Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
Waithaka My point exactly. A mix of both sometimes works wonders.. Ali Hussein +254 0770 906375 / 0713 601113 "Kujikwaa si kuanguka, bali ni kwenda mbele" (To stumble is not to fall but a sign of going forward) - Swahili Proverb Sent from my iPad On Sep 18, 2013, at 9:07 PM, Ngigi Waithaka <ngigi@at.co.ke> wrote:
Hussein,
There is usually a corner reserved for soft-power and persuasion; where the person on the receiving end either makes an honest mistake or simply doesn't know or have the capability to understand how to achieve a certain task.
Soft-power usually loses its 'power' where the other person is making a conscious decision, knowing very well the conscious decision is wrong and there is no big stick if they continue anyway e.g corruption
So fighting corruption with soft-power, as an example is largely doomed to fail as we have been doing.
As regards the organisations, just setting them by themselves is not enough. Indeed we do have many serious organizations already, but they rely too much on soft power.
If you look at similar industries, such as Banking, they don't shy away from taking GoK, KRA etc to court, if they feel that certain practices are infringing on the rights of their members, such as these http://www.newtimes.co.rw/news/views/article_print.php?15293&a=64747&icon=Print
We should use soft-power knowing very well that we do have a fall back position of taking the powers that be straight on if need be.\\
Waithaka Ngigi A1.iO
On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 7:31 PM, Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote:
Robert and all
I disagree. Sometimes it takes the 'soft' power of such informal groupings to make changes. Yes, we do require from a legal stand point registered Organizations make representation. However I contend that there is space for both.
KICTANET has had some very loud successes in influencing policy and sometimes concrete action for positive change. Cases in point:-
1. The issue of KeNIC and the uncertainty it faces were first 'aired' here. The jury (or is it the Supreme Court?) is still out on how this will play out. There is an AGM tomorrow by the way...
2. The issue of Kenya's position in WCIT12 Dubai was extensively debated here and 'forced' the powers that be to take into consideration other stakeholders position besides that of the CCK.
3. One Robert Yawe's throwing his towel into the ring for Post Master General's position at Posta. Although unsuccessful :) made a major point on what ails Posta.
The list goes on..
Ali Hussein
+254 0770 906375 / 0713 601113
"Kujikwaa si kuanguka, bali ni kwenda mbele" (To stumble is not to fall but a sign of going forward) - Swahili Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 18, 2013, at 5:39 PM, "Gilda Odera" <godera@skyweb.co.ke> wrote:
Over to the lurkers – you have heard Robert. Be the change you want.
From: robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk] Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2013 5:13 PM To: Gilda Odera Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
@Gilda,
Just to reiterate what I said about a certain Presidential candidate, for democracy to be effective we must register as voters and then actually go out and vote.
Sitting at home with a valid voters card cannot then be justification to have your opinion heard.
Regards
Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya
Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696
From: Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> To: 'robert yawe' <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Wednesday, 18 September 2013, 16:59 Subject: RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
@Robert- Trust you to speak the Queen’s English J and thank you for being candid as usual. Now that I get your comment, I partially agree. Yes, the formidable bodies should be consulted or be heard but let us hear comments/advise/opinions from all quarters. Democracy is necessary here Robert. After all, we are communicating on KICTANET as it is right now so it must have some standing J.
From: robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk] Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2013 3:04 PM To: Gilda Odera Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
@Gilda,
In english, KICTANET has no moral or legal standing to require it be consulted unlike CSK and KIF.
Regards
Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya
Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696
From: Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> To: 'robert yawe' <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Wednesday, 18 September 2013, 9:34 Subject: RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
@Robert- meaning? Please talk ‘transparently’ so we all understand what you are trying to say. Are you saying it is costly for the CS to engage CSK? He sent an email saying he is noting all comments on this list so let us give him credit for that. Or am I not understanding what you are saying here below?
Gilda
From: robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk] Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2013 8:22 AM To: Gilda Odera Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
@Gilda,
The CS has consulted the industry players who are members of an organised and duly constituted organisation, it goes by the name of CSK or in short Computer Society of Kenya.
As one Presidential Candidate found in a very costly manner that the number of friends you have on social media do not convert to valid electoral votes.
It is time we all brushed our memory banks and realise that we have been down this road and past this kiosk many times before, unfortunately we have never stopped to have chai na bandika.
Regards
PS. I am sure Dr. Siganga was consulted especially since Victor is a member of the society.
"As I cry in the wilderness I pray to be heard" - An Village Madman in exile
Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya
Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696
From: Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Tuesday, 17 September 2013, 11:55 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
Listers,
I assume that the CS and other powers that be are reading these comments. I wish to urge them, for the sake of this industry which we all know is key to the development of this nation, to do what is right. The ICT Authority requires goodwill of industry players and the best of the best to propel this industry to great heights. This means having an open process of selection where the most suitable candidate will emerge amongst others. Some of those names being touted are indeed very capable but the CS would be doing them injustice if he simply handpicked anyone. Let he/she who is worthy of the job stand up and present himself/herself in a transparent competitive process. I believe a full enlightened board consisting of knowledgable and dedicated persons (not simply well connected ones please) should be in place before the CEO is picked. And if it is a different panel interviewing, it really must consist of persons well versed. We must break away from past practices where a CEO of a parastatal has no respect nor time for the board he/she reports to simply because of owing allegiance to an individual who appointed him/her. This is what ails organizations and in the end you find poor performance and a decline or collapse of an entire sector simply due to in-fighting and insubordination. I am keenly watching how this will transpire. I would like to believe the new government is serious about developing this industry and will therefore do the right thing.
Regards,
Gilda Odera
-----Original Message----- From: kictanet [mailto:kictanet-bounces+godera=skyweb.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of Edwin Onchari Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 6:09 PM To: godera@skyweb.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
+ 1
Edwin
-----Original Message----- From: kictanet [mailto:kictanet-bounces+eonchari=lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of kictanet-request@lists.kictanet.or.ke Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 4:06 PM To: Edwin Subject: kictanet Digest, Vol 76, Issue 27
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership (Brian Munyao Longwe)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1 Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 16:03:10 +0300 From: Brian Munyao Longwe <blongwe@gmail.com> To: Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> Cc: "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>, "isoc@orion.my.co.ke" <isoc@orion.my.co.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership Message-ID: <CAHSdPfbdD=XRe9qcoe73ikpyfAp8ZHj6vFtBZ7EVr6taPyjEbw@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Interesting to note that in this whole discussion no one seems to mention/consider that ICTA is an amalgamation of KICT Board, Department of e-Government and the Government Information Technology Services (GITS). If continuity is the focus, aren't the heads of any of the other agencies/departments also potential candidates?
Best regards,
Mblayo
On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 3:10 PM, Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> wrote:
Mr. Walubengo, in broad daylight you are advocating we do a kangaroo shortlisting, interview, and appointment. :)
Why would anybody want to participate in the process with the end result already known?
______________________ Mwendwa Kivuva twitter.com/lordmwesh google ID | Skype ID: lordmwesh
On 6 September 2013 09:12, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
------------------------------ **Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote,
@John, that's just it...it's not illegal..it may be challenged in court but it seems that the executive is acting within the confines of the law. ~~~~~~~ The unilateral appointment would indeed be "legal" as it is enshrined in the Legal notice. However, the clever lawyers would not be challenging the appointment (since it would be legal), but they would be challenging whether it is constitutional to "legalize" such an action of appointing without inviting other Kenyans to apply...(discrimination)
Remember that the constitution is the supreme law and any other law(Act, Legal Notice, Regulation, etc) that is contradictory to it is null and void. Am not a lawyer but I think that is where the court battle would be about. In the likely event that the courts find that the legal notice is in violation of the constitution, then by extension the appointment becomes null and void.
