigia Bowman Assistant Professor Clinton School of Public Service University of Arkansas wbowman@clintonschool.uasys.edu http://democratizingegypt.blogspot.com ------------------------------------------------- View my research on my SSRN Author page: http://ssrn.com/author=1479660 --------------------------------------------------
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 10:36 AM, Warigia Bowman <warigia@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear listers
We need to take this seriously. We have a big election coming up, and given the potential candidates, election violence is a real possibility.
We have an opportunity here to prepare for the deluge.
Under what conditions should we look at shutting down communication?
There are no conditions under which Article 19 of the UDHR should be violated. What
level of hate speech justifies it?
none Who determines what hate speech is?
Should twitter be shut down before the election? or should we have a text to tweet system, where hate speech can be filtered?
This is censorship, which in my value system is never a good thing! -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
On 4 December 2012 13:03, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 10:36 AM, Warigia Bowman <warigia@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear listers
We need to take this seriously. We have a big election coming up, and given the potential candidates, election violence is a real possibility.
We have an opportunity here to prepare for the deluge.
Under what conditions should we look at shutting down communication?
There are no conditions under which Article 19 of the UDHR should be violated.
Really? Even if they are directly encouraging and enabling the contravention of Article 3 (the right to life, liberty and security of person)? Wouldn't Article 30 apply in this instance when it says "Nothing in this Declaration may be interpreted as implying for any State, group or person any right to engage in any activity or to perform any act aimed at the destruction of any of the rights and freedoms set forth herein."? -Steve
What
level of hate speech justifies it?
none
Who determines what hate speech is?
Should twitter be shut down before the election? or should we have a text to tweet system, where hate speech can be filtered?
This is censorship, which in my value system is never a good thing!
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Steve Song +1 902 529 0046 +27 83 482 2088 (SMS only) http://manypossibilities.net http://villagetelco.org
Wanachi, ninataka kujua kuhusu mambo hii! Ni muhimu. Ongea tafadhali! Folks, this is not so far fetched. We could have a violence/hate speech issue arising in March. Can we prepare in advance? walu, where are you? On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 1:22 PM, Song, Stephen <stephen.song@gmail.com>wrote:
On 4 December 2012 13:03, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 10:36 AM, Warigia Bowman <warigia@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear listers
We need to take this seriously. We have a big election coming up, and given the potential candidates, election violence is a real possibility.
We have an opportunity here to prepare for the deluge.
Under what conditions should we look at shutting down communication?
There are no conditions under which Article 19 of the UDHR should be violated.
Really? Even if they are directly encouraging and enabling the contravention of Article 3 (the right to life, liberty and security of person)? Wouldn't Article 30 apply in this instance when it says "Nothing in this Declaration may be interpreted as implying for any State, group or person any right to engage in any activity or to perform any act aimed at the destruction of any of the rights and freedoms set forth herein."?
-Steve
What
level of hate speech justifies it?
none
Who determines what hate speech is?
Should twitter be shut down before the election? or should we have a text to tweet system, where hate speech can be filtered?
This is censorship, which in my value system is never a good thing!
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Steve Song +1 902 529 0046 +27 83 482 2088 (SMS only) http://manypossibilities.net http://villagetelco.org
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Dr. Warigia Bowman Assistant Professor Clinton School of Public Service University of Arkansas wbowman@clintonschool.uasys.edu http://democratizingegypt.blogspot.com ------------------------------------------------- View my research on my SSRN Author page: http://ssrn.com/author=1479660 --------------------------------------------------
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to think that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it. If there's a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets that standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down. The example I have in mind is the radio host who, during PEV in 2007-8, broadcast details of the location of vulnerable people. Daniel Waweru, 22 Hai Phen, Bodoni, Caissa Superiore, Republic of San Serriffe On 4 December 2012 23:45, Warigia Bowman <warigia@gmail.com> wrote:
Wanachi, ninataka kujua kuhusu mambo hii! Ni muhimu. Ongea tafadhali!
Folks, this is not so far fetched. We could have a violence/hate speech issue arising in March. Can we prepare in advance?
walu, where are you?
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 1:22 PM, Song, Stephen <stephen.song@gmail.com>wrote:
On 4 December 2012 13:03, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 10:36 AM, Warigia Bowman <warigia@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear listers
We need to take this seriously. We have a big election coming up, and given the potential candidates, election violence is a real possibility.
We have an opportunity here to prepare for the deluge.
Under what conditions should we look at shutting down communication?
There are no conditions under which Article 19 of the UDHR should be violated.
Really? Even if they are directly encouraging and enabling the contravention of Article 3 (the right to life, liberty and security of person)? Wouldn't Article 30 apply in this instance when it says "Nothing in this Declaration may be interpreted as implying for any State, group or person any right to engage in any activity or to perform any act aimed at the destruction of any of the rights and freedoms set forth herein."?
-Steve
What
level of hate speech justifies it?
none
Who determines what hate speech is?
Should twitter be shut down before the election? or should we have a text to tweet system, where hate speech can be filtered?
This is censorship, which in my value system is never a good thing!
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Steve Song +1 902 529 0046 +27 83 482 2088 (SMS only) http://manypossibilities.net http://villagetelco.org
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Dr. Warigia Bowman Assistant Professor Clinton School of Public Service University of Arkansas wbowman@clintonschool.uasys.edu http://democratizingegypt.blogspot.com ------------------------------------------------- View my research on my SSRN Author page: http://ssrn.com/author=1479660 --------------------------------------------------
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to think that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper. If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences. If there's
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets that standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease. That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown. that's is my 2 bob anyway. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done? If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location. The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :) Best Regard, Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570 email: baiju@tele2media.com On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote: On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to think that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper. If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences. If there's
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets that standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease. That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown. that's is my 2 bob anyway. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/baiju%40tele2media.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Listers, I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it. There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind. Victor On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com> wrote:
There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done?
If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location.
The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :)
Best Regard,
Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570 email: baiju@tele2media.com
On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote: think
that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper.
If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences.
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets
If there's that
standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease.
That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown.
that's is my 2 bob anyway.
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B ==================================================== *“Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar *
Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech. At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted") And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn... 2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com>
Listers,
I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it.
There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind.
Victor
On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com> wrote:
There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done?
If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location.
The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :)
Best Regard,
Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570 email: baiju@tele2media.com
On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote: think
that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper.
If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences.
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets
If there's that
standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease.
That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown.
that's is my 2 bob anyway.
