Interesting Piece ...
Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is exceptionally stupid: Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walter’s level
let’s begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader who can succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Let’s dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, forever remain inferior.
since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he expects. Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion. On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
If we look beyond the effrontery there are very valid arguements there. Look at India - they manufacture many things - and yes they still have poverty but they are slowly clawing their way out of an abyss. I hear we have a bullet factory in eldoret - why can we not make bicycles? We had the nyayo pioneer car and I would like to hear a valid arguement why that could not have taken off and why we have become a nation of ex-Japan cars. We used to have a good textile industry but someone saw fit to allow containers of used clothes into the country - now we have decently dressed, hungry and jobless people. I think the tone is harsh but sometimes we need to take bitter pills. There is a generation growing up in Kenya who will start asking these same questions - and we cannot wish away the problem and either have to find credible answers or bring about some change. On 22/01/2012, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is exceptionally stupid:
Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walter’s level
let’s begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader who can succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Let’s dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, forever remain inferior.
since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he expects.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
I am with Francis. Let's look beyond the pointed tone and test the validity of the arguments made. As we go into yet another election season, is anyone (the so called "elites" and we are to be found on this list!) asking the right questions? What prevents us from developing a Kenyan tractor, then car by 2015, a Kenyan airplane by 2025? What prevents us from manufacturing locally, all that we import from China by 2020? As we debate who should or should not be allowed to run for office, are we demanding a leader or party with a platform and execution strategy to take us to the next level? Are we in the private realm entertaining big ideas and actively working towards their realisation? Could it be that it is because we actually don't plan big in our own personal spheres that we don't seem bothered with the dearth of transformative leadership platforms? Do we really test the premises and organising principles of the leaders we tout and when we don't find what we need, do we actively help work out the appropriate platforms (um... It is hard work - no pun intended)? My take away from this annoying but stimulating article is the question: Do a people who are engaged (determinedly) in transformative endeavours in their own personal realms (whether career, business or family) entertain mediocre systems, institutions or leaders? Mugo Sent from my iPad On 22 Jan 2012, at 22:13, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If we look beyond the effrontery there are very valid arguements there. Look at India - they manufacture many things - and yes they still have poverty but they are slowly clawing their way out of an abyss.
I hear we have a bullet factory in eldoret - why can we not make bicycles? We had the nyayo pioneer car and I would like to hear a valid arguement why that could not have taken off and why we have become a nation of ex-Japan cars. We used to have a good textile industry but someone saw fit to allow containers of used clothes into the country - now we have decently dressed, hungry and jobless people.
I think the tone is harsh but sometimes we need to take bitter pills. There is a generation growing up in Kenya who will start asking these same questions - and we cannot wish away the problem and either have to find credible answers or bring about some change.
On 22/01/2012, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is exceptionally stupid:
Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walter’s level
let’s begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader who can succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Let’s dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, forever remain inferior.
since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he expects.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/mugo%40vision2030.go.ke
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Not a lot prevents us from building a Kenyan car, although, last I heard, Railways had been unable to provide parts engineered to the the requisite precision. The point, rather, is that the worth of Africans doesn't depend on whether we can build stuff. The value of *people* does not depend on the *things* they can make. Second, concentrating on *things* is a distraction, especially for Africans. We ought to be as interested in the terms of production as in the production itself. Let me give you an example from the safely distant past. In the 19th century, there was a debate between Booker T Washington and WEB DuBois. Washington proposed an accommodation with White supremacy: Black folks would give up any attempt to secure their civil rights, in return for being allowed to keep some property, and the right to work. As DuBois pointed out, selling your rights for the dollar was a terrible bargain, because you had no guarantee that you would even get to keep the dollar. And so it proved. Since Blacks had no rights, they couldn't effectively protect their property. The fruits of their labour were plucked and eaten with complete impunity. You can read the horror stories in http://www.slaverybyanothername.com/ Africans, of all people, should know better than to listen to this nonsense. Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion. On 22 January 2012 21:36, Mugo Kibati <mugo@vision2030.go.ke> wrote:
I am with Francis.
Let's look beyond the pointed tone and test the validity of the arguments made. As we go into yet another election season, is anyone (the so called "elites" and we are to be found on this list!) asking the right questions? What prevents us from developing a Kenyan tractor, then car by 2015, a Kenyan airplane by 2025? What prevents us from manufacturing locally, all that we import from China by 2020?
As we debate who should or should not be allowed to run for office, are we demanding a leader or party with a platform and execution strategy to take us to the next level? Are we in the private realm entertaining big ideas and actively working towards their realisation? Could it be that it is because we actually don't plan big in our own personal spheres that we don't seem bothered with the dearth of transformative leadership platforms? Do we really test the premises and organising principles of the leaders we tout and when we don't find what we need, do we actively help work out the appropriate platforms (um... It is hard work - no pun intended)?
My take away from this annoying but stimulating article is the question: Do a people who are engaged (determinedly) in transformative endeavours in their own personal realms (whether career, business or family) entertain mediocre systems, institutions or leaders?
Mugo
Sent from my iPad
On 22 Jan 2012, at 22:13, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If we look beyond the effrontery there are very valid arguements there. Look at India - they manufacture many things - and yes they still have poverty but they are slowly clawing their way out of an abyss.
I hear we have a bullet factory in eldoret - why can we not make bicycles? We had the nyayo pioneer car and I would like to hear a valid arguement why that could not have taken off and why we have become a nation of ex-Japan cars. We used to have a good textile industry but someone saw fit to allow containers of used clothes into the country - now we have decently dressed, hungry and jobless people.
I think the tone is harsh but sometimes we need to take bitter pills. There is a generation growing up in Kenya who will start asking these same questions - and we cannot wish away the problem and either have to find credible answers or bring about some change.
On 22/01/2012, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is exceptionally stupid:
Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walter’s level
let’s begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader who can succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Let’s dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, forever remain inferior.
since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he expects.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
bandwidth,
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/mugo%40vision2030.go.ke
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
There doesn't appear to be a valid arguments in the piece. Walter argues as follows: (1) Africans are inferior. (The criterion for inferiority is White opinion. If White people *think* you're inferior, then you are. Walter clearly thinks Africans are inferior, and the listener, idiot that he is, accepts the thought.) (2) Africans are inferior *not* because they live in a world whose rules are set by people hostile to their interests, and have inherited a legacy of colonialism, slavery, apartheid and the like. (3) Africans are inferior because they don't make stuff. (Sub-argument: Africans don't make stuff because their intellectuals are stupid and lazy.) (4) Therefore, if Africans start making stuff, they'll stop being inferior. The argument neatly destroys itself. Walter tells us that if Africans made stuff, they would no longer be inferior. Now, the test of inferiority is White opinion, as both Walter and his listener make clear. So, all we have to do to test the argument is to look for examples of what White people think of non-White people who make things. The evidence is not far to seek, since *in the very same piece*, Walter claims that White people have contempt for Asians (I assume he means Indians and Chinese). Asians make things, yes, but, in the White view, according to Walter, they *stole* the technology for making it. Therefore, they remain inferior. Similar arguments can be found in the comments of any right-wing newspaper in English. Even where the industrial achievements of China or India are commended, White commentators will argue that Chinese, Indians or other East Asians are incapable of original thought. Their achievements are simply a copy of White achievement. There is no reason to think that making things will cause Africans to stop being regarded as inferior. The basic move here is the basic move in lots of colonial arguments. In virtue of being human, Africans are the equal of anyone else. The colonialist wants inequality. He has then to find a way to convince himself and others *either* that Africans are not human, *or* that equality rests on something other than humanity. Walter tells us that equality rests on the ability to make things. In the distant past, (see the concluding chapter of Johnston's A history of the colonisation of Africa by alien races<http://www.archive.org/details/cu31924074488234>), we were told that Africans were inferior because they had been unable to find a form of racial unity. Since they were unable to find a form of racial unity, they were doomed to be the servants of superior races from Africa and Asia. In the slightly less distant past (see Christopher Wilson's Kenya's Warning: The Challenge to White Supremacy in Our Colony<http://books.google.co.uk/books/about/Kenya_s_warning.html?id=8a0vAAAAIAAJ>) we were told that Africans were inferior, because their *cultures* were inferior, they circumcised their women and they were polygamous, therefore they had not earned the right to rule themselves. Examples could be multiplied. It's bad enough to have to read this shit from defenders of colonialism in the past and present, but I was not expecting to have to put up with it from Africans themselves. Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion. On 22 January 2012 19:13, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If we look beyond the effrontery there are very valid arguements there. Look at India - they manufacture many things - and yes they still have poverty but they are slowly clawing their way out of an abyss.