Problem is that this would take time and meanwhile whoever is appointed is likely to have his/her hands tied up and cannot transact ICT Authority business. Thats why I said, why bother with the risks? Just advertise the job, go through the motions and safely arrive at the same destination.
We did this successfully for our Cabinet Sec and PS, I still dont understand why it should become difficult for a CEO :-)
walu. ------------------------------ *From:* Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke>
*To:* jwalu@yahoo.com *Cc:* "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Friday, September 6, 2013 6:27 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership
@Kivuva
You are quite right.
@Walu, I believe the correct phrase is '*The end justifies the means'. :) *
@John, that's just it...it's not illegal..it may be challenged in court but it seems that the executive is acting within the confines of the law.
Ali Hussein CEO | 3mice interactive media Ltd Principal | Telemedia Africa Ltd
+254 713 601113/ 0770 906375
"The future belongs to him who knows how to wait." - Russian Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 5, 2013, at 10:49 PM, Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> wrote:
Because we know who is being targeted for this position, and we know his attributes and leadership qualities, and we acknowledge this is just a onetime appointment, why don't we discuss the merits and de-merits of Dr. Victor Kyalo?
I feel there is something members want to say but are being held back by diplomacy.
Lets remember as it has been stated here previously, anybody holding this public office will still have to pass the test of LEADERSHIP and INTEGRITY as envisioned in the constitution
On 05/09/2013, Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote:
Listers
Sometimes expediency requires that there is continuity and institutional
memory carry over to allow for a smooth transition.
In this particular case the Ag.CEO provides an excellent reason for this. He
has the expertise, experience, qualifications and the political savvy ness
to navigate this new monster called the ICTA.
The CS may need to look at constituting a new board though.
I say let the new team move with expediency and judge it by the results.
Regards
Ali Hussein
CEO | 3mice interactive media Ltd
Principal | Telemedia Africa Ltd
+254 713 601113/ 0770 906375
"The future belongs to him who knows how to wait." - Russian Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 5, 2013, at 2:34 PM, "Judy M. Muli" <judym.muli@gmail.com> wrote:
Listers,
What happened to the hookup, to discuss some of these issues and forge a
united front.
Judy
On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 1:40 PM, Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Thanks Walu.
Great analysis. You are right about the need to avoid unnecessary
litigation (read unnecessary negative publicity). Cofek already posted
the article on its site and you never know if it is considering following
up on the matter.
http://www.cofek.co.ke/index.php/14-news/253-tired-talk-of-presidenti al-executive-orders-and-unacceptable-plain-illegality-of-single-sourc ed-ict-authority-boss
.
I agree with you on the need to advertise this job and still get the
"right man/woman" for it. The CS should not allow the matter to be
determined by the courts.
May I suggest that you consider this topic for your Nation Blog next
week? This 2010 Constitution. Argh!
Rgds
GG
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 03:12:47 -0700
From: jwalu@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
To: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
@GG
I see the comparison - and specifically the fact that the previous CEO of
the ICT Board was expected to be unilaterally selected by the Minister.
However, that was then(2006/7). Fast-forward to today (2013) - with the
notable development of the new constitution (2010).
This thing (Constitution 2010) changed so much - even the President today
cannot do stuff his predecessors used to do over a game of golf/beer/etc.
And so it would be the case for the Kenya ICT Authority - one cannot just
borrow a previous clause and paste it into a new, bigger and different
institution. ICT Authority (2013) is miles apart from ICT board (2007)
in form, nature, scope and mandate.
For example, ICT Board(2007) was an institution with an
"administratively" limited ministerial scope -that is why other
Ministries could afford to ignore them. Today the ICT Authority is an
animal with sweeping powers that cut across Ministries and govt agencies.
The CEO appointment therefore requires and is indeed given a more
rigorous approach in the legal notice.
What raised the storm is why the need to exempt the 1st CEO from this
rigorous approach? My unsolicited advise would be for the CS to ignore
the clause, advertise the job (open it up for everyone) - and still get
(his?) the right man/woman for the job. After all, he has or can create
the required "magnanimity" (opposite of Tyranny :-) of the numbers in
the Board.
The other route is vulnerable to too much and unnecessary litigation that
may cripple the ICT Authority for years before it gets started. E.g
Someone can file a suit to determine whether the contentious clause goes
against the constitutional provision for non-discrimination. While the
suit is being determined ICT Authority will remain crippled/handicapped
for years.
walu.
From: Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
To: jwalu@yahoo.com
Cc: "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Wednesday, September 4, 2013 2:41 PM
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
@ Walu,
For comparison purposes, see legal notice legal Notice 26 of 2007
http://www.kenyalaw.org/klr/index.php?id=568 (STATE CORPORATION KENYA
INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY BOARD 2007)
From: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
Subject: RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 09:13:46 +0000
Thanks Loise for sharing the legal notice.
@ Yawe you are right. That is the nature of the notice. You do not need
to be subjected to public scrutiny:) (On a light note, it is a pity since
I would be interested to know your inside manenos).
@ Brian, Walu, and Alice
I have just skimmed through the notice and in matters of the ICT
Authority appointments (both board and first CEO) it actually gives the
CS carte blanche. There may not be a row after all! Maybe some mischief
at the drafting process of the notice which ensured that it ignored
article 10 of the constitution which lays emphasis on consulting in
policy making processes. @ Kapiyo, @ Grace Bomu, what are your comments?
Rgds
GG
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 09:58:31 +0100
From: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
To: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
Hi,
There goes my opportunity to be appointed without having to jump through
hoops that require me to answer questions from my questionable past.
Regards
Robert Yawe
KAY System Technologies Ltd
Phoenix House, 6th Floor
P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200
Kenya
Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696
From: Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Monday, 2 September 2013, 15:02
Subject: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
A row is simmering in the Ministry of Information, Communication and
Technology over a law that gives the Cabinet secretary power to make
unilateral appointment.
Executive Order No. 2 of 2013 by President Uhuru Kenyatta on the
reorganisation of government that establishes the Information and
Communications Technology Authority ( ICTA) gives the ICT Cabinet
Secretary power to appoint the CEO of the authority without involving the
board.
http://www.standardmedia.co.ke/?articleID=2000092541&story_title=row- simmers-over-order-on-new-icta-leadership
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for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and
development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and
bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect
privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform
for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and
regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT
sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and
development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
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-- Regards,
Waithaka Ngigi Chief Executive Officer | Alliance Technologies | MCK Nairobi Synod Building T + 254 (0) 20 2333 471 |Office Mobile: +254 786 28 28 28 | M + 254 737 811 000 www.at.co.ke
Listers, As we proceed with this discussion allow me to remind us all of the provisions of Article 10 of the Constitution of Kenya, 2010, which provides as thus: 10. (1) The national values and principles of governance in this Article bind all State organs, State officers, public officers and all persons whenever any of them– (a) applies or interprets this Constitution; (b) enacts, applies or interprets any law; or (c) makes or implements public policy decisions. (2) The national values and principles of governance include– (a) patriotism, national unity, sharing and devolution of power, the rule of law, democracy and participation of the people; (b) human dignity, equity, social justice, inclusiveness, equality, human rights, non-discrimination and protection of the marginalised; (c) good governance, integrity, transparency and accountability; and (d) sustainable development. These principles are non-negotiable. Therefore, it is important that consultations are done bearing in mind the principles espoused above. Hence, and i dare say, regardless of whether KICTANET is a registered or not, it still is a critical network of stakeholders that must be consulted on matters touching on ICT industry, just like all the other non-state actors. I believe the CS (and his officers) are aware of these provisions and will ultimately do the right thing. Failure to which, he shall be in clear violation of the Katiba, consequences of which, we are all too well aware of. Regards, Victor On 18 Sep 2013 21:24, "Ali Hussein" <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote:
Waithaka
My point exactly. A mix of both sometimes works wonders..