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B
==================================================== *“Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar*
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu
I tend to be a bit of a skeptic when it come to these "on paper" rights which we sometimes harp on about ad nauseum and ironically in environments where few of these rights are upheld or preserved. We live in a world where there is so much inequity and iniquity and I do not think we can always afford to please everyone all the time. Freedom of speech or right to life? If I was in charge of national security, I'd not think twice about violating anyone's freedom of speech rights if innocent people are getting killed. I'd turn off the internet and broadcasting without batting an eye-lid. I'm sure the people whose freedom of speech I have violated will not fall ill and die. They will live - of course they will grumble endlessly like the people Moses led out of Egypt. For its man's nature to grumble and never be content. Overall it'd be about the GREATER good. In a third world country, lets not waste money on monitoring the internet, investigating online, etc etc. esp after the fact and once the damage has been done. We all know how that goes. All in the name of protecting freedom of speech and so we can keep the internet open for 5% of the population yet we are dire need for schools, healthcare, security etc for 99% of the population. Did I mention security? When we reach such a stage that we have met BASIC rights and needs...and have the resources to spare- then we can attempt that balancing act. My two cents. On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com> wrote:
Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech.
At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted")
And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn...
2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com>
Listers,
I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it.
There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind.
Victor
On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com> wrote:
There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done?
If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location.
The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :)
Best Regard,
Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570 email: baiju@tele2media.com
On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to think that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper.
If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences.
If there's
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets that standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease.
That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown.
that's is my 2 bob anyway.
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B
==================================================== “Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
Do we shut down roads when accidents kill a few thousand? Why should media and Internet be shut down for the actions of an irresponsible few. Incitement does not happen overnight, even when perpetuated by government itself as has been the case in history. It takes weeks of planning and coordination to organise mass violence, and there is usually signs of such in the ground. Otherwise, government should disband NSIS if they are failing in their role.
If only 5% of the population used roads and 5% of that number caused accidents, then yes - we shut down the roads... On 5 December 2012 12:42, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
roads
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
what I meant to say, is that not everyone uses the internet. Road, yes everyone uses the roads at some point in time - to go to work, the market, hospital, travel etc. So its not quite a like for like comparison. A closer comparison would be smokers and smoking. Few do it, but it affects everyone and tolerance of smoking should not be foisted on everyone if only to uphold the smokers' "rights". So in that sense, ban smoking in public places - simple. On 5 December 2012 12:42, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
Do we shut down roads when accidents kill a few thousand?
Why should media and Internet be shut down for the actions of an irresponsible few. Incitement does not happen overnight, even when perpetuated by government itself as has been the case in history.
It takes weeks of planning and coordination to organise mass violence, and there is usually signs of such in the ground. Otherwise, government should disband NSIS if they are failing in their role.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
On 5 December 2012 11:59, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
what I meant to say, is that not everyone uses the internet. Road, yes everyone uses the roads at some point in time - to go to work, the market, hospital, travel etc. So its not quite a like for like comparison. <snip>
Almost everyone is reliant on the internet, indirectly, through the economy. Through commerce or through government services. Etc. So the internet is alot like roads. Just as I may indirectly benefit everyday from a road I never drive on, I may indirectly benefit from the internet. The internet, and roads are a public good.
A closer comparison would be smokers and smoking. Few do it, but it affects everyone and tolerance of smoking should not be foisted on everyone if only to uphold the smokers' "rights". So in that sense, ban smoking in public places - simple.
Beyond its addictiveness, I am not convinced of any other similarity between the internet and smoking. Furthermore, people should be allowed to use the internet in public.
On 5 December 2012 12:42, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
Do we shut down roads when accidents kill a few thousand?
Why should media and Internet be shut down for the actions of an irresponsible few. Incitement does not happen overnight, even when perpetuated by government itself as has been the case in history.
It takes weeks of planning and coordination to organise mass violence, and there is usually signs of such in the ground. Otherwise, government should disband NSIS if they are failing in their role.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
On 5 December 2012 09:51, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If I was in charge of national security, I'd not think twice about violating anyone's freedom of speech rights if innocent people are getting killed. I'd turn off the internet and broadcasting without batting an eye-lid. I'm sure the people whose freedom of speech I have violated will not fall ill and die. <snip>
Shutting down communications in anticipation of violence can cause loss of life. People rely on communications (internet patforms, the internet and mobiles) during emergencies (be they natural disasters or possibly violent political emergencies), often lives depend on the use of communications platforms to coordinate emergency response. During the possibility of election violence these platforms allow people to report on and document violence. Shutting down communication platforms can allow atrocities to happen in the dark. Kenya faced similar problems with internet and ICTs in the 2007 elections. Many used the internet and ICTs to expose atrocities. Hence the birth of Ushahidi a platform used to aggregate and amplify (not shut down) communications in emergencies, so as to save lives, and to document atrocities.
Overall it'd be about the GREATER good.
In a third world country, lets not waste money on monitoring the internet, investigating online, etc etc. esp after the fact and once the damage has been done. We all know how that goes. All in the name of protecting freedom of speech and so we can keep the internet open for 5% of the population yet we are dire need for schools, healthcare, security etc for 99% of the population. Did I mention security?
When we reach such a stage that we have met BASIC rights and needs...and have the resources to spare- then we can attempt that balancing act.
My two cents.
On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com> wrote:
Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech.
At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted")
And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn...
2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com>
Listers,
I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it.
There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind.
Victor
On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com> wrote:
There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done?
If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location.
The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :)
Best Regard,
Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570 email: baiju@tele2media.com
On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to think that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper.
If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences.
If there's
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets that standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease.
That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown.
that's is my 2 bob anyway.
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B
==================================================== “Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
I did not mention mobile communications...or HF or other forms. Just the broadcasting and internet (which itself is a form of broadcasting). I think many nations, on issues of national security have such a clause in their legislation. It makes sense to stifle misinformation and manage it properly. Otherwise rumours become truths, emotions become actions, etc etc. Ushahidi - nice to have....but I am not convinced about its efficacy as a tool. On 5 December 2012 14:32, Alex Comninos <alex.comninos@gmail.com> wrote:
On 5 December 2012 09:51, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If I was in charge of national security, I'd not think twice about violating anyone's freedom of speech rights if innocent people are getting killed. I'd turn off the internet and broadcasting without batting an eye-lid. I'm sure the people whose freedom of speech I have violated will not fall ill and die. <snip>
Shutting down communications in anticipation of violence can cause loss of life. People rely on communications (internet patforms, the internet and mobiles) during emergencies (be they natural disasters or possibly violent political emergencies), often lives depend on the use of communications platforms to coordinate emergency response.
During the possibility of election violence these platforms allow people to report on and document violence. Shutting down communication platforms can allow atrocities to happen in the dark.
Kenya faced similar problems with internet and ICTs in the 2007 elections. Many used the internet and ICTs to expose atrocities. Hence the birth of Ushahidi a platform used to aggregate and amplify (not shut down) communications in emergencies, so as to save lives, and to document atrocities.
Overall it'd be about the GREATER good.
In a third world country, lets not waste money on monitoring the internet, investigating online, etc etc. esp after the fact and once the damage has been done. We all know how that goes. All in the name of protecting freedom of speech and so we can keep the internet open for 5% of the population yet we are dire need for schools, healthcare, security etc for 99% of the population. Did I mention security?