I hear we have a bullet factory in eldoret - why can we not make bicycles? We had the nyayo pioneer car and I would like to hear a valid arguement why that could not have taken off and why we have become a nation of ex-Japan cars. We used to have a good textile industry but someone saw fit to allow containers of used clothes into the country - now we have decently dressed, hungry and jobless people.
I think the tone is harsh but sometimes we need to take bitter pills. There is a generation growing up in Kenya who will start asking these same questions - and we cannot wish away the problem and either have to find credible answers or bring about some change.
On 22/01/2012, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is exceptionally stupid:
Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walter’s level
let’s begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader who can succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Let’s dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, forever remain inferior.
since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he expects.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
bandwidth,
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
I'd hoped you'd cite Chinua Achebe's "Things Fall Apart" which in essence touches on issues of inferiority/superiority. Okonkwo, the wrestler, the go to guy, one of the mainstays of his community vs the white missionaries and colonialists (and broadly those villagers who pandered to their whims). But sadly he elected to give in at the end. There are also other literary giants - pls bear with me - and lets puts History books aside for a moment (especially because, "Until lions start writing down their own stories, the hunters will always be the heroes") ...So literature was one way through which writers like Achebe, Soyinka, Meja Mwangi, Ngugi wa Thiongo, could create a vehicle to challenge African thinking, sometimes creating stereotypical characters (that reflect who we are or how we are perceived) to help bring about changes in people's thinking. Its not really about technology, production, etc - its about attitude (there was a movement of francophone writers who coined the phrase "negritude"). In the US Obama broadly blasted African Americans who always have the "victim" mentality and therefore always seek reparation rather than improving their own lot and stopping whining about how they have always been historically disadvantaged. He epitomises that positive thinking - and he is not even an African American, rather an American with an African father. On 23 January 2012 16:30, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
There doesn't appear to be a valid arguments in the piece.
Walter argues as follows:
(1) Africans are inferior.
(The criterion for inferiority is White opinion. If White people think you're inferior, then you are. Walter clearly thinks Africans are inferior, and the listener, idiot that he is, accepts the thought.)
(2) Africans are inferior not because they live in a world whose rules are set by people hostile to their interests, and have inherited a legacy of colonialism, slavery, apartheid and the like.
(3) Africans are inferior because they don't make stuff.
(Sub-argument: Africans don't make stuff because their intellectuals are stupid and lazy.)
(4) Therefore, if Africans start making stuff, they'll stop being inferior.
The argument neatly destroys itself. Walter tells us that if Africans made stuff, they would no longer be inferior. Now, the test of inferiority is White opinion, as both Walter and his listener make clear. So, all we have to do to test the argument is to look for examples of what White people think of non-White people who make things. The evidence is not far to seek, since in the very same piece, Walter claims that White people have contempt for Asians (I assume he means Indians and Chinese). Asians make things, yes, but, in the White view, according to Walter, they stole the technology for making it. Therefore, they remain inferior.
Similar arguments can be found in the comments of any right-wing newspaper in English. Even where the industrial achievements of China or India are commended, White commentators will argue that Chinese, Indians or other East Asians are incapable of original thought. Their achievements are simply a copy of White achievement. There is no reason to think that making things will cause Africans to stop being regarded as inferior.
The basic move here is the basic move in lots of colonial arguments. In virtue of being human, Africans are the equal of anyone else. The colonialist wants inequality. He has then to find a way to convince himself and others either that Africans are not human, or that equality rests on something other than humanity. Walter tells us that equality rests on the ability to make things. In the distant past, (see the concluding chapter of Johnston's A history of the colonisation of Africa by alien races), we were told that Africans were inferior because they had been unable to find a form of racial unity. Since they were unable to find a form of racial unity, they were doomed to be the servants of superior races from Africa and Asia. In the slightly less distant past (see Christopher Wilson's Kenya's Warning: The Challenge to White Supremacy in Our Colony) we were told that Africans were inferior, because their cultures were inferior, they circumcised their women and they were polygamous, therefore they had not earned the right to rule themselves. Examples could be multiplied. It's bad enough to have to read this shit from defenders of colonialism in the past and present, but I was not expecting to have to put up with it from Africans themselves.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 19:13, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If we look beyond the effrontery there are very valid arguements there. Look at India - they manufacture many things - and yes they still have poverty but they are slowly clawing their way out of an abyss.
I hear we have a bullet factory in eldoret - why can we not make bicycles? We had the nyayo pioneer car and I would like to hear a valid arguement why that could not have taken off and why we have become a nation of ex-Japan cars. We used to have a good textile industry but someone saw fit to allow containers of used clothes into the country - now we have decently dressed, hungry and jobless people.
I think the tone is harsh but sometimes we need to take bitter pills. There is a generation growing up in Kenya who will start asking these same questions - and we cannot wish away the problem and either have to find credible answers or bring about some change.
On 22/01/2012, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is exceptionally stupid:
Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walter’s level
let’s begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader who can succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Let’s dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, forever remain inferior.
since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he expects.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
Responding to Daniel's mostly excellent comments... Not to Darwinist / Evolutionist ideologies which "justified" Colonial Practice. No need for the kind of foul language used by Colonials to describe "Inferiors". What matters most is how we Africans treat each other. Do we believe in "Do to others as we would have them do to us"? Polygamy never opened schools to educate Africans... The Principle / Conviction... "Do to others as you would have them do to you" .... drove a few decent Euros to found schools / colleges such as Alliance High, Precious Blood, Strathmore, Kianda, etc... This while their Darwinist kinsmen opened Colonial schools Africans were not welcome to attend... Most of us love sports / games not formed in Africa but we reject as "Foreign" more Universal / Civilizing principles such ... "Do to others as you would have them do to you..." On Jan 23, 2012 4:31 PM, "Daniel Waweru" <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
There doesn't appear to be a valid arguments in the piece.
Walter argues as follows:
(1) Africans are inferior.
(The criterion for inferiority is White opinion. If White people *think* you're inferior, then you are. Walter clearly thinks Africans are inferior, and the listener, idiot that he is, accepts the thought.)
(2) Africans are inferior *not* because they live in a world whose rules are set by people hostile to their interests, and have inherited a legacy of colonialism, slavery, apartheid and the like.
(3) Africans are inferior because they don't make stuff.
(Sub-argument: Africans don't make stuff because their intellectuals are stupid and lazy.)
(4) Therefore, if Africans start making stuff, they'll stop being inferior.
The argument neatly destroys itself. Walter tells us that if Africans made stuff, they would no longer be inferior. Now, the test of inferiority is White opinion, as both Walter and his listener make clear. So, all we have to do to test the argument is to look for examples of what White people think of non-White people who make things. The evidence is not far to seek, since *in the very same piece*, Walter claims that White people have contempt for Asians (I assume he means Indians and Chinese). Asians make things, yes, but, in the White view, according to Walter, they *stole*the technology for making it. Therefore, they remain inferior.
Similar arguments can be found in the comments of any right-wing newspaper in English. Even where the industrial achievements of China or India are commended, White commentators will argue that Chinese, Indians or other East Asians are incapable of original thought. Their achievements are simply a copy of White achievement. There is no reason to think that making things will cause Africans to stop being regarded as inferior.