Ali Hussein
+254 0770 906375 / 0713 601113
"Kujikwaa si kuanguka, bali ni kwenda mbele" (To stumble is not to fall but a sign of going forward) - Swahili Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 18, 2013, at 9:07 PM, Ngigi Waithaka <ngigi@at.co.ke> wrote:
Hussein,
There is usually a corner reserved for soft-power and persuasion; where the person on the receiving end either makes an honest mistake or simply doesn't know or have the capability to understand how to achieve a certain task.
Soft-power usually loses its 'power' where the other person is making a conscious decision, knowing very well the conscious decision is wrong and there is no big stick if they continue anyway e.g corruption
So fighting corruption with soft-power, as an example is largely doomed to fail as we have been doing.
As regards the organisations, just setting them by themselves is not enough. Indeed we do have many serious organizations already, but they rely too much on soft power.
If you look at similar industries, such as Banking, they don't shy away from taking GoK, KRA etc to court, if they feel that certain practices are infringing on the rights of their members, such as these http://www.newtimes.co.rw/news/views/article_print.php?15293&a=64747&icon=Print
We should use soft-power knowing very well that we do have a fall back position of taking the powers that be straight on if need be.\\
Waithaka Ngigi A1.iO
On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 7:31 PM, Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote:
Robert and all
I disagree. Sometimes it takes the 'soft' power of such informal groupings to make changes. Yes, we do require from a legal stand point registered Organizations make representation. However I contend that there is space for both.
KICTANET has had some very loud successes in influencing policy and sometimes concrete action for positive change. Cases in point:-
1. The issue of KeNIC and the uncertainty it faces were first 'aired' here. The jury (or is it the Supreme Court?) is still out on how this will play out. There is an AGM tomorrow by the way...
2. The issue of Kenya's position in WCIT12 Dubai was extensively debated here and 'forced' the powers that be to take into consideration other stakeholders position besides that of the CCK.
3. One Robert Yawe's throwing his towel into the ring for Post Master General's position at Posta. Although unsuccessful :) made a major point on what ails Posta.
The list goes on..
Ali Hussein
+254 0770 906375 / 0713 601113
"Kujikwaa si kuanguka, bali ni kwenda mbele" (To stumble is not to fall but a sign of going forward) - Swahili Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 18, 2013, at 5:39 PM, "Gilda Odera" <godera@skyweb.co.ke> wrote:
Over to the lurkers – you have heard Robert. Be the change you want.****
** **
*From:* robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk<robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk>]
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 18, 2013 5:13 PM *To:* Gilda Odera *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication****
** **
@Gilda,
Just to reiterate what I said about a certain Presidential candidate, for democracy to be effective we must register as voters and then actually go out and vote.
Sitting at home with a valid voters card cannot then be justification to have your opinion heard.
Regards****
****
Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya****
** **
Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696****
** ** ------------------------------
*From:* Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> *To:* 'robert yawe' <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Wednesday, 18 September 2013, 16:59 *Subject:* RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication****
** **
@Robert- Trust you to speak the Queen’s English J and thank you for being candid as usual. Now that I get your comment, I partially agree. Yes, the formidable bodies should be consulted or be heard but let us hear comments/advise/opinions from all quarters. Democracy is necessary here Robert. After all, we are communicating on KICTANET as it is right now so it must have some standing J. ****
****
*From:* robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk<robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk>]
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 18, 2013 3:04 PM *To:* Gilda Odera *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication****
****
@Gilda,
In english, KICTANET has no moral or legal standing to require it be consulted unlike CSK and KIF.
Regards****
****
Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya****
****
Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696****
**** ------------------------------
*From:* Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> *To:* 'robert yawe' <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Wednesday, 18 September 2013, 9:34 *Subject:* RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication****
****
@Robert- meaning? Please talk ‘transparently’ so we all understand what you are trying to say. Are you saying it is costly for the CS to engage CSK? He sent an email saying he is noting all comments on this list so let us give him credit for that. Or am I not understanding what you are saying here below? ****
****
Gilda ****
****
*From:* robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk<robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk>]
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 18, 2013 8:22 AM *To:* Gilda Odera *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication****
****
@Gilda,
The CS has consulted the industry players who are members of an organised and duly constituted organisation, it goes by the name of CSK or in short Computer Society of Kenya.****
****
As one Presidential Candidate found in a very costly manner that the number of friends you have on social media do not convert to valid electoral votes.****
****
It is time we all brushed our memory banks and realise that we have been down this road and past this kiosk many times before, unfortunately we have never stopped to have chai na bandika.****
****
Regards****
****
PS. I am sure Dr. Siganga was consulted especially since Victor is a member of the society.****
****
"As I cry in the wilderness I pray to be heard" - An Village Madman in exile****
****
****
Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya****
****
Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696****
**** ------------------------------
*From:* Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> *To:* robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Tuesday, 17 September 2013, 11:55 *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication****
Listers,
I assume that the CS and other powers that be are reading these comments. I wish to urge them, for the sake of this industry which we all know is key to the development of this nation, to do what is right. The ICT Authority requires goodwill of industry players and the best of the best to propel this industry to great heights. This means having an open process of selection where the most suitable candidate will emerge amongst others. Some of those names being touted are indeed very capable but the CS would be doing them injustice if he simply handpicked anyone. Let he/she who is worthy of the job stand up and present himself/herself in a transparent competitive process. I believe a full enlightened board consisting of knowledgable and dedicated persons (not simply well connected ones please) should be in place before the CEO is picked. And if it is a different panel interviewing, it really must consist of persons well versed. We must break away from past practices where a CEO of a parastatal has no respect nor time for the board he/she reports to simply because of owing allegiance to an individual who appointed him/her. This is what ails organizations and in the end you find poor performance and a decline or collapse of an entire sector simply due to in-fighting and insubordination. I am keenly watching how this will transpire. I would like to believe the new government is serious about developing this industry and will therefore do the right thing.
Regards,
Gilda Odera
-----Original Message----- From: kictanet [mailto:kictanet-bounces+godera=skyweb.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of Edwin Onchari Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 6:09 PM To: godera@skyweb.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
+ 1
Edwin
-----Original Message----- From: kictanet [mailto:kictanet-bounces+eonchari=lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of kictanet-request@lists.kictanet.or.ke Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 4:06 PM To: Edwin Subject: kictanet Digest, Vol 76, Issue 27
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership (Brian Munyao Longwe)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1 Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 16:03:10 +0300 From: Brian Munyao Longwe <blongwe@gmail.com> To: Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> Cc: "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>, "isoc@orion.my.co.ke" <isoc@orion.my.co.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership Message-ID: <CAHSdPfbdD=XRe9qcoe73ikpyfAp8ZHj6vFtBZ7EVr6taPyjEbw@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Interesting to note that in this whole discussion no one seems to mention/consider that ICTA is an amalgamation of KICT Board, Department of e-Government and the Government Information Technology Services (GITS). If continuity is the focus, aren't the heads of any of the other agencies/departments also potential candidates?
Best regards,
Mblayo
On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 3:10 PM, Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> wrote:
Mr. Walubengo, in broad daylight you are advocating we do a kangaroo shortlisting, interview, and appointment. :)
Why would anybody want to participate in the process with the end result already known?