When we reach such a stage that we have met BASIC rights and needs...and have the resources to spare- then we can attempt that balancing act.
My two cents.
On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com> wrote:
Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech.
At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted")
And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn...
2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com>
Listers,
I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it.
There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind.
Victor
On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com> wrote:
There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done?
If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location.
The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :)
Best Regard,
Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570 email: baiju@tele2media.com
On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to think that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper.
If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences.
If there's
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets that standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease.
That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown.
that's is my 2 bob anyway.
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B
==================================================== “Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
I consider shutting down mainstream media and/or social media a total cop out. That solution is low hanging fruit, lazy, and is a testament to an acute failure on our part to come up with sufficient legal instruments. If cars kill so many people on the roads, the solution is not to ban cars, but to come up with speed laws, safety standards and to prosecute appropriately for offenses. It also denies our citizenry basic communication and platforms in which to engage in political discourse, which only further erodes freedoms - and is a slippery slope. I'm not offering a solution here, but another media blackout can't be the only formula. That is an exercise we should delegate to totalitarian governments like Syria's, and not to (hopefully) progressive ones like ours. On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 6:59 AM, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
I did not mention mobile communications...or HF or other forms. Just the broadcasting and internet (which itself is a form of broadcasting). I think many nations, on issues of national security have such a clause in their legislation. It makes sense to stifle misinformation and manage it properly. Otherwise rumours become truths, emotions become actions, etc etc.
Ushahidi - nice to have....but I am not convinced about its efficacy as a tool.
On 5 December 2012 09:51, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If I was in charge of national security, I'd not think twice about violating anyone's freedom of speech rights if innocent people are getting killed. I'd turn off the internet and broadcasting without batting an eye-lid. I'm sure the people whose freedom of speech I have violated will not fall ill and die. <snip>
Shutting down communications in anticipation of violence can cause loss of life. People rely on communications (internet patforms, the internet and mobiles) during emergencies (be they natural disasters or possibly violent political emergencies), often lives depend on the use of communications platforms to coordinate emergency response.
During the possibility of election violence these platforms allow people to report on and document violence. Shutting down communication platforms can allow atrocities to happen in the dark.
Kenya faced similar problems with internet and ICTs in the 2007 elections. Many used the internet and ICTs to expose atrocities. Hence the birth of Ushahidi a platform used to aggregate and amplify (not shut down) communications in emergencies, so as to save lives, and to document atrocities.
Overall it'd be about the GREATER good.
In a third world country, lets not waste money on monitoring the internet, investigating online, etc etc. esp after the fact and once the damage has been done. We all know how that goes. All in the name of protecting freedom of speech and so we can keep the internet open for 5% of the population yet we are dire need for schools, healthcare, security etc for 99% of the population. Did I mention security?
When we reach such a stage that we have met BASIC rights and needs...and have the resources to spare- then we can attempt that balancing act.
My two cents.
On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com>
wrote:
Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech.
At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the
have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted")
And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn...
2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com>
Listers,
I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or
radio
stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it.
There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind.
Victor
On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com> wrote:
There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what
could
be done and not done?
If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location.
The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :)
Best Regard,
Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570 email: baiju@tele2media.com
On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru < daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote: > One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to > think > that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety > of > some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper.
If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences.
If there's > a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets > that > standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease.
That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown.
that's is my 2 bob anyway.
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder
for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B
==================================================== “Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu
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On 5 December 2012 14:32, Alex Comninos <alex.comninos@gmail.com> wrote: parties platform privacy, do platform privacy, do platform privacy, do platform for
people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Grace, why would you argue that political coverage on TV/in the media can be less easily monitored than on the internet? If anything, media outlets have owners and employees and should have (yeah yeah, I know) control mechanism to check for libel, hate speech etc. On the internet, it's the Wild West - it's incredibly difficult to hold anyone to account. And you can take any TV or radio quote from a politician and play that back to him/her. On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com> wrote:
Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech.
At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted")
And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn...
2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com>
Listers,
I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it.
There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind.
Victor
On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com> wrote:
There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done?
If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location.
The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :)
Best Regard,
Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570 email: baiju@tele2media.com
On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote: think
that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper.
If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences.
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets
If there's that
standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease.
That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown.
that's is my 2 bob anyway.
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B
==================================================== *“Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar*
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Andrea Bohnstedt <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/andreabohnstedt> Publisher www.ratio-magazine.com www.africa-assets.com
I think it would be easier to monitor coverage on TV than on Internet. My idea is that there should be minimal coverage of political rallies on tv and if the politicians/parties really want to be on record with their messages, they can publish their rally coverage on the Internet. Media owners to a large extent are letting us down as far as creating cohesion and avoiding violence is concerned. There is too much importance and glam given to political stories. Media is continuously disseminating the clever but dangerous statements. But the important point is not whether it is easier to monitor Internet or TV but for someone to care about the fact that there are so many ordinary citizens who are not on the Internet and to whom the political messages are directed. On my way home I pass by a bar where many mjengo guys gather outside to watch the news from the window. And their attention, especially to what "Jakom" or "Kamwana" etc say is amazing. These are just "masafara", not Kenyans on Twitter, Facebook who have the luxury of alternative information or debate. Will it not be hypocrisy for media owners to sign pacts of peace and goodwill in election coverage when all along they promoted violence (directly or indirectly)? Whatever happened to media and self regulation? 2012/12/5 Andrea Bohnstedt <andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com>
Grace, why would you argue that political coverage on TV/in the media can be less easily monitored than on the internet? If anything, media outlets have owners and employees and should have (yeah yeah, I know) control mechanism to check for libel, hate speech etc. On the internet, it's the Wild West - it's incredibly difficult to hold anyone to account. And you can take any TV or radio quote from a politician and play that back to him/her.
On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com>wrote:
Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech.
At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted")
And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn...
2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com>
Listers,
I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it.
There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind.
Victor
On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com> wrote:
There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done?
If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location.
The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :)
Best Regard,
Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570 email: baiju@tele2media.com
On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote: think
that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper.
If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences.
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets
If there's that
standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease.
That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown.
that's is my 2 bob anyway.
