Re: [kictanet] Who is ICT Board? Hijacked
Esteemed Listers, Prof. Waema's proposal to convene a gathering premised on the subject of institutional frameworks is timely if not overdue. As dependence on ICT increases in Kenya it will be critical to ensure that the rate of technological dependence does not outstrip the rate at which institutional frameworks are developing. Its fundamental to plan for policy as technology evolves. Going by the contributions from various listers, one theme rings out sharply and with clarity. There is a patent call for some purposeful effort to create an all-inclusive umbrella body that would enable the ICT fraternity engage all relevant parties with ease and confidence. As noted by Evans and Waudo this subject has come up before in various designs. Unfortunately the debate that always follows assassinates the key motion before staggering to other issues. It’s even arguable that on certain occasions some contributions are basically guided missiles hidden in words. The reference to such by Dr Ndemo as “mchongoano” is extremely polite. Beyond question ICT will dictate the future patterns of most economic and social sectors. This requires a lot in terms of preparedness on the part of ICT professionals and stakeholders. To achieve the basic thresholds of progress we must work towards a more organized professional status. As things stand our ICT institutional set up is more chaotic than the ever maligned matatu industry fraternity who seem to have a better ideological sense of unity. If you ask an average Kenyan what their profession is they will easily tell you: I am a lawyer, I am an accountant, a teacher, a doctor etc. Ask the same question to an ICT person and you will be amazed at the surprising lack of understanding. There can be no pride in being part of a haphazard profession. Incidentally the challenge towards a treasured and honorable profession rests squarely on our shoulders as the affected people. Some time back, working with some likeminded Kenyans we explored the need of a sunshade professional and industry platform which saw the formation of the ICT Association of Kenya (ICTAK) - www.ictak.or.ke. The resolve towards an ICT setting that boosts the profile and gives pride to all professionals remains our key driving force. To achieve the highest standards it’s imperative that we pull together. There are many ongoing efforts within the ICT sector but they are too fragmentary to realize any substantial gains. Given the all encompassing name and perspective of ICTAK we would be glad to make it available for consideration as a professional/industry outfit that would be in the parallels of ICPAK, LSK, KMA as Emmanuel suggests. Since politics is an omnipresent phenomenon whenever matters like “uniting” come to the fore, the questions of transparency, governance and imperial tenures of officials warrant discussion. In our case we are fully at ease to let go any dockets we may be holding be it that of President or Prime minister as long as the vision for an elegant ICT profession is upheld. Kamotho Njenga On 4/5/10, Emmanuel Khisa <Emmanuel.khisa@kadet.co.ke> wrote:
Daktari,
I think you are spot on on the issues raised. Until we have a body unifying the ICT Professionals we will never have a voice to effectively engage other stakeholders, say what happens when say Lawyers(LSK) demand some form of engagement with the regards to ICT law, who will be mandated to represent interest of ICT professionals, or say Health professionals body(KMA or KM&DPB) seeking our input(by our I mean ICT professionals) regarding some aspects of Health Information system, who will engage with them and how will these people claim to represent the industry? We may have previously engaged as ICT stakeholders but is this a sustainable model...I believe we cannot continue to operate in this kind of chaotic situation. Kudos to KictaNet though some useful intra-industry discussion that are very informative go on here, but more could be done. Question is how and where do we start and how do we manage it so professionally that we avoid the pitfalls of unnecessary politicking and be able to engage as ICPAK does for finance professionals of all shades (Auditors, Financial Analyst, Financial Accountants, Management Accountants)
My one cent.
EK
-----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+emmanuel.khisa=kadet.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+emmanuel.khisa<kictanet-bounces%2Bemmanuel.khisa> =kadet.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of waudo siganga Sent: Monday, April 05, 2010 4:04 PM To: emmanuel.khisa@kadet.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Who is ICT Board? Hijacked
Hi Evans, all - we have discussed the issue of a statutory body to regulate ICT professionalism on this list in the past and the discussion did not go far. Some said that we would be interfering with "innovation". Some mentioned Bill Gates as a guy who has done much but does not have any professional qualification. Yet others had other stories (e.g. the three blind men story from Brian and his note to Walu on 7/7/08:
I beg to differ. ICT is too large, too deep and too wide to have a single, authoritative, representative body. What you refer to would probably be more appropriate to some of the professional disciplines within the ICT sector e.g. Software Developers Guild, System Administrators Association, CIO/CTO Society - within which there can be certain codes of behavior, ethics, values, best practices etc...
On 10/9/08 on this list I re-introduced the topic of a statutory body such as LSK,ICPAK, ... to guide the ICT profession. In my mail I even included a "draft ICT Professionals Act". The idea received cold water except from Kamotho.