______________________ Mwendwa Kivuva twitter.com/lordmwesh google ID | Skype ID: lordmwesh
On 6 September 2013 09:12, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
------------------------------ **Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote,
@John, that's just it...it's not illegal..it may be challenged in court but it seems that the executive is acting within the confines of the law. ~~~~~~~ The unilateral appointment would indeed be "legal" as it is enshrined in the Legal notice. However, the clever lawyers would not be challenging the appointment (since it would be legal), but they would be challenging whether it is constitutional to "legalize" such an action of appointing without inviting other Kenyans to apply...(discrimination)
Remember that the constitution is the supreme law and any other law(Act, Legal Notice, Regulation, etc) that is contradictory to it is null and void. Am not a lawyer but I think that is where the court battle would be about. In the likely event that the courts find that the legal notice is in violation of the constitution, then by extension the appointment becomes null and void.
Problem is that this would take time and meanwhile whoever is appointed is likely to have his/her hands tied up and cannot transact ICT Authority business. Thats why I said, why bother with the risks? Just advertise the job, go through the motions and safely arrive at the same destination.
We did this successfully for our Cabinet Sec and PS, I still dont understand why it should become difficult for a CEO :-)
walu. ------------------------------ *From:* Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke>
*To:* jwalu@yahoo.com *Cc:* "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Friday, September 6, 2013 6:27 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership
@Kivuva
You are quite right.
@Walu, I believe the correct phrase is '*The end justifies the means'. :) *
@John, that's just it...it's not illegal..it may be challenged in court but it seems that the executive is acting within the confines of the law.
Ali Hussein CEO | 3mice interactive media Ltd Principal | Telemedia Africa Ltd
+254 713 601113/ 0770 906375
"The future belongs to him who knows how to wait." - Russian Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 5, 2013, at 10:49 PM, Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> wrote:
Because we know who is being targeted for this position, and we know his attributes and leadership qualities, and we acknowledge this is just a onetime appointment, why don't we discuss the merits and de-merits of Dr. Victor Kyalo?
I feel there is something members want to say but are being held back by diplomacy.
Lets remember as it has been stated here previously, anybody holding this public office will still have to pass the test of LEADERSHIP and INTEGRITY as envisioned in the constitution
On 05/09/2013, Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote:
Listers
Sometimes expediency requires that there is continuity and institutional
memory carry over to allow for a smooth transition.
In this particular case the Ag.CEO provides an excellent reason for this. He
has the expertise, experience, qualifications and the political savvy ness
to navigate this new monster called the ICTA.
The CS may need to look at constituting a new board though.
I say let the new team move with expediency and judge it by the results.
Regards
Ali Hussein
CEO | 3mice interactive media Ltd
Principal | Telemedia Africa Ltd
+254 713 601113/ 0770 906375
"The future belongs to him who knows how to wait." - Russian Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 5, 2013, at 2:34 PM, "Judy M. Muli" <judym.muli@gmail.com> wrote:
Listers,
What happened to the hookup, to discuss some of these issues and forge a
united front.
Judy
On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 1:40 PM, Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Thanks Walu.
Great analysis. You are right about the need to avoid unnecessary
litigation (read unnecessary negative publicity). Cofek already posted
the article on its site and you never know if it is considering following
up on the matter.
http://www.cofek.co.ke/index.php/14-news/253-tired-talk-of-presidenti al-executive-orders-and-unacceptable-plain-illegality-of-single-sourc ed-ict-authority-boss
.
I agree with you on the need to advertise this job and still get the
"right man/woman" for it. The CS should not allow the matter to be
determined by the courts.
May I suggest that you consider this topic for your Nation Blog next
week? This 2010 Constitution. Argh!
Rgds
GG
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 03:12:47 -0700
From: jwalu@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
To: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
@GG
I see the comparison - and specifically the fact that the previous CEO of
the ICT Board was expected to be unilaterally selected by the Minister.
However, that was then(2006/7). Fast-forward to today (2013) - with the
notable development of the new constitution (2010).
This thing (Constitution 2010) changed so much - even the President today
cannot do stuff his predecessors used to do over a game of golf/beer/etc.
And so it would be the case for the Kenya ICT Authority - one cannot just
borrow a previous clause and paste it into a new, bigger and different
institution. ICT Authority (2013) is miles apart from ICT board (2007)
in form, nature, scope and mandate.
For example, ICT Board(2007) was an institution with an
"administratively" limited ministerial scope -that is why other
Ministries could afford to ignore them. Today the ICT Authority is an
animal with sweeping powers that cut across Ministries and govt agencies.
The CEO appointment therefore requires and is indeed given a more
rigorous approach in the legal notice.
What raised the storm is why the need to exempt the 1st CEO from this
rigorous approach? My unsolicited advise would be for the CS to ignore
the clause, advertise the job (open it up for everyone) - and still get
(his?) the right man/woman for the job. After all, he has or can create
the required "magnanimity" (opposite of Tyranny :-) of the numbers in
the Board.
The other route is vulnerable to too much and unnecessary litigation that
may cripple the ICT Authority for years before it gets started. E.g
Someone can file a suit to determine whether the contentious clause goes
against the constitutional provision for non-discrimination. While the
suit is being determined ICT Authority will remain crippled/handicapped
for years.
walu.
From: Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
To: jwalu@yahoo.com
Cc: "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Wednesday, September 4, 2013 2:41 PM
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
@ Walu,
For comparison purposes, see legal notice legal Notice 26 of 2007
http://www.kenyalaw.org/klr/index.php?id=568 (STATE CORPORATION KENYA
INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY BOARD 2007)
From: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
Subject: RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 09:13:46 +0000
Thanks Loise for sharing the legal notice.
@ Yawe you are right. That is the nature of the notice. You do not need
to be subjected to public scrutiny:) (On a light note, it is a pity since
I would be interested to know your inside manenos).
@ Brian, Walu, and Alice
I have just skimmed through the notice and in matters of the ICT
Authority appointments (both board and first CEO) it actually gives the
CS carte blanche. There may not be a row after all! Maybe some mischief
at the drafting process of the notice which ensured that it ignored
article 10 of the constitution which lays emphasis on consulting in
policy making processes. @ Kapiyo, @ Grace Bomu, what are your comments?
Rgds
GG
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 09:58:31 +0100
From: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
To: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
Hi,
There goes my opportunity to be appointed without having to jump through
hoops that require me to answer questions from my questionable past.
Regards
Robert Yawe
KAY System Technologies Ltd
Phoenix House, 6th Floor
P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200
Kenya
Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696
From: Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Monday, 2 September 2013, 15:02
Subject: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
A row is simmering in the Ministry of Information, Communication and
Technology over a law that gives the Cabinet secretary power to make
unilateral appointment.