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B
==================================================== *“Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar*
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Andrea Bohnstedt <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/andreabohnstedt> Publisher
www.ratio-magazine.com www.africa-assets.com
-- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu
This discussion are great. They could also be informed by the following research. http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2012/12/internet_plug/ But there are minimal chances that a total switch off could happen in Kenya given the multiplicity of service providers etc HENRY O. MAINA DIRECTOR ARTICLE 19 KENYA/EASTERN AFRICA P O BOX 2653,00100 NAIROBI TEL:+254 (20) 3862230/2 FAX:+254 (20) 3862231 EMAIL: henry@article19.org ________________________________________ From: kictanet [kictanet-bounces+henry=article19.org@lists.kictanet.or.ke] on behalf of Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) [nmutungu@gmail.com] Sent: 05 December 2012 03:24 PM To: Henry Maina Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Under what conditions should we shut down twitter, internet, radio, TV in Kenya? I think it would be easier to monitor coverage on TV than on Internet. My idea is that there should be minimal coverage of political rallies on tv and if the politicians/parties really want to be on record with their messages, they can publish their rally coverage on the Internet. Media owners to a large extent are letting us down as far as creating cohesion and avoiding violence is concerned. There is too much importance and glam given to political stories. Media is continuously disseminating the clever but dangerous statements. But the important point is not whether it is easier to monitor Internet or TV but for someone to care about the fact that there are so many ordinary citizens who are not on the Internet and to whom the political messages are directed. On my way home I pass by a bar where many mjengo guys gather outside to watch the news from the window. And their attention, especially to what "Jakom" or "Kamwana" etc say is amazing. These are just "masafara", not Kenyans on Twitter, Facebook who have the luxury of alternative information or debate. Will it not be hypocrisy for media owners to sign pacts of peace and goodwill in election coverage when all along they promoted violence (directly or indirectly)? Whatever happened to media and self regulation? 2012/12/5 Andrea Bohnstedt <andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com<mailto:andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com>> Grace, why would you argue that political coverage on TV/in the media can be less easily monitored than on the internet? If anything, media outlets have owners and employees and should have (yeah yeah, I know) control mechanism to check for libel, hate speech etc. On the internet, it's the Wild West - it's incredibly difficult to hold anyone to account. And you can take any TV or radio quote from a politician and play that back to him/her. On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com<mailto:nmutungu@gmail.com>> wrote: Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech. At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted") And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn... 2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com<mailto:vkapiyo@gmail.com>> Listers, I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it. There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind. Victor On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com<mailto:baiju@tele2media.com>> wrote: There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done? If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location. The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :) Best Regard, Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570 email: baiju@tele2media.com<mailto:baiju@tele2media.com> On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com<mailto:dogwallah@gmail.com>> wrote: On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com<mailto:daniel.waweru@gmail.com>> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to think that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper. If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences. If there's
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets that standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease. That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown. that's is my 2 bob anyway. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/baiju%40tele2media.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/vkapiyo%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B ==================================================== “Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/nmutungu%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/andrea.bohnstedt%40rat... The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Andrea Bohnstedt<http://ke.linkedin.com/in/andreabohnstedt> Publisher www.ratio-magazine.com<http://www.ratio-magazine.com> www.africa-assets.com<http://www.africa-assets.com> -- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu
I think we are getting romantic about the internet and ignoring that it is just another communication medium like telephones, telegrams, letters,newspapers,smoke signals etc before it. Shutting down communication will only foster a black market where the same will be traded. It will be more expensive but it will exist. Information will flow, slower and more distorted but it will flow. It is not impossible to track down hate speakers. No-one is an island. Someone always knows something. As was witnessed by the Rwandans during their genocide and closer home during the PEV, the efficacy of mass media fanning violence is very real. But the internet is different. It is not passive. Shutting down media houses is fine. Shutting down the internet is not. On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 2:40 PM, Andrea Bohnstedt < andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com> wrote:
Grace, why would you argue that political coverage on TV/in the media can be less easily monitored than on the internet? If anything, media outlets have owners and employees and should have (yeah yeah, I know) control mechanism to check for libel, hate speech etc. On the internet, it's the Wild West - it's incredibly difficult to hold anyone to account. And you can take any TV or radio quote from a politician and play that back to him/her.
On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com>wrote:
Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech.
At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted")
And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn...
2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com>
Listers,
I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it.
There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind.
Victor
On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com> wrote:
There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done?
If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location.
The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :)
Best Regard,
Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570 email: baiju@tele2media.com
On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote: think
that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper.
If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences.
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets
If there's that
standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease.
That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown.
that's is my 2 bob anyway.
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/vkapiyo%40gmail.com
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B
==================================================== *“Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar*
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/nmutungu%40gmail.com
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Andrea Bohnstedt <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/andreabohnstedt> Publisher
www.ratio-magazine.com www.africa-assets.com
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Regards, Mark Mwangi markmwangi.me.ke
Dear listers, I sincerely appreciate the ongoing discussions and their rigour. I must start by indicating that to the best of my knowledge no liberal democracy except USA lack laws or codes against hate speech. I hear Grace Mutung'u's propositions but a few riders may be necessary. I work for ARTICLE 19 which is the leading international human rights organisation on promotion and protection of freedom of expression. However, ARTICLE 19 does not hold absolutist views that any regulation of hate speech violates the Constitution (especially Art 33,34,35) and damages free society. We hold that hate speech should be regulated as part of our commitment to human dignity, equality and inclusion and respect for all members of our society (including vulnerable minorities). ARTICLE 19 is not an organisation of free speech advocates who boast of despising what hate mongers (racists,ethnicists etc) say but is willing to defend to death their right to say it. We are a measured organisation that understands that freedom of expression is not absolute. It can and should be restricted in line with only permissible grounds under international human rights law. We have in mind Article 19 (3) of ICCPR and Article 20 of ICCPR. The only bone of contention is that this regulation cannot be whimsical,ad hoc and subjective. It is because of the continued confusion globally that we as an organisation have for the last 2 years worked on developing a threshold of incitement test which we officially launched on Monday 3rd Dec 2012. See the link http://www.article19.org/resources.php/resource/3548/en/article-19-unveils-a... In summary, the incitement test underscores the fact that there are many forms of speech acts that may be dangerous---abusive, uncouth, derogatory, inflammatory etc and that states must devise mechanisms to prohibit incitement to discrimination, hostility or violence. The test also isolates the need for us to expand prohibited grounds on incitement and not just stick to ethnicity yet may Kenyans continue to safer hate speech on the basis of their sex, race, disability, sexual orientation, medical conditions, whether born in wedlock or outside wedlock etc. Key for the incitement test is the context; the speaker; the intent; the content; the extent and magnitude of the expression; and the likelihood of harm occurring,including its imminence. It is within the 5th test of extent and magnitude that the current discussion but be located. If a speech act is made in public and has a likelihood to be disseminated widely then we must teach ourselves how to mitigate its likely effects. Such efforts would be how to ensure it is limited, not