The basic move here is the basic move in lots of colonial arguments. In virtue of being human, Africans are the equal of anyone else. The colonialist wants inequality. He has then to find a way to convince himself and others *either* that Africans are not human, *or* that equality rests on something other than humanity. Walter tells us that equality rests on the ability to make things. In the distant past, (see the concluding chapter of Johnston's A history of the colonisation of Africa by alien races <http://www.archive.org/details/cu31924074488234>), we were told that Africans were inferior because they had been unable to find a form of racial unity. Since they were unable to find a form of racial unity, they were doomed to be the servants of superior races from Africa and Asia. In the slightly less distant past (see Christopher Wilson's Kenya's Warning: The Challenge to White Supremacy in Our Colony<http://books.google.co.uk/books/about/Kenya_s_warning.html?id=8a0vAAAAIAAJ>) we were told that Africans were inferior, because their *cultures* were inferior, they circumcised their women and they were polygamous, therefore they had not earned the right to rule themselves. Examples could be multiplied. It's bad enough to have to read this shit from defenders of colonialism in the past and present, but I was not expecting to have to put up with it from Africans themselves.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 19:13, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If we look beyond the effrontery there are very valid arguements there. Look at India - they manufacture many things - and yes they still have poverty but they are slowly clawing their way out of an abyss.
I hear we have a bullet factory in eldoret - why can we not make bicycles? We had the nyayo pioneer car and I would like to hear a valid arguement why that could not have taken off and why we have become a nation of ex-Japan cars. We used to have a good textile industry but someone saw fit to allow containers of used clothes into the country - now we have decently dressed, hungry and jobless people.
I think the tone is harsh but sometimes we need to take bitter pills. There is a generation growing up in Kenya who will start asking these same questions - and we cannot wish away the problem and either have to find credible answers or bring about some change.
On 22/01/2012, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is exceptionally stupid:
Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walter’s level
let’s begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader who can succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Let’s dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, forever remain inferior.
since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he expects.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
bandwidth,
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/murigi.muraya%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Hey all, Not sure if anyone has already posted the follow up to this piece? Well worth a read. You know, over Kenyan coffee, when you're not doing ICT stuff :) http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/23/now-that-we-are-all-at-attentio... Have a lovely Wednesday, Andrea On 23 January 2012 17:09, S.M. Muraya <murigi.muraya@gmail.com> wrote:
Responding to Daniel's mostly excellent comments... Not to Darwinist / Evolutionist ideologies which "justified" Colonial Practice.
No need for the kind of foul language used by Colonials to describe "Inferiors".
What matters most is how we Africans treat each other. Do we believe in "Do to others as we would have them do to us"?
Polygamy never opened schools to educate Africans...
The Principle / Conviction... "Do to others as you would have them do to you" .... drove a few decent Euros to found schools / colleges such as Alliance High, Precious Blood, Strathmore, Kianda, etc...
This while their Darwinist kinsmen opened Colonial schools Africans were not welcome to attend...
Most of us love sports / games not formed in Africa but we reject as "Foreign" more Universal / Civilizing principles such ... "Do to others as you would have them do to you..." On Jan 23, 2012 4:31 PM, "Daniel Waweru" <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
There doesn't appear to be a valid arguments in the piece.
Walter argues as follows:
(1) Africans are inferior.
(The criterion for inferiority is White opinion. If White people *think* you're inferior, then you are. Walter clearly thinks Africans are inferior, and the listener, idiot that he is, accepts the thought.)
(2) Africans are inferior *not* because they live in a world whose rules are set by people hostile to their interests, and have inherited a legacy of colonialism, slavery, apartheid and the like.
(3) Africans are inferior because they don't make stuff.
(Sub-argument: Africans don't make stuff because their intellectuals are stupid and lazy.)
(4) Therefore, if Africans start making stuff, they'll stop being inferior.
The argument neatly destroys itself. Walter tells us that if Africans made stuff, they would no longer be inferior. Now, the test of inferiority is White opinion, as both Walter and his listener make clear. So, all we have to do to test the argument is to look for examples of what White people think of non-White people who make things. The evidence is not far to seek, since *in the very same piece*, Walter claims that White people have contempt for Asians (I assume he means Indians and Chinese). Asians make things, yes, but, in the White view, according to Walter, they * stole* the technology for making it. Therefore, they remain inferior.
Similar arguments can be found in the comments of any right-wing newspaper in English. Even where the industrial achievements of China or India are commended, White commentators will argue that Chinese, Indians or other East Asians are incapable of original thought. Their achievements are simply a copy of White achievement. There is no reason to think that making things will cause Africans to stop being regarded as inferior.
The basic move here is the basic move in lots of colonial arguments. In virtue of being human, Africans are the equal of anyone else. The colonialist wants inequality. He has then to find a way to convince himself and others *either* that Africans are not human, *or* that equality rests on something other than humanity. Walter tells us that equality rests on the ability to make things. In the distant past, (see the concluding chapter of Johnston's A history of the colonisation of Africa by alien races <http://www.archive.org/details/cu31924074488234>), we were told that Africans were inferior because they had been unable to find a form of racial unity. Since they were unable to find a form of racial unity, they were doomed to be the servants of superior races from Africa and Asia. In the slightly less distant past (see Christopher Wilson's Kenya's Warning: The Challenge to White Supremacy in Our Colony<http://books.google.co.uk/books/about/Kenya_s_warning.html?id=8a0vAAAAIAAJ>) we were told that Africans were inferior, because their *cultures* were inferior, they circumcised their women and they were polygamous, therefore they had not earned the right to rule themselves. Examples could be multiplied. It's bad enough to have to read this shit from defenders of colonialism in the past and present, but I was not expecting to have to put up with it from Africans themselves.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 19:13, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If we look beyond the effrontery there are very valid arguements there. Look at India - they manufacture many things - and yes they still have poverty but they are slowly clawing their way out of an abyss.
I hear we have a bullet factory in eldoret - why can we not make bicycles? We had the nyayo pioneer car and I would like to hear a valid arguement why that could not have taken off and why we have become a nation of ex-Japan cars. We used to have a good textile industry but someone saw fit to allow containers of used clothes into the country - now we have decently dressed, hungry and jobless people.
I think the tone is harsh but sometimes we need to take bitter pills. There is a generation growing up in Kenya who will start asking these same questions - and we cannot wish away the problem and either have to find credible answers or bring about some change.
Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is exceptionally stupid:
Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walter’s level
let’s begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader who can succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Let’s dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, forever remain inferior.
since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he expects.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder
for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect
On 22/01/2012, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote: platform privacy, do
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/murigi.muraya%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/andrea.bohnstedt%40rati...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Andrea Bohnstedt <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/andreabohnstedt> Publisher +254 720 960 322 www.ratio-magazine.com Find/post East Africa careers<http://www.ratio-magazine.com/careers/index.php> Find/post conferences, workshops, trainings, other business events<http://www.ratio-magazine.com/businessevents/index.php>
It's all well and good, aiming for the Kenyan car, Kenyan plane and all. However, being the third world country we are, we need to face the facts. As a country, we need to be sober and face the facts. We need to use what we have to make gains. What will putting billions of shillings into making a Kenyan plane aid us if we still have hungry people in our midst? Wouldn't a fraction of that being channeled into making boreholes and expanding the footprint of arable land be a better bet. Granted, We are at the consumption end of the line. We will not make an iPhone contender that will lift us out of poverty or what not. We need to know what we can do within our means that will solve our perennial problems affecting our basic needs. Address our reliance on good weather to have food security. Come up with cheap housing. Address our inefficient transport channels that add an unnecessary cost on goods. Use our ideas to inject simple technology into mundane activities. Use our Kenyan peculiar nature to squeeze some commerce out of it. The idea in the article of the stone crusher is an excellent example. What we need to do, is take stock of our assets, have a plan to each year be at a better place than the last. Have policies that would entrench the build Kenya buy Kenyan idea. Africa as a market is fueling western economies. And there will definitely be resistance to its attempts at economic independence. The day we will have genuine pride in owning something Kenyan, is the first day of the best of our lives. Over to you Mr Kibati.
Hi Simiyu...if I may quickly try and address some issues you have raised...or simply comment - pls see below, preceded by +++ On 25 January 2012 13:40, simiyu mse <kensimiyu@gmail.com> wrote:
It's all well and good, aiming for the Kenyan car, Kenyan plane and all.
However, being the third world country we are, we need to face the facts. As a country, we need to be sober and face the facts. We need to use what we have to make gains.