Executive Order No. 2 of 2013 by President Uhuru Kenyatta on the
reorganisation of government that establishes the Information and
Communications Technology Authority ( ICTA) gives the ICT Cabinet
Secretary power to appoint the CEO of the authority without involving the
board.
http://www.standardmedia.co.ke/?articleID=2000092541&story_title=row- simmers-over-order-on-new-icta-leadership
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development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
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-- *Regards,*
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
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Hi, If the CS and his officials do not follow the letter and spirit of the law how exactly will KICTANET which is not a registered entity file a suite or shall we depend on CSK which is a registered entity to do the bidding for us busy twits? Regards On a lighter note: 'The infinite monkey theorem states that a monkey hitting keys at random on a typewriter keyboard for an infinite amount of time will almost surely type a given text, such as the complete works of William Shakespeare. Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696 ________________________________ From: Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com> To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Thursday, 19 September 2013, 13:03 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication Listers, As we proceed with this discussion allow me to remind us all of the provisions of Article 10 of the Constitution of Kenya, 2010, which provides as thus: 10. (1) The national values and principles of governance in this Article bind all State organs, State officers, public officers and all persons whenever any of them– (a) applies or interprets this Constitution; (b) enacts, applies or interprets any law; or (c) makes or implements public policy decisions. (2) The national values and principles of governance include– (a) patriotism, national unity, sharing and devolution of power, the rule of law, democracy and participation of the people; (b) human dignity, equity, social justice, inclusiveness, equality, human rights, non-discrimination and protection of the marginalised; (c) good governance, integrity, transparency and accountability; and (d) sustainable development. These principles are non-negotiable. Therefore, it is important that consultations are done bearing in mind the principles espoused above. Hence, and i dare say, regardless of whether KICTANET is a registered or not, it still is a critical network of stakeholders that must be consulted on matters touching on ICT industry, just like all the other non-state actors. I believe the CS (and his officers) are aware of these provisions and will ultimately do the right thing. Failure to which, he shall be in clear violation of the Katiba, consequences of which, we are all too well aware of. Regards, Victor On 18 Sep 2013 21:24, "Ali Hussein" <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote: Waithaka
My point exactly. A mix of both sometimes works wonders..
Ali Hussein
+254 0770 906375 / 0713 601113
"Kujikwaa si kuanguka, bali ni kwenda mbele" (To stumble is not to fall but a sign of going forward) - Swahili Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 18, 2013, at 9:07 PM, Ngigi Waithaka <ngigi@at.co.ke> wrote:
Hussein,
There is usually a corner reserved for soft-power and persuasion; where the person on the receiving end either makes an honest mistake or simply doesn't know or have the capability to understand how to achieve a certain task.
Soft-power usually loses its 'power' where the other person is making a conscious decision, knowing very well the conscious decision is wrong and there is no big stick if they continue anyway e.g corruption
So fighting corruption with soft-power, as an example is largely doomed to fail as we have been doing.
As regards the organisations, just setting them by themselves is not enough. Indeed we do have many serious organizations already, but they rely too much on soft power.
If you look at similar industries, such as Banking, they don't shy away from taking GoK, KRA etc to court, if they feel that certain practices are infringing on the rights of their members, such as these http://www.newtimes.co.rw/news/views/article_print.php?15293&a=64747&icon=Print
We should use soft-power knowing very well that we do have a fall back position of taking the powers that be straight on if need be.\\
Waithaka Ngigi A1.iO
On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 7:31 PM, Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote:
Robert and all
I disagree. Sometimes it takes the 'soft' power of such informal groupings to make changes. Yes, we do require from a legal stand point registered Organizations make representation. However I contend that there is space for both.
KICTANET has had some very loud successes in influencing policy and sometimes concrete action for positive change. Cases in point:-
1. The issue of KeNIC and the uncertainty it faces were first 'aired' here. The jury (or is it the Supreme Court?) is still out on how this will play out. There is an AGM tomorrow by the way...
2. The issue of Kenya's position in WCIT12 Dubai was extensively debated here and 'forced' the powers that be to take into consideration other stakeholders position besides that of the CCK.
3. One Robert Yawe's throwing his towel into the ring for Post Master General's position at Posta. Although unsuccessful :) made a major point on what ails Posta.
The list goes on..
Ali Hussein
+254 0770 906375 / 0713 601113
"Kujikwaa si kuanguka, bali ni kwenda mbele" (To stumble is not to fall but a sign of going forward) - Swahili Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 18, 2013, at 5:39 PM, "Gilda Odera" <godera@skyweb.co.ke> wrote:
Over to the lurkers – you have heard Robert. Be the change you
From:robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk] Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2013 5:13 PM To: Gilda Odera Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication @Gilda,
Just to reiterate what I said about a certain Presidential candidate, for democracy to be effective we must register as voters and then actually go out and vote.
Sitting at home with a valid voters card cannot then be justification to have your opinion heard.
Regards Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696
________________________________
From:Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> To: 'robert yawe' <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Wednesday, 18 September 2013, 16:59 Subject: RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication @Robert- Trust you to speak
From:robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk] Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2013 3:04 PM To: Gilda Odera Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication @Gilda,
In english, KICTANET has no moral or legal standing to require it be consulted unlike CSK and KIF.
Regards Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696
________________________________
From:Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> To: 'robert yawe' <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Wednesday, 18 September 2013, 9:34 Subject: RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication @Robert- meaning? Please talk ‘transparently’ so we all understand what you are trying to say. Are you saying it is costly for the CS to engage CSK? He sent an email saying he is noting all comments on this list so let us give him credit for that. Or am I not understanding what you are saying here below? Gilda From:robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk] Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2013 8:22 AM To: Gilda Odera Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication @Gilda,
The CS has consulted the industry players who are members of an organised and duly constituted organisation, it goes by the name of CSK or in short Computer Society of Kenya. As one Presidential Candidate found in a very costly manner that the number of friends you have on social media do not convert to valid electoral votes. It is time we all brushed our memory banks and realise that we have been down this road and past this kiosk many times before, unfortunately we have never stopped to have chai na bandika. Regards PS. I am sure Dr. Siganga was consulted especially since Victor is a member of the society. "As I cry in the wilderness I pray to be heard" - An Village Madman in exile Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696
________________________________
From:Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk Cc: 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Sent: Tuesday, 17 September 2013, 11:55 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
Listers,
I assume that the CS and other powers that be are reading these comments. I wish to urge them, for the sake of this industry which we all know is key to the development of this nation, to do what is right. The ICT Authority requires goodwill of industry players and the best of the best to propel this industry to great heights. This means having an open process of selection where the most suitable candidate will emerge amongst others. Some of those names being touted are indeed very capable but the CS would be doing them injustice if he simply handpicked anyone. Let he/she who is worthy of the job stand up and present himself/herself in a transparent competitive process. I believe a full enlightened board consisting of knowledgable and dedicated persons (not simply well connected ones please) should be in place before the CEO is picked. And if it is a different panel interviewing, it really must consist of persons well versed. We must break away from past practices where a CEO of a parastatal has no respect nor time for the board he/she reports to simply because of owing allegiance to an individual who appointed him/her. This is what ails organizations and in the end you find poor performance and a decline or collapse of an entire sector simply due to in-fighting and insubordination. I am keenly watching how this will transpire. I would like to believe the new government is serious about developing this industry and will therefore do the right thing.
Regards,
Gilda Odera
-----Original Message----- From: kictanet [mailto:kictanet-bounces+godera=skyweb.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of Edwin Onchari Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 6:09 PM To: godera@skyweb.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
+ 1
Edwin
-----Original Message----- From: kictanet [mailto:kictanet-bounces+eonchari=lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of kictanet-request@lists.kictanet.or.ke Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 4:06 PM To: Edwin Subject: kictanet Digest, Vol 76, Issue 27
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership (Brian Munyao Longwe)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1 Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 16:03:10 +0300 From: Brian Munyao Longwe <blongwe@gmail.com> To: Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> Cc: "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>, "isoc@orion.my.co.ke" <isoc@orion.my.co.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership Message-ID: <CAHSdPfbdD=XRe9qcoe73ikpyfAp8ZHj6vFtBZ7EVr6taPyjEbw@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Interesting to note that in this whole discussion no one seems to mention/consider that ICTA is an amalgamation of KICT Board, Department of e-Government and the Government Information Technology Services (GITS). If continuity is the focus, aren't the heads of any of the other agencies/departments also potential candidates?