unnecessarily repeated etc. Political expression may appear divisive but we must ask ourselves why is it so in competitive politics and how may we hold politicians accountable for their speech acts first before beginning to fathom shut downs as that will always be a scapegoat. The problem shall always persist. I remain happy and available to share how we may balance the right to freedom of expression and also the need to ensure human dignity for all. Regards HENRY O. MAINA DIRECTOR ARTICLE 19 KENYA/EASTERN AFRICA P O BOX 2653,00100 NAIROBI TEL:+254 (20) 3862230/2 FAX:+254 (20) 3862231 EMAIL: henry@article19.org ________________________________________ From: kictanet [kictanet-bounces+henry=article19.org@lists.kictanet.or.ke] on behalf of Mark Mwangi [mwangy@gmail.com] Sent: 05 December 2012 03:46 PM To: Henry Maina Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Under what conditions should we shut down twitter, internet, radio, TV in Kenya? I think we are getting romantic about the internet and ignoring that it is just another communication medium like telephones, telegrams, letters,newspapers,smoke signals etc before it. Shutting down communication will only foster a black market where the same will be traded. It will be more expensive but it will exist. Information will flow, slower and more distorted but it will flow. It is not impossible to track down hate speakers. No-one is an island. Someone always knows something. As was witnessed by the Rwandans during their genocide and closer home during the PEV, the efficacy of mass media fanning violence is very real. But the internet is different. It is not passive. Shutting down media houses is fine. Shutting down the internet is not. On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 2:40 PM, Andrea Bohnstedt <andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com<mailto:andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com>> wrote: Grace, why would you argue that political coverage on TV/in the media can be less easily monitored than on the internet? If anything, media outlets have owners and employees and should have (yeah yeah, I know) control mechanism to check for libel, hate speech etc. On the internet, it's the Wild West - it's incredibly difficult to hold anyone to account. And you can take any TV or radio quote from a politician and play that back to him/her. On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com<mailto:nmutungu@gmail.com>> wrote: Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech. At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted") And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn... 2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com<mailto:vkapiyo@gmail.com>> Listers, I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it. There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind. Victor On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com<mailto:baiju@tele2media.com>> wrote: There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done? If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location. The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :) Best Regard, Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570<tel:%2B44%207887691570> email: baiju@tele2media.com<mailto:baiju@tele2media.com> On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com<mailto:dogwallah@gmail.com>> wrote: On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com<mailto:daniel.waweru@gmail.com>> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to think that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper. If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences. If there's
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets that standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease. That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown. that's is my 2 bob anyway. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/baiju%40tele2media.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/vkapiyo%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B ==================================================== “Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/nmutungu%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/andrea.bohnstedt%40rat... The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Andrea Bohnstedt<http://ke.linkedin.com/in/andreabohnstedt> Publisher www.ratio-magazine.com<http://www.ratio-magazine.com> www.africa-assets.com<http://www.africa-assets.com> _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/mwangy%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Regards, Mark Mwangi markmwangi.me.ke<http://markmwangi.me.ke>
Thank you Henry. It is great to hear from someone who actually works on Article 19. Fantastic! On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 7:21 AM, Henry Maina <henry@article19.org> wrote:
Dear listers,
I sincerely appreciate the ongoing discussions and their rigour. I must start by indicating that to the best of my knowledge no liberal democracy except USA lack laws or codes against hate speech. I hear Grace Mutung'u's propositions but a few riders may be necessary. I work for ARTICLE 19 which is the leading international human rights organisation on promotion and protection of freedom of expression. However, ARTICLE 19 does not hold absolutist views that any regulation of hate speech violates the Constitution (especially Art 33,34,35) and damages free society.
We hold that hate speech should be regulated as part of our commitment to human dignity, equality and inclusion and respect for all members of our society (including vulnerable minorities). ARTICLE 19 is not an organisation of free speech advocates who boast of despising what hate mongers (racists,ethnicists etc) say but is willing to defend to death their right to say it. We are a measured organisation that understands that freedom of expression is not absolute. It can and should be restricted in line with only permissible grounds under international human rights law. We have in mind Article 19 (3) of ICCPR and Article 20 of ICCPR.
The only bone of contention is that this regulation cannot be whimsical,ad hoc and subjective. It is because of the continued confusion globally that we as an organisation have for the last 2 years worked on developing a threshold of incitement test which we officially launched on Monday 3rd Dec 2012. See the link http://www.article19.org/resources.php/resource/3548/en/article-19-unveils-a... In summary, the incitement test underscores the fact that there are many forms of speech acts that may be dangerous---abusive, uncouth, derogatory, inflammatory etc and that states must devise mechanisms to prohibit incitement to discrimination, hostility or violence.
The test also isolates the need for us to expand prohibited grounds on incitement and not just stick to ethnicity yet may Kenyans continue to safer hate speech on the basis of their sex, race, disability, sexual orientation, medical conditions, whether born in wedlock or outside wedlock etc. Key for the incitement test is the context; the speaker; the intent; the content; the extent and magnitude of the expression; and the likelihood of harm occurring,including its imminence. It is within the 5th test of extent and magnitude that the current discussion but be located. If a speech act is made in public and has a likelihood to be disseminated widely then we must teach ourselves how to mitigate its likely effects. Such efforts would be how to ensure it is limited, not unnecessarily repeated etc.
Political expression may appear divisive but we must ask ourselves why is it so in competitive politics and how may we hold politicians accountable for their speech acts first before beginning to fathom shut downs as that will always be a scapegoat. The problem shall always persist.
I remain happy and available to share how we may balance the right to freedom of expression and also the need to ensure human dignity for all. Regards
HENRY O. MAINA DIRECTOR ARTICLE 19 KENYA/EASTERN AFRICA P O BOX 2653,00100 NAIROBI TEL:+254 (20) 3862230/2 FAX:+254 (20) 3862231 EMAIL: henry@article19.org
________________________________________ From: kictanet [kictanet-bounces+henry=article19.org@lists.kictanet.or.ke] on behalf of Mark Mwangi [mwangy@gmail.com] Sent: 05 December 2012 03:46 PM To: Henry Maina Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Under what conditions should we shut down twitter, internet, radio, TV in Kenya?
I think we are getting romantic about the internet and ignoring that it is just another communication medium like telephones, telegrams, letters,newspapers,smoke signals etc before it. Shutting down communication will only foster a black market where the same will be traded. It will be more expensive but it will exist. Information will flow, slower and more distorted but it will flow.
It is not impossible to track down hate speakers. No-one is an island. Someone always knows something. As was witnessed by the Rwandans during their genocide and closer home during the PEV, the efficacy of mass media fanning violence is very real. But the internet is different. It is not passive. Shutting down media houses is fine. Shutting down the internet is not.
On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 2:40 PM, Andrea Bohnstedt < andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com<mailto: andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com>> wrote: Grace, why would you argue that political coverage on TV/in the media can be less easily monitored than on the internet? If anything, media outlets have owners and employees and should have (yeah yeah, I know) control mechanism to check for libel, hate speech etc. On the internet, it's the Wild West - it's incredibly difficult to hold anyone to account. And you can take any TV or radio quote from a politician and play that back to him/her.
On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com <mailto:nmutungu@gmail.com>> wrote: Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech.
At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted")
And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn...
2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com<mailto:vkapiyo@gmail.com>> Listers,
I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it.
There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind.
Victor
On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com<mailto: baiju@tele2media.com>> wrote: There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done?
If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location.
The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :)
Best Regard,
Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570<tel:%2B44%207887691570> email: baiju@tele2media.com<mailto:baiju@tele2media.com>
On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com<mailto: dogwallah@gmail.com>> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com <mailto:daniel.waweru@gmail.com>> wrote: think
that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper.