What will putting billions of shillings into making a Kenyan plane aid us if we still have hungry people in our midst? +++Like Boeing/Airbus/Lockheed- we can make and sell planes. A GREAT success story about making plance actually comes from a BRIC state, which not so long ago was a developing country - Brazil. http://www.businessweek.com/2001/01_03/b3715141.htm - that link is from a story more than 10 years ago. Today Embraer has abt 14% mkt share in the mid size category of aeroplanes...not bad, huh. Employment, innovation, supporting raw materials industry, skills, etc. For a long time they have been manufacturing VWs (not assembling like we used to do with Peugeots - but manufacturing from scratch)
Wouldn't a fraction of that being
channeled into making boreholes and expanding the footprint of arable land be a better bet.
+++ I'd sooner we start by reducing the ministries from 40 to 20. Cut back on the number of vehicles a minister has, asst minister etc - have a govt car pool (are the cars not parked most of the day?). Not meaning to underestimate the amounts needed to drill boreholes and and invest in agriculture - but thats a good start - we don't need all those cars (and their maintenance costs). Mostly we don't need them bull dozing us (the tax payer) off the road because mheshimiwa is passing.
Granted, We are at the consumption end of the line. We will not make an iPhone contender that will lift us out of poverty or what not.
know what we can do within our means that will solve our perennial problems affecting our basic needs. Address our reliance on good weather to have food security. +++What does Israel do for good weather? I heard once, a while back, that when one of their road contractors was building Thika Road (Solel Boneh?) in the late eighties, all the red soil they dredged up to build the road was shipped back to Israel to be used in irrigated farms. Lets come back to Kenya - in December we had very heavy rain in Nairobi. I recall at one point driving through floods with
+++Why not? If a Form Three Tanzanian student could actually contribute in a big way to physics by a simple observation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mpemba_effect) - what is stopping us from thinking big? Mpesa grew here did it not? RSA manufacturers computers and servers (Mecer), Nigeria has Zinox (and there were plans at some point to open mobile handset assembly plants but I suppose the drop in handset costs as well as operator subsidies put paid to such plans to assemble phones in Africa to make them cheaper than hungary/poland/china/etc). We need to headlights submerged. OK, flooding happens everywhere but if our urban infrastructure was better planned (storm drains, etc) all this water could have gone into a reservoir - even if its 100 km away (Ukambani) ...and used for irrigation. Thankfully we are way out of any hurrican/cyclone paths but I shudder to think how we'd handle such flooding like we saw in Asia recently. The annual flooding in Nyanza pales in comparison. When you think about it, the effort needed to build an aqueduct, would be no more different than building a new road and perhaps take just as long. Such an aqueduct could help along the way if it can be purified for low income areas that have no piped water, etc... We cannot always have good weather - but we can plan ahead. Our floods are the seven fat cows Joseph saw in his dreams. Come up with cheap housing. Address our inefficient transport
channels that add an unnecessary cost on goods.
Sorry if this is out of place but looking at our traffic and congestion, I cannot help thinking of "the tragedy of the commons" - everyone want a car and therefore everybody will add a car to the limited road infrastructure we have. (Just as the farmers would each add a cow to the pasture and therefore the cows collectively would not eat enough). People shun public transport and associate it with being lower class - and if at this point I may allude to the IMF/whatever person critical of African intellectuals - that is a problem in Africa. We associate cars with status. I think half the pple who work on Wall Street take the train, ride the bus or cycle to work. But uh uh, not here. Show up to work even with a decent MTB and well, you have excused yourself from a certain class. But I digress. I'd do two things - increase import duty on second hand cars and also have a montly quota - esp for personal cars. Right now the only people benefitting from ex-Dubai vehicles are 1)Individuals who import the cars 2)KRA (from the import duty and VAT, from increased petroleum use, etc) 3)individuals who want cars 4)the matatu sector (which contributes very little to govt coffers, and if anything, is a blight to the country - insurance claims, lawlessness, cartels, etc). I am not sure why the govt should back down from phasing out the 14 seaters - as much as the cartels may try and muscle the govt, the govt should know that citizens will throw their weight behind any effort to bring sanity not this sector - just like they lauded Hon Michuki back in the day. If we can put pressure on used car imports, it can also help prop up local assembly and creating thousands of jobs (vis a vis the import of used cars that probably directly employs less than 1000 people in Kenya and indirectly. Local assembly would employ perhaps tenfold IMHO. (assembly of CKDs, local manufacture and fabrication of other parts - upholstery, bodies, tyres, etc).
Use our ideas to inject simple technology into mundane activities. Kenyan peculiar nature to squeeze some commerce out of it. +++Done - Mpesa. Pls tick this off your things to do list.
The idea in the
article of the stone crusher is an excellent example.
What we need to do, is take stock of our assets, have a plan to each year be at a better place than the last. Have policies that would entrench the build Kenya buy Kenyan idea.
Africa as a market is fueling western economies. And there will definitely be resistance to its attempts at economic independence. +++True - and following that resistance will be efforts at "regime change"...
The day we will have genuine pride in owning something Kenyan, is the first day of the best of our lives.
Over to you Mr Kibati.
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/francis.hook%40gmail.co...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 1:40 PM, simiyu mse <kensimiyu@gmail.com> wrote:
What will putting billions of shillings into making a Kenyan plane aid us if we still have hungry people in our midst? Wouldn't a fraction of that being channeled into making boreholes and expanding the footprint of arable land be a better bet.
Granted, We are at the consumption end of the line. We will not make an iPhone contender that will lift us out of poverty or what not. We need to know what we can do within our means that will solve our perennial problems affecting our basic needs. Address our reliance on good weather to have food security. Come up with cheap housing. Address our inefficient transport channels that add an unnecessary cost on goods.
Use our ideas to inject simple technology into mundane activities. Use our Kenyan peculiar nature to squeeze some commerce out of it. The idea in the article of the stone crusher is an excellent example.
If we leave out the tone and nature of the article, it has some very accurate and painful facts: - We can't feed ourselves (we will have a crisis in Northern Kenya, where corporates will be involved in another 'Kenyans4Kenya' campaign - remember Kiss FM used to spear head this, now Safaricom). - We can't build basic roads - Waiyaki Way developed potholes less than 3 months after completion. - We can't build railways - The london subway system was opened up in 1862. We've not had any significant additions to our railway infrastructure in the 50 odd years we have been 'in charge of things'. - Our political system is a mess - The fact that we have people facing war crimes charges still in Public office says a lot about our ethics and values. - Our education system is a mess. Before we think of building airplanes etc, why can't we start with the basics? e.g. KPLC have proven that incompetence can actually be embedded into a company's corporate DNA. Given that, many companies/individuals are buying inverters and battery banks to insulate them from the 'KPLC effect (darkness)'. We have many guys in the informal sector who build basic inverters. Why can't the government increase taxes on imported inverters to aid in the sale of the locally assembled ones (which can also be modified for use with solar panels)? This will give the Kenya a skillset in inverters etc. Given that the basic physics behind them is the same as that used by KPLC's high voltage step down transformers, we can then start using locally assembled transformers and slightly fix our balance of trade whilst creating a new industry. Our engineers will have practical experience in building products and more will be employed. They can start building other products such as windmills/motors/power backup systems (just random thoughts). Basic product innovation is what we need to do. Affordable and within reach. Policy just needs to aid this. -- Warm Regards, Phares Kaboro Kariuki
I wouldn't change the tax regime at all. If local inverter manufacturers want a share of the market they need to build stuff the market is willing to pay for. That also means the government needs to find opportunities for technology transfer, get inverter manufacturers to set up shop here so that we know how its done. By the way, shouldn't KenyaPower consider other options to keeping customers powered? Sell/lease gensets, inverters, batteries, solar solutions... Is KenyaPower's mandate to sell only electricity delivered by the wire? Maybe I digress but it is my opinion that opportunities are embedded in the challenges we complain most about. It maybe simply about distilling their business to the basics. The comments I have seen on Facebook and on the blog in reaction to the post for the most part seem to focus on the challenges Walter throws out and what we should do as a people. Others (fewer) point quickly to the tone, language and twisted view of Africans that Walter expresses. There will be no consensus of opinion on any of that. However, the conversations triggered and the viral spread of the article is definitely telling. It is important to hear others out even when they are wrong :) Someone else's warped view of us can only be modified by evidence not by loud protests and there are many like Walter with a view of Africa that needs modification. The evidence exists, we simply need to tell these stories on our platforms and celebrate the good things that are happening in Africa. Kind regards, Muchiri Nyaggah | PRINCIPAL PARTNER @muchiri Cell: +254 722 506400 eGOVERNMENT | HEALTHCARE PLATFORMS | CUSTOMER EXPERIENCE | TECHNOLOGY SEMACRAFT CONSULTING PARTNERS Nairobi | Singapore www.semacraft.com | www.semacraft.com/blog twitter: @semacraft On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 2:42 PM, Phares Kariuki <pkariuki@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 1:40 PM, simiyu mse <kensimiyu@gmail.com> wrote:
What will putting billions of shillings into making a Kenyan plane aid us if we still have hungry people in our midst? Wouldn't a fraction of that being channeled into making boreholes and expanding the footprint of arable land be a better bet.