Best regards,
Mblayo
On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 3:10 PM, Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> wrote:
Mr. Walubengo, in broad daylight you are advocating we do a kangaroo shortlisting, interview, and appointment. :)
Why would anybody want to participate in the process with the end result already known?
______________________ Mwendwa Kivuva twitter.com/lordmwesh google ID | Skype ID: lordmwesh
On 6 September 2013 09:12, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
------------------------------ **Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote,
@John, that's just it...it's not illegal..it may be challenged in court but it seems that the executive is acting within the confines of the law. ~~~~~~~ The unilateral appointment would indeed be "legal" as it is enshrined in the Legal notice. However, the clever lawyers would not be challenging the appointment (since it would be legal), but they would be challenging whether it is constitutional to "legalize" such an action of appointing without inviting other Kenyans to apply...(discrimination)
Remember that the constitution is the supreme law and any other law(Act, Legal Notice, Regulation, etc) that is contradictory to it is null and void. Am not a lawyer but I think that is where the court battle would be about. In the likely event that the courts find that the legal notice is in violation of the constitution, then by extension the appointment becomes null and void.
Problem is that this would take time and meanwhile whoever is appointed is likely to have his/her hands tied up and cannot transact ICT Authority business. Thats why I said, why bother with the risks? Just advertise the job, go through the motions and safely arrive at
We did this successfully for our Cabinet Sec and PS, I still dont understand why it should become difficult for a CEO :-)
walu. ------------------------------ *From:* Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke>
*To:* jwalu@yahoo.com *Cc:* "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Friday, September 6, 2013 6:27 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership
@Kivuva
You are quite right.
@Walu, I believe the correct phrase is '*The end justifies the means'. :) *
@John, that's just it...it's not illegal..it may be challenged in court but it seems that the executive is acting within the confines of
same destination. the law.
Ali Hussein CEO | 3mice interactive media Ltd Principal | Telemedia Africa Ltd
+254 713 601113/ 0770 906375
"The future belongs to him who knows how to wait." -
Russian Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 5, 2013, at 10:49 PM, Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com>
wrote:
Because we know who is being targeted for this position, and we know his attributes and leadership qualities, and we acknowledge this is just a onetime appointment, why don't we discuss the merits and de-merits of Dr. Victor Kyalo?
I feel there is something members want to say but are being held back by diplomacy.
Lets remember as it has been stated here previously, anybody holding this public office will still have to pass the test of LEADERSHIP and INTEGRITY as envisioned in the constitution
On 05/09/2013, Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote:
Listers
Sometimes expediency requires that there is continuity and institutional
memory carry over to allow for a smooth transition.
In this particular case the Ag.CEO provides an excellent reason for
He
has the expertise, experience, qualifications and the political savvy ness
to navigate this new monster called the ICTA.
The CS may need to look at constituting a new board though.
I say let the new team move with expediency and judge it by the results.
Regards
Ali Hussein
CEO | 3mice interactive media Ltd
Principal | Telemedia Africa Ltd
+254 713 601113/ 0770 906375
"The future belongs to him who knows how to wait." - Russian Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 5, 2013, at 2:34 PM, "Judy M. Muli" <judym.muli@gmail.com> wrote:
Listers,
What happened to the hookup, to discuss some of these issues and forge a
united front.
Judy
On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 1:40 PM, Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Thanks Walu.
Great analysis. You are right about the need to avoid unnecessary
litigation (read unnecessary negative publicity). Cofek already posted
the article on its site and you never know if it is considering following
up on the matter.
http://www.cofek.co.ke/index.php/14-news/253-tired-talk-of-presidenti al-executive-orders-and-unacceptable-plain-illegality-of-single-sourc ed-ict-authority-boss
.
I agree with you on the need to advertise this job and still get the
"right man/woman" for it. The CS should not allow the matter to be
determined by the courts.
May I suggest that you consider this topic for your Nation Blog next
week? This 2010 Constitution. Argh!
Rgds
GG
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 03:12:47 -0700
From: jwalu@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
To: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
@GG
I see the comparison - and specifically the fact that the previous CEO of
the ICT Board was expected to be unilaterally selected by the Minister.
However, that was then(2006/7). Fast-forward to today (2013) - with the
notable development of the new constitution (2010).
This thing (Constitution 2010) changed so much - even the President today
cannot do stuff his predecessors used to do over a game of golf/beer/etc.
And so it would be the case for the Kenya ICT Authority - one cannot just
borrow a previous clause and paste it into a new, bigger and different
institution. ICT Authority (2013) is miles apart from ICT board (2007)
in form, nature, scope and mandate.
For example, ICT Board(2007) was an institution with an
"administratively" limited ministerial scope -that is why other
Ministries could afford to ignore them. Today the ICT Authority is an
animal with sweeping powers that cut across Ministries and govt agencies.
The CEO appointment therefore requires and is indeed given a more
rigorous approach in the legal notice.
What raised the storm is why the need to exempt the 1st CEO from this
rigorous approach? My unsolicited advise would be for the CS to ignore
the clause, advertise the job (open it up for everyone) - and still get
(his?) the right man/woman for the job. After all, he has or can create
the required "magnanimity" (opposite of Tyranny :-) of
want. the Queen’s English Jand thank you for being candid as usual. Now that I get your comment, I partially agree. Yes, the formidable bodies should be consulted or be heard but let us hear comments/advise/opinions from all quarters. Democracy is necessary here Robert. After all, we are communicating on KICTANET as it is right now so it must have some standing J. the this. the numbers
in
the Board.
The other route is vulnerable to too much and unnecessary litigation that
may cripple the ICT Authority for years before it gets started. E.g
Someone can file a suit to determine whether the contentious clause goes
against the constitutional provision for non-discrimination. While the
suit is being determined ICT Authority will remain crippled/handicapped
for years.
walu.
From: Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
To: jwalu@yahoo.com
Cc: "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Wednesday, September 4, 2013 2:41 PM
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
@ Walu,
For comparison purposes, see legal notice legal Notice 26 of 2007
http://www.kenyalaw.org/klr/index.php?id=568 (STATE CORPORATION KENYA
INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY BOARD 2007)
From: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
Subject: RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 09:13:46 +0000
Thanks Loise for sharing the legal notice.
@ Yawe you are right. That is the nature of the notice. You do not need
to be subjected to public scrutiny:) (On a light note, it is a pity since
I would be interested to know your inside manenos).
@ Brian, Walu, and Alice
I have just skimmed through the notice and in matters of the ICT
Authority appointments (both board and first CEO) it actually gives the
CS carte blanche. There may not be a row after all! Maybe some mischief
at the drafting process of the notice which ensured that it ignored
article 10 of the constitution which lays emphasis on consulting in
policy making processes. @ Kapiyo, @ Grace Bomu, what are your comments?
Rgds
GG
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 09:58:31 +0100
From: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
To: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
Hi,
There goes my opportunity to be appointed without having to jump through
hoops that require me to answer questions from my questionable past.
Regards
Robert Yawe
KAY System Technologies Ltd
Phoenix House, 6th Floor
P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200
Kenya
Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696
From: Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Monday, 2 September 2013, 15:02
Subject: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
A row is simmering in the Ministry of Information, Communication and
Technology over a law that gives the Cabinet secretary power to make
unilateral appointment.