If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences.
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets
If there's that
standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease.
That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown.
that's is my 2 bob anyway.
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B
==================================================== “Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Andrea Bohnstedt<http://ke.linkedin.com/in/andreabohnstedt> Publisher
www.ratio-magazine.com<http://www.ratio-magazine.com> www.africa-assets.com<http://www.africa-assets.com>
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Regards,
Mark Mwangi
markmwangi.me.ke<http://markmwangi.me.ke>
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Dr. Warigia Bowman Assistant Professor Clinton School of Public Service University of Arkansas wbowman@clintonschool.uasys.edu http://democratizingegypt.blogspot.com ------------------------------------------------- View my research on my SSRN Author page: http://ssrn.com/author=1479660 --------------------------------------------------
Thanks Warigia. I am happy to get further on conditions that must subsist before any shut down if need be but I note we must first have license conditions with each service provider or TV/Radio operator. There cannot be wholesome shut downs in a democracy like what we had in early 2008. It was illegal and illegitimate. This is when you look at it from the understanding that any prohibition of incitement must conform to a three-part test of legality, proportionality and necessity. Regards HENRY O. MAINA DIRECTOR ARTICLE 19 KENYA/EASTERN AFRICA P O BOX 2653,00100 NAIROBI TEL:+254 (20) 3862230/2 FAX:+254 (20) 3862231 EMAIL: henry@article19.org ________________________________________ From: Warigia Bowman [warigia@gmail.com] Sent: 05 December 2012 04:47 PM To: Henry Maina Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Under what conditions should we shut down twitter, internet, radio, TV in Kenya? Thank you Henry. It is great to hear from someone who actually works on Article 19. Fantastic! On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 7:21 AM, Henry Maina <henry@article19.org<mailto:henry@article19.org>> wrote: Dear listers, I sincerely appreciate the ongoing discussions and their rigour. I must start by indicating that to the best of my knowledge no liberal democracy except USA lack laws or codes against hate speech. I hear Grace Mutung'u's propositions but a few riders may be necessary. I work for ARTICLE 19 which is the leading international human rights organisation on promotion and protection of freedom of expression. However, ARTICLE 19 does not hold absolutist views that any regulation of hate speech violates the Constitution (especially Art 33,34,35) and damages free society. We hold that hate speech should be regulated as part of our commitment to human dignity, equality and inclusion and respect for all members of our society (including vulnerable minorities). ARTICLE 19 is not an organisation of free speech advocates who boast of despising what hate mongers (racists,ethnicists etc) say but is willing to defend to death their right to say it. We are a measured organisation that understands that freedom of expression is not absolute. It can and should be restricted in line with only permissible grounds under international human rights law. We have in mind Article 19 (3) of ICCPR and Article 20 of ICCPR. The only bone of contention is that this regulation cannot be whimsical,ad hoc and subjective. It is because of the continued confusion globally that we as an organisation have for the last 2 years worked on developing a threshold of incitement test which we officially launched on Monday 3rd Dec 2012. See the link http://www.article19.org/resources.php/resource/3548/en/article-19-unveils-a... In summary, the incitement test underscores the fact that there are many forms of speech acts that may be dangerous---abusive, uncouth, derogatory, inflammatory etc and that states must devise mechanisms to prohibit incitement to discrimination, hostility or violence. The test also isolates the need for us to expand prohibited grounds on incitement and not just stick to ethnicity yet may Kenyans continue to safer hate speech on the basis of their sex, race, disability, sexual orientation, medical conditions, whether born in wedlock or outside wedlock etc. Key for the incitement test is the context; the speaker; the intent; the content; the extent and magnitude of the expression; and the likelihood of harm occurring,including its imminence. It is within the 5th test of extent and magnitude that the current discussion but be located. If a speech act is made in public and has a likelihood to be disseminated widely then we must teach ourselves how to mitigate its likely effects. Such efforts would be how to ensure it is limited, not unnecessarily repeated etc. Political expression may appear divisive but we must ask ourselves why is it so in competitive politics and how may we hold politicians accountable for their speech acts first before beginning to fathom shut downs as that will always be a scapegoat. The problem shall always persist. I remain happy and available to share how we may balance the right to freedom of expression and also the need to ensure human dignity for all. Regards HENRY O. MAINA DIRECTOR ARTICLE 19 KENYA/EASTERN AFRICA P O BOX 2653,00100 NAIROBI TEL:+254 (20) 3862230/2<tel:%2820%29%203862230%2F2> FAX:+254 (20) 3862231<tel:%2B254%20%2820%29%203862231> EMAIL: henry@article19.org<mailto:henry@article19.org> ________________________________________ From: kictanet [kictanet-bounces+henry=article19.org@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:article19.org@lists.kictanet.or.ke>] on behalf of Mark Mwangi [mwangy@gmail.com<mailto:mwangy@gmail.com>] Sent: 05 December 2012 03:46 PM To: Henry Maina Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Under what conditions should we shut down twitter, internet, radio, TV in Kenya? I think we are getting romantic about the internet and ignoring that it is just another communication medium like telephones, telegrams, letters,newspapers,smoke signals etc before it. Shutting down communication will only foster a black market where the same will be traded. It will be more expensive but it will exist. Information will flow, slower and more distorted but it will flow. It is not impossible to track down hate speakers. No-one is an island. Someone always knows something. As was witnessed by the Rwandans during their genocide and closer home during the PEV, the efficacy of mass media fanning violence is very real. But the internet is different. It is not passive. Shutting down media houses is fine. Shutting down the internet is not. On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 2:40 PM, Andrea Bohnstedt <andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com<mailto:andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com><mailto:andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com<mailto:andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com>>> wrote: Grace, why would you argue that political coverage on TV/in the media can be less easily monitored than on the internet? If anything, media outlets have owners and employees and should have (yeah yeah, I know) control mechanism to check for libel, hate speech etc. On the internet, it's the Wild West - it's incredibly difficult to hold anyone to account. And you can take any TV or radio quote from a politician and play that back to him/her. On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com<mailto:nmutungu@gmail.com><mailto:nmutungu@gmail.com<mailto:nmutungu@gmail.com>>> wrote: Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech. At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted") And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn... 2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com<mailto:vkapiyo@gmail.com><mailto:vkapiyo@gmail.com<mailto:vkapiyo@gmail.com>>> Listers, I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it. There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind. Victor On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com<mailto:baiju@tele2media.com><mailto:baiju@tele2media.com<mailto:baiju@tele2media.com>>> wrote: There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done? If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location. The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :) Best Regard, Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570<tel:%2B44%207887691570><tel:%2B44%207887691570> email: baiju@tele2media.com<mailto:baiju@tele2media.com><mailto:baiju@tele2media.com<mailto:baiju@tele2media.com>> On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com<mailto:dogwallah@gmail.com><mailto:dogwallah@gmail.com<mailto:dogwallah@gmail.com>>> wrote: On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com<mailto:daniel.waweru@gmail.com><mailto:daniel.waweru@gmail.com<mailto:daniel.waweru@gmail.com>>> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to think that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper. If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences. If there's