Granted, We are at the consumption end of the line. We will not make an iPhone contender that will lift us out of poverty or what not. We need to know what we can do within our means that will solve our perennial problems affecting our basic needs. Address our reliance on good weather to have food security. Come up with cheap housing. Address our inefficient transport channels that add an unnecessary cost on goods.
Use our ideas to inject simple technology into mundane activities. Use our Kenyan peculiar nature to squeeze some commerce out of it. The idea in the article of the stone crusher is an excellent example.
If we leave out the tone and nature of the article, it has some very accurate and painful facts:
- We can't feed ourselves (we will have a crisis in Northern Kenya, where corporates will be involved in another 'Kenyans4Kenya' campaign - remember Kiss FM used to spear head this, now Safaricom). - We can't build basic roads - Waiyaki Way developed potholes less than 3 months after completion. - We can't build railways - The london subway system was opened up in 1862. We've not had any significant additions to our railway infrastructure in the 50 odd years we have been 'in charge of things'. - Our political system is a mess - The fact that we have people facing war crimes charges still in Public office says a lot about our ethics and values. - Our education system is a mess.
Before we think of building airplanes etc, why can't we start with the basics? e.g. KPLC have proven that incompetence can actually be embedded into a company's corporate DNA. Given that, many companies/individuals are buying inverters and battery banks to insulate them from the 'KPLC effect (darkness)'. We have many guys in the informal sector who build basic inverters. Why can't the government increase taxes on imported inverters to aid in the sale of the locally assembled ones (which can also be modified for use with solar panels)? This will give the Kenya a skillset in inverters etc. Given that the basic physics behind them is the same as that used by KPLC's high voltage step down transformers, we can then start using locally assembled transformers and slightly fix our balance of trade whilst creating a new industry. Our engineers will have practical experience in building products and more will be employed. They can start building other products such as windmills/motors/power backup systems (just random thoughts).
Basic product innovation is what we need to do. Affordable and within reach. Policy just needs to aid this.
-- Warm Regards,
Phares Kaboro Kariuki
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/muchiri%40semacraft.com
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
The problem in Africa is resources, we have resources, but the problem is in the distribution of the same resources, as Hook has shown. A country may have food in one location while people are dying of food in another. I was discussing with a pal over lunch, and she pointed out that a constituency might be forced to fund hospitals in several locations, rather than one hospital to be shared in the whole constituency. the many hospitals will take many CDF cycles before they are completed, and the locations may not even be in a position to run the hospitals. Individuals will also siphon funds into their personal accounts, and will hide the money in Swiss bank accounts thus denying their home countries of liquid cash. Even if not convicted, such people should be forced to return the money back, or invest it locally, and have their charges waived in return. Furthermore, Africa has to learn to share resources, rather than divide them.
Let me weigh in on this resources issue: Many of us have experienced poverty at different levels. My thinking (formed by a mix of observation,history and some research) the transition from living on the edge to self sufficiency even for an individual is not going to automagically happen. I have over and over tried getting raises at work hoping to get away from 'poverty'. It loves me it seems. There is no magic bullet and it wont take a year or two, even for most individuals. We do however need to see some sort of effort in the right direction. By everyone including myself. It is inevitable that for some time we'll experience a lowering of what we can afford. We do have the resources. I prefer looking at it this way: If I improve my life then there's a high chance I improve those around me and on and on it goes. I try and imagine patriotism built around our ability to adapt as opposed to how many cars or money I(we) have or which polititian or tribe I support. It is feasible to invest in natural capital - to improve soil and water quality, to plant more trees that will bear and serve future generations, and pass down more and better - maybe not more and better economic growth (what is that to an individual right?), but more and better natural resources; better priorities.Maybe if (I) we can find a way to induce people to improve their culture, soils, water, resources, we may find that living with much less is easier. I definately find it easier...now on to making more money :-) In the end it starts and probably ends with you! Gitau On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 3:58 PM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
The problem in Africa is resources, we have resources, but the problem is in the distribution of the same resources, as Hook has shown.
A country may have food in one location while people are dying of food in another.
I was discussing with a pal over lunch, and she pointed out that a constituency might be forced to fund hospitals in several locations, rather than one hospital to be shared in the whole constituency. the many hospitals will take many CDF cycles before they are completed, and the locations may not even be in a position to run the hospitals.
Individuals will also siphon funds into their personal accounts, and will hide the money in Swiss bank accounts thus denying their home countries of liquid cash. Even if not convicted, such people should be forced to return the money back, or invest it locally, and have their charges waived in return.
Furthermore, Africa has to learn to share resources, rather than divide them.
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/jgitau%40gmail.com
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- **Gitau
Thanks for the warm words, and apologies for the language. It really is something of a surprise to see a piece like this; a piece couched explicitly in the language of superiority and inferiority. I mean, in my experience, nobody---except internet trolls and a segment of White rightwing opinion---actually thinks like this. If White folks by and large don't think this stuff, what possible reason is there for this silliness? Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion. On 23 January 2012 14:09, S.M. Muraya <murigi.muraya@gmail.com> wrote:
Responding to Daniel's mostly excellent comments... Not to Darwinist / Evolutionist ideologies which "justified" Colonial Practice.
No need for the kind of foul language used by Colonials to describe "Inferiors".
What matters most is how we Africans treat each other. Do we believe in "Do to others as we would have them do to us"?
Polygamy never opened schools to educate Africans...
The Principle / Conviction... "Do to others as you would have them do to you" .... drove a few decent Euros to found schools / colleges such as Alliance High, Precious Blood, Strathmore, Kianda, etc...
This while their Darwinist kinsmen opened Colonial schools Africans were not welcome to attend...
Most of us love sports / games not formed in Africa but we reject as "Foreign" more Universal / Civilizing principles such ... "Do to others as you would have them do to you..." On Jan 23, 2012 4:31 PM, "Daniel Waweru" <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
There doesn't appear to be a valid arguments in the piece.
Walter argues as follows:
(1) Africans are inferior.
(The criterion for inferiority is White opinion. If White people *think* you're inferior, then you are. Walter clearly thinks Africans are inferior, and the listener, idiot that he is, accepts the thought.)
(2) Africans are inferior *not* because they live in a world whose rules are set by people hostile to their interests, and have inherited a legacy of colonialism, slavery, apartheid and the like.
(3) Africans are inferior because they don't make stuff.
(Sub-argument: Africans don't make stuff because their intellectuals are stupid and lazy.)
(4) Therefore, if Africans start making stuff, they'll stop being inferior.
The argument neatly destroys itself. Walter tells us that if Africans made stuff, they would no longer be inferior. Now, the test of inferiority is White opinion, as both Walter and his listener make clear. So, all we have to do to test the argument is to look for examples of what White people think of non-White people who make things. The evidence is not far to seek, since *in the very same piece*, Walter claims that White people have contempt for Asians (I assume he means Indians and Chinese). Asians make things, yes, but, in the White view, according to Walter, they * stole* the technology for making it. Therefore, they remain inferior.
Similar arguments can be found in the comments of any right-wing newspaper in English. Even where the industrial achievements of China or India are commended, White commentators will argue that Chinese, Indians or other East Asians are incapable of original thought. Their achievements are simply a copy of White achievement. There is no reason to think that making things will cause Africans to stop being regarded as inferior.