Executive Order No. 2 of 2013 by President Uhuru Kenyatta on the
reorganisation of government that establishes the Information and
Communications Technology Authority ( ICTA) gives the ICT Cabinet
Secretary power to appoint the CEO of the authority without involving the
board.
http://www.standardmedia.co.ke/?articleID=2000092541&story_title=row- simmers-over-order-on-new-icta-leadership
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--
Regards,
Waithaka Ngigi Chief Executive Officer | Alliance Technologies | MCK Nairobi Synod Building T + 254 (0) 20 2333 471 |Office Mobile: +254 786 28 28 28 | M + 254 737 811 000
www.at.co.ke
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
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_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/robertyawe%40yahoo.co.... The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Any Kenyan of goodwill can file a lawsuit, the only challenge is the Finances for paying Kapiyo and Bomu Advocates. The advantage organised groupings like COFEK have is sponsorship, and paying members. Does KICTANET have the muscle to drag anybody to court? ______________________ Mwendwa Kivuva twitter.com/lordmwesh google ID | Skype ID: lordmwesh On 19 September 2013 17:15, robert yawe <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi,
If the CS and his officials do not follow the letter and spirit of the law how exactly will KICTANET which is not a registered entity file a suite or shall we depend on CSK which is a registered entity to do the bidding for us busy twits?
Regards
On a lighter note:
'The infinite monkey theorem states that a monkey hitting keys at random on a typewriter keyboard for an infinite amount of time will almost surely type a given text, such as the complete works of William Shakespeare.
Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya
Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696
------------------------------ *From:* Victor Kapiyo <vkapiyo@gmail.com>
*To:* robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk *Cc:* KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Thursday, 19 September 2013, 13:03
*Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
Listers, As we proceed with this discussion allow me to remind us all of the provisions of Article 10 of the Constitution of Kenya, 2010, which provides as thus: 10. (1) The national values and principles of governance in this Article bind all State organs, State officers, public officers and all persons whenever any of them– (a) applies or interprets this Constitution; (b) enacts, applies or interprets any law; or (c) makes or implements public policy decisions. (2) The national values and principles of governance include– (a) patriotism, national unity, sharing and devolution of power, the rule of law, democracy and participation of the people; (b) human dignity, equity, social justice, inclusiveness, equality, human rights, non-discrimination and protection of the marginalised; (c) good governance, integrity, transparency and accountability; and (d) sustainable development. These principles are non-negotiable. Therefore, it is important that consultations are done bearing in mind the principles espoused above. Hence, and i dare say, regardless of whether KICTANET is a registered or not, it still is a critical network of stakeholders that must be consulted on matters touching on ICT industry, just like all the other non-state actors. I believe the CS (and his officers) are aware of these provisions and will ultimately do the right thing. Failure to which, he shall be in clear violation of the Katiba, consequences of which, we are all too well aware of. Regards, Victor On 18 Sep 2013 21:24, "Ali Hussein" <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote:
Waithaka
My point exactly. A mix of both sometimes works wonders..
Ali Hussein
+254 0770 906375 / 0713 601113
"Kujikwaa si kuanguka, bali ni kwenda mbele" (To stumble is not to fall but a sign of going forward) - Swahili Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 18, 2013, at 9:07 PM, Ngigi Waithaka <ngigi@at.co.ke> wrote:
Hussein,
There is usually a corner reserved for soft-power and persuasion; where the person on the receiving end either makes an honest mistake or simply doesn't know or have the capability to understand how to achieve a certain task.
Soft-power usually loses its 'power' where the other person is making a conscious decision, knowing very well the conscious decision is wrong and there is no big stick if they continue anyway e.g corruption
So fighting corruption with soft-power, as an example is largely doomed to fail as we have been doing.
As regards the organisations, just setting them by themselves is not enough. Indeed we do have many serious organizations already, but they rely too much on soft power.
If you look at similar industries, such as Banking, they don't shy away from taking GoK, KRA etc to court, if they feel that certain practices are infringing on the rights of their members, such as these http://www.newtimes.co.rw/news/views/article_print.php?15293&a=64747&icon=Print
We should use soft-power knowing very well that we do have a fall back position of taking the powers that be straight on if need be.\\
Waithaka Ngigi A1.iO
On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 7:31 PM, Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote:
Robert and all
I disagree. Sometimes it takes the 'soft' power of such informal groupings to make changes. Yes, we do require from a legal stand point registered Organizations make representation. However I contend that there is space for both.
KICTANET has had some very loud successes in influencing policy and sometimes concrete action for positive change. Cases in point:-
1. The issue of KeNIC and the uncertainty it faces were first 'aired' here. The jury (or is it the Supreme Court?) is still out on how this will play out. There is an AGM tomorrow by the way...
2. The issue of Kenya's position in WCIT12 Dubai was extensively debated here and 'forced' the powers that be to take into consideration other stakeholders position besides that of the CCK.
3. One Robert Yawe's throwing his towel into the ring for Post Master General's position at Posta. Although unsuccessful :) made a major point on what ails Posta.
The list goes on..
Ali Hussein
+254 0770 906375 / 0713 601113
"Kujikwaa si kuanguka, bali ni kwenda mbele" (To stumble is not to fall but a sign of going forward) - Swahili Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 18, 2013, at 5:39 PM, "Gilda Odera" <godera@skyweb.co.ke> wrote:
Over to the lurkers – you have heard Robert. Be the change you want.**** ** ** *From:* robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk<robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk>]
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 18, 2013 5:13 PM *To:* Gilda Odera *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication**** ** ** @Gilda,
Just to reiterate what I said about a certain Presidential candidate, for democracy to be effective we must register as voters and then actually go out and vote.
Sitting at home with a valid voters card cannot then be justification to have your opinion heard.
Regards**** **** Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya**** ** ** Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696**** ** ** ------------------------------ *From:* Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> *To:* 'robert yawe' <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Wednesday, 18 September 2013, 16:59 *Subject:* RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication**** ** ** @Robert- Trust you to speak the Queen’s English J and thank you for being candid as usual. Now that I get your comment, I partially agree. Yes, the formidable bodies should be consulted or be heard but let us hear comments/advise/opinions from all quarters. Democracy is necessary here Robert. After all, we are communicating on KICTANET as it is right now so it must have some standing J. **** **** *From:* robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk<robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk>]
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 18, 2013 3:04 PM *To:* Gilda Odera *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication**** **** @Gilda,
In english, KICTANET has no moral or legal standing to require it be consulted unlike CSK and KIF.