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets that standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease. That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown. that's is my 2 bob anyway. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke><mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/baiju%40tele2media.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke><mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/vkapiyo%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Victor Kapiyo, LL.B ==================================================== “Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke><mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/nmutungu%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Grace L.N. Mutung'u (Bomu) Kenya Skype: gracebomu Twitter: @Bomu Website: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profile/GraceMutungu _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke><mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/andrea.bohnstedt%40rat... The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Andrea Bohnstedt<http://ke.linkedin.com/in/andreabohnstedt> Publisher www.ratio-magazine.com<http://www.ratio-magazine.com><http://www.ratio-magazine.com> www.africa-assets.com<http://www.africa-assets.com><http://www.africa-assets.com> _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke><mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/mwangy%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Regards, Mark Mwangi markmwangi.me.ke<http://markmwangi.me.ke><http://markmwangi.me.ke> _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/warigia%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Dr. Warigia Bowman Assistant Professor Clinton School of Public Service University of Arkansas wbowman@clintonschool.uasys.edu<mailto:wbowman@clintonschool.uasys.edu> http://democratizingegypt.blogspot.com ------------------------------------------------- View my research on my SSRN Author page: http://ssrn.com/author=1479660 --------------------------------------------------
Thanks Henry, especially for the policy. I like the six prong test, wish it could be applied to some of the incitement cases, maybe that would be a great help to the inadequacies of the National Cohesion and Integration Act. I like the point that we need to prevent incitement in all forms , sometimes we focus too much on politics then hate on everyone who is different from us. And to consider other remedies , other than criminal , would also be of advantage in our society. It would actually be poetic justice for some of our radio presenters to have to correct/apologise for some of their derogatory speech eg towards people of different orientation etc. That said, I still think that the time left before elections is so short and that drastic measures, such as limiting political coverage need to be taken. 2012/12/5 Henry Maina <henry@article19.org>
Thanks Warigia. I am happy to get further on conditions that must subsist before any shut down if need be but I note we must first have license conditions with each service provider or TV/Radio operator. There cannot be wholesome shut downs in a democracy like what we had in early 2008. It was illegal and illegitimate. This is when you look at it from the understanding that any prohibition of incitement must conform to a three-part test of legality, proportionality and necessity.
Regards
HENRY O. MAINA DIRECTOR ARTICLE 19 KENYA/EASTERN AFRICA P O BOX 2653,00100 NAIROBI TEL:+254 (20) 3862230/2 FAX:+254 (20) 3862231 EMAIL: henry@article19.org
________________________________________ From: Warigia Bowman [warigia@gmail.com] Sent: 05 December 2012 04:47 PM To: Henry Maina Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Under what conditions should we shut down twitter, internet, radio, TV in Kenya?
Thank you Henry. It is great to hear from someone who actually works on Article 19. Fantastic!
On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 7:21 AM, Henry Maina <henry@article19.org<mailto: henry@article19.org>> wrote: Dear listers,
I sincerely appreciate the ongoing discussions and their rigour. I must start by indicating that to the best of my knowledge no liberal democracy except USA lack laws or codes against hate speech. I hear Grace Mutung'u's propositions but a few riders may be necessary. I work for ARTICLE 19 which is the leading international human rights organisation on promotion and protection of freedom of expression. However, ARTICLE 19 does not hold absolutist views that any regulation of hate speech violates the Constitution (especially Art 33,34,35) and damages free society.
We hold that hate speech should be regulated as part of our commitment to human dignity, equality and inclusion and respect for all members of our society (including vulnerable minorities). ARTICLE 19 is not an organisation of free speech advocates who boast of despising what hate mongers (racists,ethnicists etc) say but is willing to defend to death their right to say it. We are a measured organisation that understands that freedom of expression is not absolute. It can and should be restricted in line with only permissible grounds under international human rights law. We have in mind Article 19 (3) of ICCPR and Article 20 of ICCPR.
The only bone of contention is that this regulation cannot be whimsical,ad hoc and subjective. It is because of the continued confusion globally that we as an organisation have for the last 2 years worked on developing a threshold of incitement test which we officially launched on Monday 3rd Dec 2012. See the link http://www.article19.org/resources.php/resource/3548/en/article-19-unveils-a... In summary, the incitement test underscores the fact that there are many forms of speech acts that may be dangerous---abusive, uncouth, derogatory, inflammatory etc and that states must devise mechanisms to prohibit incitement to discrimination, hostility or violence.
The test also isolates the need for us to expand prohibited grounds on incitement and not just stick to ethnicity yet may Kenyans continue to safer hate speech on the basis of their sex, race, disability, sexual orientation, medical conditions, whether born in wedlock or outside wedlock etc. Key for the incitement test is the context; the speaker; the intent; the content; the extent and magnitude of the expression; and the likelihood of harm occurring,including its imminence. It is within the 5th test of extent and magnitude that the current discussion but be located. If a speech act is made in public and has a likelihood to be disseminated widely then we must teach ourselves how to mitigate its likely effects. Such efforts would be how to ensure it is limited, not unnecessarily repeated etc.
Political expression may appear divisive but we must ask ourselves why is it so in competitive politics and how may we hold politicians accountable for their speech acts first before beginning to fathom shut downs as that will always be a scapegoat. The problem shall always persist.
I remain happy and available to share how we may balance the right to freedom of expression and also the need to ensure human dignity for all. Regards
HENRY O. MAINA DIRECTOR ARTICLE 19 KENYA/EASTERN AFRICA P O BOX 2653,00100 NAIROBI TEL:+254 (20) 3862230/2<tel:%2820%29%203862230%2F2> FAX:+254 (20) 3862231<tel:%2B254%20%2820%29%203862231> EMAIL: henry@article19.org<mailto:henry@article19.org>
________________________________________ From: kictanet [kictanet-bounces+henry=article19.org@lists.kictanet.or.ke <mailto:article19.org@lists.kictanet.or.ke>] on behalf of Mark Mwangi [ mwangy@gmail.com<mailto:mwangy@gmail.com>] Sent: 05 December 2012 03:46 PM To: Henry Maina Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Under what conditions should we shut down twitter, internet, radio, TV in Kenya?
I think we are getting romantic about the internet and ignoring that it is just another communication medium like telephones, telegrams, letters,newspapers,smoke signals etc before it. Shutting down communication will only foster a black market where the same will be traded. It will be more expensive but it will exist. Information will flow, slower and more distorted but it will flow.
It is not impossible to track down hate speakers. No-one is an island. Someone always knows something. As was witnessed by the Rwandans during their genocide and closer home during the PEV, the efficacy of mass media fanning violence is very real. But the internet is different. It is not passive. Shutting down media houses is fine. Shutting down the internet is not.