The basic move here is the basic move in lots of colonial arguments. In virtue of being human, Africans are the equal of anyone else. The colonialist wants inequality. He has then to find a way to convince himself and others *either* that Africans are not human, *or* that equality rests on something other than humanity. Walter tells us that equality rests on the ability to make things. In the distant past, (see the concluding chapter of Johnston's A history of the colonisation of Africa by alien races <http://www.archive.org/details/cu31924074488234>), we were told that Africans were inferior because they had been unable to find a form of racial unity. Since they were unable to find a form of racial unity, they were doomed to be the servants of superior races from Africa and Asia. In the slightly less distant past (see Christopher Wilson's Kenya's Warning: The Challenge to White Supremacy in Our Colony<http://books.google.co.uk/books/about/Kenya_s_warning.html?id=8a0vAAAAIAAJ>) we were told that Africans were inferior, because their *cultures* were inferior, they circumcised their women and they were polygamous, therefore they had not earned the right to rule themselves. Examples could be multiplied. It's bad enough to have to read this shit from defenders of colonialism in the past and present, but I was not expecting to have to put up with it from Africans themselves.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 19:13, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If we look beyond the effrontery there are very valid arguements there. Look at India - they manufacture many things - and yes they still have poverty but they are slowly clawing their way out of an abyss.
I hear we have a bullet factory in eldoret - why can we not make bicycles? We had the nyayo pioneer car and I would like to hear a valid arguement why that could not have taken off and why we have become a nation of ex-Japan cars. We used to have a good textile industry but someone saw fit to allow containers of used clothes into the country - now we have decently dressed, hungry and jobless people.
I think the tone is harsh but sometimes we need to take bitter pills. There is a generation growing up in Kenya who will start asking these same questions - and we cannot wish away the problem and either have to find credible answers or bring about some change.
Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is exceptionally stupid:
Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walter’s level
let’s begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader who can succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Let’s dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, forever remain inferior.
since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he expects.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder
for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect
On 22/01/2012, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote: platform privacy, do
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/murigi.muraya%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Daniel, I am not sure why you find it surprising to see such an article. The only difference between Walter and many others of his kind is that he is brave enough to speak it aloud. That does not change what many others think- they think the same. There is only one solution- TO ACT. We all know what ails our lovely continent, what needs to be done, what we are capable of etc. Time to act. Less talk, more action. It is the same practice in various aspects: whether it is black vs white, rich vs poor, one ethnic tribe vs another- the more dominant one takes advantage of the perceived "weaker" one. It is up to the "weaker" one to rise up and turn the tables around. Look at the case here in Kenya. The majority are in the "poorer" bracket but always used by the rich to help them remain in their powerful positions. The masses are yet to learn they have the power in their hands to bring about the change they want rather than blame the rich for exploiting them. It is the same mockery Walter is giving in the article. Why give anyone a chance to trample on you? Instead of moaning, we should simply rise up and turn the tables around! Let us have the last laugh! My two cents. Gilda Odera Quoting Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com>:
Thanks for the warm words, and apologies for the language.
It really is something of a surprise to see a piece like this; a piece couched explicitly in the language of superiority and inferiority. I mean, in my experience, nobody---except internet trolls and a segment of White rightwing opinion---actually thinks like this. If White folks by and large don't think this stuff, what possible reason is there for this silliness?
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 23 January 2012 14:09, S.M. Muraya <murigi.muraya@gmail.com> wrote:
Responding to Daniel's mostly excellent comments... Not to Darwinist / Evolutionist ideologies which "justified" Colonial Practice.
No need for the kind of foul language used by Colonials to describe "Inferiors".
What matters most is how we Africans treat each other. Do we believe in "Do to others as we would have them do to us"?
Polygamy never opened schools to educate Africans...
The Principle / Conviction... "Do to others as you would have them do to you" .... drove a few decent Euros to found schools / colleges such as Alliance High, Precious Blood, Strathmore, Kianda, etc...
This while their Darwinist kinsmen opened Colonial schools Africans were not welcome to attend...
Most of us love sports / games not formed in Africa but we reject as "Foreign" more Universal / Civilizing principles such ... "Do to others as you would have them do to you..." On Jan 23, 2012 4:31 PM, "Daniel Waweru" <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
There doesn't appear to be a valid arguments in the piece.
Walter argues as follows:
(1) Africans are inferior.
(The criterion for inferiority is White opinion. If White people *think* you're inferior, then you are. Walter clearly thinks Africans are inferior, and the listener, idiot that he is, accepts the thought.)
(2) Africans are inferior *not* because they live in a world whose rules are set by people hostile to their interests, and have inherited a legacy of colonialism, slavery, apartheid and the like.
(3) Africans are inferior because they don't make stuff.
(Sub-argument: Africans don't make stuff because their intellectuals are stupid and lazy.)
(4) Therefore, if Africans start making stuff, they'll stop being inferior.
The argument neatly destroys itself. Walter tells us that if Africans made stuff, they would no longer be inferior. Now, the test of inferiority is White opinion, as both Walter and his listener make clear. So, all we have to do to test the argument is to look for examples of what White people think of non-White people who make things. The evidence is not far to seek, since *in the very same piece*, Walter claims that White people have contempt for Asians (I assume he means Indians and Chinese). Asians make things, yes, but, in the White view, according to Walter, they * stole* the technology for making it. Therefore, they remain inferior.
Similar arguments can be found in the comments of any right-wing newspaper in English. Even where the industrial achievements of China or India are commended, White commentators will argue that Chinese, Indians or other East Asians are incapable of original thought. Their achievements are simply a copy of White achievement. There is no reason to think that making things will cause Africans to stop being regarded as inferior.
The basic move here is the basic move in lots of colonial arguments. In virtue of being human, Africans are the equal of anyone else. The colonialist wants inequality. He has then to find a way to convince himself and others *either* that Africans are not human, *or* that equality rests on something other than humanity. Walter tells us that equality rests on the ability to make things. In the distant past, (see the concluding chapter of Johnston's A history of the colonisation of Africa by alien races <http://www.archive.org/details/cu31924074488234>), we were told that Africans were inferior because they had been unable to find a form of racial unity. Since they were unable to find a form of racial unity, they were doomed to be the servants of superior races from Africa and Asia. In the slightly less distant past (see Christopher Wilson's Kenya's Warning: The Challenge to White Supremacy in Our
Colony<http://books.google.co.uk/books/about/Kenya_s_warning.html?id=8a0vAAAAIAAJ>)
we were told that Africans were inferior, because their *cultures* were inferior, they circumcised their women and they were polygamous, therefore they had not earned the right to rule themselves. Examples could be multiplied. It's bad enough to have to read this shit from defenders of colonialism in the past and present, but I was not expecting to have to put up with it from Africans themselves.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 19:13, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If we look beyond the effrontery there are very valid arguements there. Look at India - they manufacture many things - and yes they still have poverty but they are slowly clawing their way out of an abyss.
I hear we have a bullet factory in eldoret - why can we not make bicycles? We had the nyayo pioneer car and I would like to hear a valid arguement why that could not have taken off and why we have become a nation of ex-Japan cars. We used to have a good textile industry but someone saw fit to allow containers of used clothes into the country - now we have decently dressed, hungry and jobless people.
I think the tone is harsh but sometimes we need to take bitter pills. There is a generation growing up in Kenya who will start asking these same questions - and we cannot wish away the problem and either have to find credible answers or bring about some change.
On 22/01/2012, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is exceptionally stupid:
Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walters level
lets begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader who can succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Lets dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, forever remain inferior.
since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he expects.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder
for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect
platform privacy, do
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/murigi.muraya%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and
development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
bandwidth,
share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
The 'Walter' of the piece is obviously not a real person. The tone of the article is a stylistic device, intended to provoke - which clearly worked. It's deliberately 'couched explicitly in the language of superiority and inferiority', to use Daniel's words. And seems to have served its purpose. Andrea On 26 January 2012 11:46, <godera@skyweb.co.ke> wrote:
Daniel,
I am not sure why you find it surprising to see such an article. The only difference between Walter and many others of his kind is that he is brave enough to speak it aloud. That does not change what many others think- they think the same. There is only one solution- TO ACT. We all know what ails our lovely continent, what needs to be done, what we are capable of etc. Time to act. Less talk, more action. It is the same practice in various aspects: whether it is black vs white, rich vs poor, one ethnic tribe vs another- the more dominant one takes advantage of the perceived "weaker" one. It is up to the "weaker" one to rise up and turn the tables around. Look at the case here in Kenya. The majority are in the "poorer" bracket but always used by the rich to help them remain in their powerful positions. The masses are yet to learn they have the power in their hands to bring about the change they want rather than blame the rich for exploiting them. It is the same mockery Walter is giving in the article. Why give anyone a chance to trample on you? Instead of moaning, we should simply rise up and turn the tables around! Let us have the last laugh!