One distinction between "profession" and "Industry". In my mind I see statutory bodies as more regulating "profession" rather than "industry". Industry bodies are normally private sector initiatives formed by interested persons to achieve common goals. I can be surprised to hear the government being asked to help set up an "industry" association of any type. Private sector associations engage the government, so how can the same government be involved in their set up? The other axiomatic thing about associations is that the ones that do not deliver invariably die a natural death - and there are many examples of this in Kenya even within ICT. It is not difficult to set up a membership association (just like a Church or Club which are set up under the same "Societies Act"). People cannot be stopped from setting up associations because the Constitution guarantees freedom of association. This means those who have any bright ideas that are not accommodated by existing associations cannot have an excuse or choose to take up the role of professional hecklers of existing associations.
Within ICT we agreed some years to accommodate multiple associations which then converge under KEPSA umbrella to offer a unified voice. This I think is working very well as recently exemplified at the Prime Minister's Round Table where ICT issues were very well articulated.
With regard to Prof's suggestion to discuss government agencies and private sector associations at the same meeting I think that would create much confusion and even opportunities for red herrings to be thrown around. It is mixing oranges and apples. The word "association" is actually a short form. The exact terminology is "membership association". An association is made up of members who voluntarily come together and run their interests. The members have their own channels to discuss their issues. It does not take much imagination to realize that someone who is NOT a "member" is unlikely to have overflowing goodwill towards (leave alone information about) the association. However, associations face a lot of challenges and a specific get together of associations to discuss best practices and ways of being sustainable and more effective would be welcome. The Business Advocacy Fund is for example doing a great and positive job in the direction of capacity building and funding. Well done to them. Another useful type of meeting is the type you refer to that was held at KICC a couple of years ago where associations can inform a wider audience about their activities and roles and, perhaps, recruit more members. Overall, an associations' meeting should be a focused one and not be mixed up with one for government agencies; and guest list should be expanded from Prof's limiting suggestion of "the plethora of ICT industry associations that are not effective" to include those which are effective so that others can learn from them as well.
Waudo www.cskonline.org
Dear listers, Did we not have a similar meeting not too long ago? I think it was about two years or so. Cant remember who had organized it but it was there at KICC. Same theme of taking stock of all ICT bodies. Cant remember if the Government agencies were represented.
Not that I have a problem with yet another similar meeting, but we need to clearly set out what we want to achieve with that kind of gathering. Its common knowledge that the ICT industry is awash with all manner of associations/organizations and Government bodies. Isn't it time that we had the sort of organization that we see with other professions like Accountants and Lawyers etc? Isn't it time that the Government created a statutory industry association? This can easily be achieved by such legislation as the policy document presented by the PS the other day, or the Communications Act that was passed not too long ago.
Inasmuch as the Government so believes in the increasing importance that ICT plays in the economy, then its imperative that we have an industry body that would take care of all others, say like a CSK that is recognized by an Act of parliament.
Regards, Ikua
Quoting Mwololo Tim <timwololo@gmail.com>:
Dear all, The discussion needs to be on the institutional framework for ICTs in Kenya, not just on KICTB. It needs to cover KICTB, NCS and DEG/GITS. It also needs to include the plethora of ICT industry associations that are not effective. I can organize such a townhall meeting in Chiromo like the first one. However, for such a meeting to be useful, it needs to be preceded by some guided discussion on the same. Alternatively, one or two persons can prepare presenations to guide the discussions, with these presentations being made available earlier for participants to acquint with them. I am also prepared to be one of those persons. tim
On Sun, Apr 4, 2010 at 9:10 PM, Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com>wrote:
Daktari,
Thank you for setting the ball rolling, not sure i saw the document as well it must have been hijacked. A town hall meeting is a welcome idea i second it, Kippra felt sufficiently philanthropic before the last town hall meeting i wonder whether they can double their offer during this easter season, bwn Magolo can we count on you. Walu can set the agenda.
Regards
On Sun, Apr 4, 2010 at 7:28 PM, Solomon Mburu Kamau <solo.mburu@gmail.com> wrote:
On 04/04/2010, bitange@jambo.co.ke <bitange@jambo.co.ke> wrote:
Barrack, Several posts have come by on the role of ICT and I think it will be wise if we sorted this in a town hall meeting similar to one we had on Malili. Honestly it feels as though some Neanderthal decided to create
agencies without putting some thought to it. Criticisms are good only when you point out where there are gaps.
The other day I posted a policy proposal for comments but only one person did respond. What it means then is that this forum ni ya kuchongoana tu.
Dakitari, with due respect, would you mind resending the policy proposals as a new thread so that interested parties may respond? If sent within this thread, I'm afraid they'll be swallowed along
way.
Which really is unfortunate. I have four other policy proposals
really think should push through then arouse sufficient interest from the membership here.
I also think you should send them so that we react to the contents!
Ndemo.