On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 2:40 PM, Andrea Bohnstedt < andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com<mailto: andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com><mailto: andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com<mailto: andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com>>> wrote: Grace, why would you argue that political coverage on TV/in the media can be less easily monitored than on the internet? If anything, media outlets have owners and employees and should have (yeah yeah, I know) control mechanism to check for libel, hate speech etc. On the internet, it's the Wild West - it's incredibly difficult to hold anyone to account. And you can take any TV or radio quote from a politician and play that back to him/her.
On 5 December 2012 10:51, Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) <nmutungu@gmail.com <mailto:nmutungu@gmail.com><mailto:nmutungu@gmail.com<mailto: nmutungu@gmail.com>>> wrote: Sometimes I feel as if Kenya is a unique case that requires tailored interventions. For instance, with all due respect to Article 19, and while we should never blanket shut down twitter etc, there should surely be a fast response mechanism to inciteful speech online as well as broadcasts. eg a Commissioner of Assize or a dedicated court so that people do not continue to spew, retweet and disseminate hate speech.
At the moment, there are already not necessarily hateful or incitement speech but (clever)statements that are building up collective psyche towards hardline positions. How long should we leave such statements to ethics? Shouldn't we just black them out? The argument that we should combat hate speech with massive "love" speech it seems, will not work in Kenya unless "love" speakers get the resources that hate speakers have. I get so concerned for Kenya every time I watch 7pm news......Can't something be done to stem this clever speech that most people would agree is likely to lead to hardline positions and God forbid, violence....For example, cant media houses limit the duration/coverage of political rallies so that the parties have to find other avenues for their messages eg Internet where their content can be monitored by we the people (without the risk of the parties/candidates saying, "I was misquoted")
And most importantly, especially for March elections, there needs to be some regulation of media reporting election results. For example having media houses refrain from predicting or calling it (however obvious it may seem) And is current legislation sufficient? Maybe not (at least not the National Cohesion and Integration Act) . And the circumstances are not helping, since defining cases are yet to concluded/have been withdrawn...
2012/12/5 Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com<mailto:vkapiyo@gmail.com
<mailto:vkapiyo@gmail.com<mailto:vkapiyo@gmail.com>>> Listers,
I think the focus should not be on shutting down the Internet, tv or radio stations hence inconveniencing the entire nation and infringing everyone's constitutionally guaranteed rights while at it.
There is sufficient legislation to deal with hate speech and related offences and media enterprises that violate the law, hence the responsible regulatory institutions should be focusing on how prepared they are to implement the law by investigating and arresting the specific offenders. Indeed before such drastic action is contemplated, the consequences need to be borne in mind.
Victor
On 5 December 2012 06:13, Baiju Shah <baiju@tele2media.com<mailto: baiju@tele2media.com><mailto:baiju@tele2media.com<mailto: baiju@tele2media.com>>> wrote: There must be a framework within the Kenyan law that outlines what could be done and not done?
If there is a violation it is the right of the authorities either deal with the immediately or the platform provider can comply to the law by self governing as they do for all aspects in running their businesses. E.g. Likes Google and Twitter have created in house expertise / legal capability to build into their systems what one can do and not do by geo location.
The governance / audit in Kenya now should be do they comply with our laws? If not then they should be given 2/3 months to include a layer of business rules that will include for the system / platform provider to comply, where is KEBS :)
Best Regard,
Baiju Shah Tele2media Ltd Telemedia Africa Ltd Tel. +44 7887691570<tel:%2B44%207887691570><tel:%2B44%207887691570> email: baiju@tele2media.com<mailto:baiju@tele2media.com><mailto: baiju@tele2media.com<mailto:baiju@tele2media.com>>
On 5 Dec 2012, at 04:46, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com<mailto: dogwallah@gmail.com><mailto:dogwallah@gmail.com<mailto:dogwallah@gmail.com>>> wrote:
One case, at least, strikes me as obvious: if you have good reason to
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 7:43 PM, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com <mailto:daniel.waweru@gmail.com><mailto:daniel.waweru@gmail.com<mailto: daniel.waweru@gmail.com>>> wrote: think
that broadcasting material would lead to a direct threat to the safety of some other person, then there's good reason not to broadcast it.
That is true, but that is an editorial judgement on the part of the media house/radio station/newspaper.
If they violate the law, then there MUST be consequences.
a means of communication which persistently puts out stuff that meets
If there's that
standard, then there's a pretty good case for shutting it down.
if it is a single radio station for example, then yes, a court could find them in violation of the law and order them to cease.
That doesn't mean ALL radio stations should be shutdown.
that's is my 2 bob anyway.
-- Cheers,
McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
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==================================================== “Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude” Zig Ziglar
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-- Dr. Warigia Bowman Assistant Professor Clinton School of Public Service University of Arkansas wbowman@clintonschool.uasys.edu<mailto:wbowman@clintonschool.uasys.edu> http://democratizingegypt.blogspot.com ------------------------------------------------- View my research on my SSRN Author page: http://ssrn.com/author=1479660 --------------------------------------------------
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Our communications policy,law and regulations did not contemplate blanket shutdown as this is clearly an extra ordinary measure.However,on the occurence of an emergency,then the government,within the law,could take whatever actions are necessary to normalise the situation.These actions do not exclude communications. Sent from my BlackBerry® -----Original Message----- From: "Grace Mutung'u (Bomu)" <nmutungu@gmail.com> Sender: "kictanet" <kictanet-bounces+ngethe.kariuki2007=yahoo.co.uk@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Date: Thu, 6 Dec 2012 10:47:53 To: <ngethe.kariuki2007@yahoo.co.uk> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Under what conditions should we shut down twitter, internet, radio, TV in Kenya? _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/ngethe.kariuki2007%40y... The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Harzit Steve, On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 2:22 PM, Song, Stephen <stephen.song@gmail.com> wrote:
On 4 December 2012 13:03, McTim <dogwallah@gmail.com> wrote:
<snip>
There are no conditions under which Article 19 of the UDHR should be violated.
Really?
Yes, really. Even if they are directly encouraging and enabling the
contravention of Article 3 (the right to life, liberty and security of person)? Wouldn't Article 30 apply in this instance when it says "Nothing in this Declaration may be interpreted as implying for any State, group or person any right to engage in any activity or to perform any act aimed at the destruction of any of the rights and freedoms set forth herein."?
If there are violations of hate speech laws, then those violators need to be prosecuted by the police, not by a hastily formed posse or militia. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
participants (15)
-
Alex Comninos -
Andrea Bohnstedt -
Baiju Shah -
Daniel Waweru -
David Kobia -
Dennis Kioko -
Francis Hook -
Grace Mutung'u (Bomu) -
Henry Maina -
Mark Mwangi -
McTim -
ngethe.kariuki2007＠yahoo.co.uk -
Song, Stephen -
Victor Kapiyo -
Warigia Bowman