My two cents.
Gilda Odera
Quoting Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com>:
Thanks for the warm words, and apologies for the language.
It really is something of a surprise to see a piece like this; a piece couched explicitly in the language of superiority and inferiority. I mean, in my experience, nobody---except internet trolls and a segment of White rightwing opinion---actually thinks like this. If White folks by and large don't think this stuff, what possible reason is there for this silliness?
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 23 January 2012 14:09, S.M. Muraya <murigi.muraya@gmail.com> wrote:
Responding to Daniel's mostly excellent comments... Not to Darwinist / Evolutionist ideologies which "justified" Colonial Practice.
No need for the kind of foul language used by Colonials to describe "Inferiors".
What matters most is how we Africans treat each other. Do we believe in "Do to others as we would have them do to us"?
Polygamy never opened schools to educate Africans...
The Principle / Conviction... "Do to others as you would have them do to you" .... drove a few decent Euros to found schools / colleges such as Alliance High, Precious Blood, Strathmore, Kianda, etc...
This while their Darwinist kinsmen opened Colonial schools Africans were not welcome to attend...
Most of us love sports / games not formed in Africa but we reject as "Foreign" more Universal / Civilizing principles such ... "Do to others as you would have them do to you..." On Jan 23, 2012 4:31 PM, "Daniel Waweru" <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
There doesn't appear to be a valid arguments in the piece.
Walter argues as follows:
(1) Africans are inferior.
(The criterion for inferiority is White opinion. If White people *think* you're inferior, then you are. Walter clearly thinks Africans are inferior, and the listener, idiot that he is, accepts the thought.)
(2) Africans are inferior *not* because they live in a world whose rules are set by people hostile to their interests, and have inherited a legacy of colonialism, slavery, apartheid and the like.
(3) Africans are inferior because they don't make stuff.
(Sub-argument: Africans don't make stuff because their intellectuals are stupid and lazy.)
(4) Therefore, if Africans start making stuff, they'll stop being inferior.
The argument neatly destroys itself. Walter tells us that if Africans made stuff, they would no longer be inferior. Now, the test of inferiority is White opinion, as both Walter and his listener make clear. So, all we have to do to test the argument is to look for examples of what White people think of non-White people who make things. The evidence is not far to seek, since *in the very same piece*, Walter claims that White people have contempt for Asians (I assume he means Indians and Chinese). Asians make things, yes, but, in the White view, according to Walter, they * stole* the technology for making it. Therefore, they remain inferior.
Similar arguments can be found in the comments of any right-wing newspaper in English. Even where the industrial achievements of China or India are commended, White commentators will argue that Chinese, Indians or other East Asians are incapable of original thought. Their achievements are simply a copy of White achievement. There is no reason to think that making things will cause Africans to stop being regarded as inferior.
The basic move here is the basic move in lots of colonial arguments. In virtue of being human, Africans are the equal of anyone else. The colonialist wants inequality. He has then to find a way to convince himself and others *either* that Africans are not human, *or* that equality rests on something other than humanity. Walter tells us that equality rests on the ability to make things. In the distant past, (see the concluding chapter of Johnston's A history of the colonisation of Africa by alien races <http://www.archive.org/details/cu31924074488234>), we were told that Africans were inferior because they had been unable to find a form of racial unity. Since they were unable to find a form of racial unity, they were doomed to be the servants of superior races from Africa and Asia. In the slightly less distant past (see Christopher Wilson's Kenya's Warning: The Challenge to White Supremacy in Our
we were told that Africans were inferior, because their *cultures* were inferior, they circumcised their women and they were polygamous,
they had not earned the right to rule themselves. Examples could be multiplied. It's bad enough to have to read this shit from defenders of colonialism in the past and present, but I was not expecting to have to
) therefore put
up with it from Africans themselves.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 19:13, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If we look beyond the effrontery there are very valid arguements there. Look at India - they manufacture many things - and yes they still have poverty but they are slowly clawing their way out of an abyss.
I hear we have a bullet factory in eldoret - why can we not make bicycles? We had the nyayo pioneer car and I would like to hear a valid arguement why that could not have taken off and why we have become a nation of ex-Japan cars. We used to have a good textile industry but someone saw fit to allow containers of used clothes into the country - now we have decently dressed, hungry and jobless
Colony< http://books.google.co.uk/books/about/Kenya_s_warning.html?id=8a0vAAAAIAAJ people.
I think the tone is harsh but sometimes we need to take bitter pills. There is a generation growing up in Kenya who will start asking these same questions - and we cannot wish away the problem and either have to find credible answers or bring about some change.
On 22/01/2012, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is exceptionally stupid:
Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walter’s level > let’s begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader
who
can
> succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone > crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Let’s > dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, > forever remain inferior.
since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he expects.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
> > _______________________________________________ > kictanet mailing list > kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke > http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet > > Unsubscribe or change your options at >
> > The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform > for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and > regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c... the
> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and > development. > > KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors > online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, > share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect
ICT privacy, do
> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. >
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder
for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/murigi.muraya%40gmail.c... platform privacy, do
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/andrea.bohnstedt%40rati...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Andrea Bohnstedt <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/andreabohnstedt> Publisher +254 720 960 322 www.ratio-magazine.com Find/post East Africa careers<http://www.ratio-magazine.com/careers/index.php> Find/post conferences, workshops, trainings, other business events<http://www.ratio-magazine.com/businessevents/index.php>
Yes. I had email from a Zambian who had a long go at explaining why the piece was very unpopular, even with Zambians. One of the things I was told was that the Walter was clearly fictional. Perhaps I ought to have worked it out for myself. Anyway. Here's a very nice Zambian response: http://www.thoughtleader.co.za/archbishoptutufellows/2012/01/25/a-zambians-r... Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion. On 26 January 2012 08:48, Andrea Bohnstedt < andrea.bohnstedt@ratio-magazine.com> wrote:
The 'Walter' of the piece is obviously not a real person. The tone of the article is a stylistic device, intended to provoke - which clearly worked. It's deliberately 'couched explicitly in the language of superiority and inferiority', to use Daniel's words.
And seems to have served its purpose.
Andrea
On 26 January 2012 11:46, <godera@skyweb.co.ke> wrote:
Daniel,
I am not sure why you find it surprising to see such an article. The only difference between Walter and many others of his kind is that he is brave enough to speak it aloud. That does not change what many others think- they think the same. There is only one solution- TO ACT. We all know what ails our lovely continent, what needs to be done, what we are capable of etc. Time to act. Less talk, more action. It is the same practice in various aspects: whether it is black vs white, rich vs poor, one ethnic tribe vs another- the more dominant one takes advantage of the perceived "weaker" one. It is up to the "weaker" one to rise up and turn the tables around. Look at the case here in Kenya. The majority are in the "poorer" bracket but always used by the rich to help them remain in their powerful positions. The masses are yet to learn they have the power in their hands to bring about the change they want rather than blame the rich for exploiting them. It is the same mockery Walter is giving in the article. Why give anyone a chance to trample on you? Instead of moaning, we should simply rise up and turn the tables around! Let us have the last laugh!
My two cents.
Gilda Odera
Quoting Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com>:
Thanks for the warm words, and apologies for the language.
It really is something of a surprise to see a piece like this; a piece couched explicitly in the language of superiority and inferiority. I mean, in my experience, nobody---except internet trolls and a segment of White rightwing opinion---actually thinks like this. If White folks by and large don't think this stuff, what possible reason is there for this silliness?
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 23 January 2012 14:09, S.M. Muraya <murigi.muraya@gmail.com> wrote:
Responding to Daniel's mostly excellent comments... Not to Darwinist / Evolutionist ideologies which "justified" Colonial Practice.
No need for the kind of foul language used by Colonials to describe "Inferiors".
What matters most is how we Africans treat each other. Do we believe in "Do to others as we would have them do to us"?
Polygamy never opened schools to educate Africans...