> This is truly "Jicho Pevu", i think some answers to this questions
are
> very much in order as we celebrate Easter, can someone provide us with > a list of all agencies involved in ICTs and ICT4D so that we can do > some tooth comb analysis, i saw a post from Paul on what the board > has achieved early this year, that was very much in order we need > something from NCS as well plus any other agencies. > > Regards > > On Sat, Apr 3, 2010 at 12:50 PM, Vitalis Olunga < volunga@yahoo.com> wrote: >> There is also another body , National Communications Secretarait. What >> is >> the diffrence between NCS and ICT Baord and how do the two bodies relate >> with respect to advisory services to the governement on ICT matters? >> >> Regards >> >> >> Vitalis >> >> ________________________________ >> From: robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> >> To: volunga@yahoo.com >> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> >> Sent: Sat, April 3, 2010 12:03:22 PM >> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Who is ICT Board? Hijacked >> >> Hi, >> I rest my case on this issue, the ICT Board is a monolith, Try >> reading this... (pdf file), as I feared it is mandated to do anything >> and >> everything under the sun that could be called ICT which includes your >> microwave oven and copier. >> Functions of Kenya ICT Board >> The core functions of Kenya ICT Board as documented in the Kenya Gazette >> Legal Notice No 26 of the May 2007: >> ? To advice the government on all relevant matters pertaining to >> development, coordination (remember the PM post) and promotion of ICT >> industries in the country. >> ? Promote both locally and internationally the opportunities for >> investments in ICT technology >> ? Facilitate and manage ICT industrial incubation parks and technology >> parks together with associated facilities on sites, estates and land. >> ? Partner with agents within and without the country to carry out such >> functions as it may consider necessary. >> ? To transform and empower society through deployment and use of ICTs. >> ? Carry out any other activity to promote and develop ICT
On Mon, 05 Apr 2010 02:38 -0500, ikua@lpakenya.org wrote: these the that I products
and
>> services. >> Have a restful Easter as we await the limited range 4G, yes you guessed >> it I >> still have a 3G issue and I am in Nairobi. >> Regards >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> kictanet mailing list >> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke >> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet >> >> This message was sent to: otieno.barrack@gmail.com >> Unsubscribe or change your options at >>
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/otieno.barrack%40gmail . com
>> >> > > > > -- > Barrack O. Otieno > Geneva > Skype: barrack.otieno > > _______________________________________________ > kictanet mailing list > kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke > http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet > > This message was sent to: bitange@jambo.co.ke > Unsubscribe or change your options at >
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I have been following this conversation quietly for a while. Very valid points being raised even though as it has been pointed out it is a re-discussion from a few years ago. That said, it is important to discuss it until we get it. I submit that the roles and mandates of the various government agencies in this industry are well known. To see how they inter-relate we would merely have to read them side by side and it would be clear. I am willing to bet that one of the learned people here could draw a flow chart easily to show this. I agree that, that being the case, a lot of work needs to be done to build all the agencies' capacity to implement their mandates in the best way and a government CIO or vision holder could be a good idea. I do think that bitange ndemo is doing a good enough job of this as it is - despite the inter-ministerial limitations that he has to operate with (protocol, etc). Also the public engagement by some of the other agencies should be improved e.g. The NCS, so that what they do and how becomes more visible. The ICT board warrants so much review (rightly so) because of its outward role. The more cerebral agencies could be more 'with us'. But. I'd like to add something to this re-discussion that I wonder about. It seems to me that one of the things that need to be improved by us in the private sector and civil society is how we engage with government. Especially, I submit, the "thinkers", "pundits", "intellectuals" - here being researchers, scholars, consultants etc. I think there is space for the engagement with government to be more systematic, more structured and most importantly, more proactive. Currently (and I seek correction here) our engagement with government is fragmented and uncoordinated and therefore asks more questions than it answers. I find further that our discussions then remain in the armchair analysis phase and little systematic research and analysis is presented to stengthen government ways of business. Here is a clear indicator of this: in this re-discussion (as in previous ones) there have been calls for a platform that would coordinate thoughts and positions for government engagement. This, while KICTANET, computer Society of Kenya, ICT association of Kenya (which I saw today) etc., have low memberships, little interaction, and little delivery - well, with the exception of KICTANET which requires little physical exercise to participate in. It seems that the only time that we actually do contribute our time and knowledge is when we are asked or invited to by government - sometimes for allowances. I remember during my time in government the many conversations I had with pundits from the industry including some of the more vocal ones here, where they would consistently angle for a way to get allowances. In fact some even vociferously criticized the work done just so government could set up a committee or task force for them. I'm sure both Paul and the PS still get harrassed to date. But this isn't my point. My point is that we as civil society need to borrow a leaf from the larger private sector players, the multinationals, who organised monthly breakfasts to quietly understand government and offer knowledge in a systematic fashion that is then used to build on initiatives in a coordinated way. The MNC forum found competitors leave their competition outside and come together in that room. It is that initiative that gave rise to the Connected Government initiative that saw both various ministries come together and try to lower the silo walls but also create coordinated initiatives through private sector consortium building. Similar initiatives should be held by us in the civil society and smaller ICT businesses. Shouldn't we? Al Kags Head of Marketing and Partnerships, KCDF; Chairman, MCLABS; Founder, Al Kags Trust Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone from Zain Kenya -----Original Message----- From: Kamotho Njenga <kamothonjenga@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 6 Apr 2010 06:27:29 To: <alkags@alkags.com> Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Who is ICT Board? Hijacked _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet This message was sent to: alkags@alkags.com Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/alkags%40alkags.com
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Kamotho Njenga