The Principle / Conviction... "Do to others as you would have them do to you" .... drove a few decent Euros to found schools / colleges such as Alliance High, Precious Blood, Strathmore, Kianda, etc...
This while their Darwinist kinsmen opened Colonial schools Africans were not welcome to attend...
Most of us love sports / games not formed in Africa but we reject as "Foreign" more Universal / Civilizing principles such ... "Do to others as you would have them do to you..." On Jan 23, 2012 4:31 PM, "Daniel Waweru" <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote:
There doesn't appear to be a valid arguments in the piece.
Walter argues as follows:
(1) Africans are inferior.
(The criterion for inferiority is White opinion. If White people *think* you're inferior, then you are. Walter clearly thinks Africans are inferior, and the listener, idiot that he is, accepts the thought.)
(2) Africans are inferior *not* because they live in a world whose rules are set by people hostile to their interests, and have inherited a legacy of colonialism, slavery, apartheid and the like.
(3) Africans are inferior because they don't make stuff.
(Sub-argument: Africans don't make stuff because their intellectuals are stupid and lazy.)
(4) Therefore, if Africans start making stuff, they'll stop being inferior.
The argument neatly destroys itself. Walter tells us that if Africans made stuff, they would no longer be inferior. Now, the test of inferiority is White opinion, as both Walter and his listener make clear. So, all we have to do to test the argument is to look for examples of what White people think of non-White people who make things. The evidence is not far to seek, since *in the very same piece*, Walter claims that White people have contempt for Asians (I assume he means Indians and Chinese). Asians make things, yes, but, in the White view, according to Walter, they * stole* the technology for making it. Therefore, they remain inferior.
Similar arguments can be found in the comments of any right-wing newspaper in English. Even where the industrial achievements of China or India are commended, White commentators will argue that Chinese, Indians or other East Asians are incapable of original thought. Their achievements are simply a copy of White achievement. There is no reason to think that making things will cause Africans to stop being regarded as inferior.
The basic move here is the basic move in lots of colonial arguments. In virtue of being human, Africans are the equal of anyone else. The colonialist wants inequality. He has then to find a way to convince himself and others *either* that Africans are not human, *or* that equality rests on something other than humanity. Walter tells us that equality rests on the ability to make things. In the distant past, (see the concluding chapter of Johnston's A history of the colonisation of Africa by alien races <http://www.archive.org/details/cu31924074488234>), we were told that Africans were inferior because they had been unable to find a form of racial unity. Since they were unable to find a form of racial unity, they were doomed to be the servants of superior races from Africa and Asia. In the slightly less distant past (see Christopher Wilson's Kenya's Warning: The Challenge to White Supremacy in Our
we were told that Africans were inferior, because their *cultures* were inferior, they circumcised their women and they were polygamous,
they had not earned the right to rule themselves. Examples could be multiplied. It's bad enough to have to read this shit from defenders of colonialism in the past and present, but I was not expecting to have to
) therefore put
up with it from Africans themselves.
Daniel Waweru www.kenyaimagine.com Art and analysis; debate and opinion.
On 22 January 2012 19:13, Francis Hook <francis.hook@gmail.com> wrote:
If we look beyond the effrontery there are very valid arguements there. Look at India - they manufacture many things - and yes they still have poverty but they are slowly clawing their way out of an abyss.
I hear we have a bullet factory in eldoret - why can we not make bicycles? We had the nyayo pioneer car and I would like to hear a valid arguement why that could not have taken off and why we have become a nation of ex-Japan cars. We used to have a good textile industry but someone saw fit to allow containers of used clothes into the country - now we have decently dressed, hungry and jobless
I think the tone is harsh but sometimes we need to take bitter
There is a generation growing up in Kenya who will start asking
Colony< http://books.google.co.uk/books/about/Kenya_s_warning.html?id=8a0vAAAAIAAJ people. pills. these
same questions - and we cannot wish away the problem and either have to find credible answers or bring about some change.
On 22/01/2012, Daniel Waweru <daniel.waweru@gmail.com> wrote: > Astonishingly stupid piece. I wouldn't have been surprised had it turned > out that Ewart Grogan had written it. This part, in particular, is > exceptionally stupid: > > Knowing well that King Cobra will not embody innovation at Walter’s level >> let’s begin to look for a technologically active-positive leader who can >> succeed him after a term or two. That way we can make our own stone >> crushers, water filters, water pumps, razor blades, and harvesters. Let’s >> dream big and make tractors, cars, and planes, or, like Walter said, >> forever remain inferior. > > > since it *fully* accepts the colonial premiss that the human value of > people depends on their level of technological advancement. The author > proves his point about African intellectuals, if not in quite the way he > expects. > > > Daniel Waweru > www.kenyaimagine.com > Art and analysis; debate and opinion. > > > On 22 January 2012 17:30, Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> wrote: > >> >>
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
>> >> _______________________________________________ >> kictanet mailing list >> kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke >> http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet >> >> Unsubscribe or change your options at >>
>> >> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform >> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT
>> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c... policy and the
ICT >> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and >> development. >> >> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors >> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, >> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do >> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. >> >
-- Francis Hook +254 733 504561
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder
for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/murigi.muraya%40gmail.c... platform privacy, do
not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/andrea.bohnstedt%40rati...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Andrea Bohnstedt <http://ke.linkedin.com/in/andreabohnstedt> Publisher +254 720 960 322
www.ratio-magazine.com Find/post East Africa careers<http://www.ratio-magazine.com/careers/index.php> Find/post conferences, workshops, trainings, other business events<http://www.ratio-magazine.com/businessevents/index.php>
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/daniel.waweru%40gmail.c...
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Liko, Thanks for sharing this post. Very provoking and depending on one's mind-set can be taken positively or negatively. My two cents- truth hurts and it is a fact what Walter is saying,delivery method not withstanding! True change only comes when one sees and accepts the truth as it is then does something about it. Best, Gilda Odera Quoting Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com>:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
Thought provoking, indeed. Thanks, Liko and Listers. I agree with some of Walters thoughts. We are all aiming for a PhD or something similar. What is it for? What will change for us and the society after we achieve it? Let me add this. We all pass through this world once. Only once. I think a careful thought of these two sentences should make a difference how we do things. I agree with Mugo, there is nothing that will prevent us from achieving some of the things in his list. Cleophas On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 9:39 AM, <godera@skyweb.co.ke> wrote:
Liko,
Thanks for sharing this post. Very provoking and depending on one's mind-set can be taken positively or negatively. My two cents- truth hurts and it is a fact what Walter is saying,delivery method not withstanding! True change only comes when one sees and accepts the truth as it is then does something about it.
Best,
Gilda Odera
Quoting Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com>:
http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s...
------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/cbarmasai%40gmail.com
The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Ha ha ha ha ha, Liko seems there are more mad men in this market place apart from myself, welcome to the club. (When the inmates are more than the outmates the whole world becomes an asylum) Listers, where the word Zambia appears replace it with Kenya, where Lusaka appears replace it with Nairobi and where Kalingalinga appears replace it with Kibera, the context of the message remains valid. Dr. Ndemo its time to start supplying those of us on the list with guava juice and marketing to us footballs from your young men in the village for our forthcoming campaigns. Mr. Kibati, its time to send those phds in the vision 2030 secretariat to Gikomba, industrialisation will not happen on the eve of 2030 it is a process that begins where we are now. Mr. Kukubo, the solution to our problems are known and the solution is right here not on the beaches of Italy, the marine cable is an interesting solution and so is Konza but unless we are the ones driving the use we remain lazy. Lets stop fêteing mediocrity by funding ideas. I have not read such a revetting post in a long time, I hope it will prick our consciences and spur us into action. Regards Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696 ________________________________ From: Agosta Liko <agostal@gmail.com> To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Sunday, 22 January 2012, 20:30 Subject: [kictanet] Interesting Piece ... http://mindofmalaka.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/you-lazy-intellectual-african-s... _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/robertyawe%40yahoo.co.u... The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
participants (14)
-
Agosta Liko -
Andrea Bohnstedt -
Cleophas Barmasai -
Daniel Waweru -
Dennis Kioko -
Francis Hook -
godera＠skyweb.co.ke -
John Gitau -
Muchiri Nyaggah -
Mugo Kibati -
Phares Kariuki -
robert yawe -
S.M. Muraya -
simiyu mse