Regards**** **** Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya**** **** Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696**** **** ------------------------------ *From:* Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> *To:* 'robert yawe' <robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk> *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Wednesday, 18 September 2013, 9:34 *Subject:* RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication**** **** @Robert- meaning? Please talk ‘transparently’ so we all understand what you are trying to say. Are you saying it is costly for the CS to engage CSK? He sent an email saying he is noting all comments on this list so let us give him credit for that. Or am I not understanding what you are saying here below? **** **** Gilda **** **** *From:* robert yawe [mailto:robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk<robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk>]
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 18, 2013 8:22 AM *To:* Gilda Odera *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication**** **** @Gilda,
The CS has consulted the industry players who are members of an organised and duly constituted organisation, it goes by the name of CSK or in short Computer Society of Kenya.**** **** As one Presidential Candidate found in a very costly manner that the number of friends you have on social media do not convert to valid electoral votes.**** **** It is time we all brushed our memory banks and realise that we have been down this road and past this kiosk many times before, unfortunately we have never stopped to have chai na bandika.**** **** Regards**** **** PS. I am sure Dr. Siganga was consulted especially since Victor is a member of the society.**** **** "As I cry in the wilderness I pray to be heard" - An Village Madman in exile**** **** **** Robert Yawe KAY System Technologies Ltd Phoenix House, 6th Floor P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200 Kenya**** **** Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696**** **** ------------------------------ *From:* Gilda Odera <godera@skyweb.co.ke> *To:* robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk *Cc:* 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Tuesday, 17 September 2013, 11:55 *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication****
Listers,
I assume that the CS and other powers that be are reading these comments. I wish to urge them, for the sake of this industry which we all know is key to the development of this nation, to do what is right. The ICT Authority requires goodwill of industry players and the best of the best to propel this industry to great heights. This means having an open process of selection where the most suitable candidate will emerge amongst others. Some of those names being touted are indeed very capable but the CS would be doing them injustice if he simply handpicked anyone. Let he/she who is worthy of the job stand up and present himself/herself in a transparent competitive process. I believe a full enlightened board consisting of knowledgable and dedicated persons (not simply well connected ones please) should be in place before the CEO is picked. And if it is a different panel interviewing, it really must consist of persons well versed. We must break away from past practices where a CEO of a parastatal has no respect nor time for the board he/she reports to simply because of owing allegiance to an individual who appointed him/her. This is what ails organizations and in the end you find poor performance and a decline or collapse of an entire sector simply due to in-fighting and insubordination. I am keenly watching how this will transpire. I would like to believe the new government is serious about developing this industry and will therefore do the right thing.
Regards,
Gilda Odera
-----Original Message----- From: kictanet [mailto:kictanet-bounces+godera=skyweb.co.ke@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of Edwin Onchari Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 6:09 PM To: godera@skyweb.co.ke Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication
+ 1
Edwin
-----Original Message----- From: kictanet [mailto:kictanet-bounces+eonchari=lynxbits.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of kictanet-request@lists.kictanet.or.ke Sent: Friday, September 06, 2013 4:06 PM To: Edwin Subject: kictanet Digest, Vol 76, Issue 27
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership (Brian Munyao Longwe)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1 Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 16:03:10 +0300 From: Brian Munyao Longwe <blongwe@gmail.com> To: Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> Cc: "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>, "isoc@orion.my.co.ke" <isoc@orion.my.co.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership Message-ID: <CAHSdPfbdD=XRe9qcoe73ikpyfAp8ZHj6vFtBZ7EVr6taPyjEbw@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Interesting to note that in this whole discussion no one seems to mention/consider that ICTA is an amalgamation of KICT Board, Department of e-Government and the Government Information Technology Services (GITS). If continuity is the focus, aren't the heads of any of the other agencies/departments also potential candidates?
Best regards,
Mblayo
On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 3:10 PM, Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> wrote:
Mr. Walubengo, in broad daylight you are advocating we do a kangaroo shortlisting, interview, and appointment. :)
Why would anybody want to participate in the process with the end result already known?
______________________ Mwendwa Kivuva twitter.com/lordmwesh google ID | Skype ID: lordmwesh
On 6 September 2013 09:12, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
------------------------------ **Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote,
@John, that's just it...it's not illegal..it may be challenged in court but it seems that the executive is acting within the confines of the law. ~~~~~~~ The unilateral appointment would indeed be "legal" as it is enshrined in the Legal notice. However, the clever lawyers would not be challenging the appointment (since it would be legal), but they would be challenging whether it is constitutional to "legalize" such an action of appointing without inviting other Kenyans to apply...(discrimination)
Remember that the constitution is the supreme law and any other law(Act, Legal Notice, Regulation, etc) that is contradictory to it is null and void. Am not a lawyer but I think that is where the court battle would be about. In the likely event that the courts find that the legal notice is in violation of the constitution, then by extension the appointment becomes null and void.
Problem is that this would take time and meanwhile whoever is appointed is likely to have his/her hands tied up and cannot transact ICT Authority business. Thats why I said, why bother with the risks? Just advertise the job, go through the motions and safely arrive at the same destination.
We did this successfully for our Cabinet Sec and PS, I still dont understand why it should become difficult for a CEO :-)
walu. ------------------------------ *From:* Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke>
*To:* jwalu@yahoo.com *Cc:* "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *Sent:* Friday, September 6, 2013 6:27 AM
*Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information, Communication and Technology leadership
@Kivuva
You are quite right.
@Walu, I believe the correct phrase is '*The end justifies the means'. :) *
@John, that's just it...it's not illegal..it may be challenged in court but it seems that the executive is acting within the confines of the law.
Ali Hussein CEO | 3mice interactive media Ltd Principal | Telemedia Africa Ltd
+254 713 601113/ 0770 906375
"The future belongs to him who knows how to wait." - Russian Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 5, 2013, at 10:49 PM, Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> wrote:
Because we know who is being targeted for this position, and we know his attributes and leadership qualities, and we acknowledge this is just a onetime appointment, why don't we discuss the merits and de-merits of Dr. Victor Kyalo?
I feel there is something members want to say but are being held back by diplomacy.
Lets remember as it has been stated here previously, anybody holding this public office will still have to pass the test of LEADERSHIP and INTEGRITY as envisioned in the constitution
On 05/09/2013, Ali Hussein <ali@hussein.me.ke> wrote:
Listers
Sometimes expediency requires that there is continuity and institutional
memory carry over to allow for a smooth transition.
In this particular case the Ag.CEO provides an excellent reason for this. He
has the expertise, experience, qualifications and the political savvy ness
to navigate this new monster called the ICTA.
The CS may need to look at constituting a new board though.
I say let the new team move with expediency and judge it by the results.
Regards
Ali Hussein
CEO | 3mice interactive media Ltd
Principal | Telemedia Africa Ltd
+254 713 601113/ 0770 906375
"The future belongs to him who knows how to wait." - Russian Proverb
Sent from my iPad
On Sep 5, 2013, at 2:34 PM, "Judy M. Muli" <judym.muli@gmail.com> wrote:
Listers,
What happened to the hookup, to discuss some of these issues and forge a
united front.
Judy
On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 1:40 PM, Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Thanks Walu.
Great analysis. You are right about the need to avoid unnecessary
litigation (read unnecessary negative publicity). Cofek already posted
the article on its site and you never know if it is considering following
up on the matter.
http://www.cofek.co.ke/index.php/14-news/253-tired-talk-of-presidenti al-executive-orders-and-unacceptable-plain-illegality-of-single-sourc ed-ict-authority-boss
.
I agree with you on the need to advertise this job and still get the
"right man/woman" for it. The CS should not allow the matter to be
determined by the courts.
May I suggest that you consider this topic for your Nation Blog next
week? This 2010 Constitution. Argh!
Rgds
GG
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 03:12:47 -0700
From: jwalu@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
To: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
@GG
I see the comparison - and specifically the fact that the previous CEO of
the ICT Board was expected to be unilaterally selected by the Minister.
However, that was then(2006/7). Fast-forward to today (2013) - with the
notable development of the new constitution (2010).
This thing (Constitution 2010) changed so much - even the President today
cannot do stuff his predecessors used to do over a game of golf/beer/etc.
And so it would be the case for the Kenya ICT Authority - one cannot just
borrow a previous clause and paste it into a new, bigger and different
institution. ICT Authority (2013) is miles apart from ICT board (2007)
in form, nature, scope and mandate.
For example, ICT Board(2007) was an institution with an
"administratively" limited ministerial scope -that is why other
Ministries could afford to ignore them. Today the ICT Authority is an
animal with sweeping powers that cut across Ministries and govt agencies.
The CEO appointment therefore requires and is indeed given a more
rigorous approach in the legal notice.
What raised the storm is why the need to exempt the 1st CEO from this
rigorous approach? My unsolicited advise would be for the CS to ignore
the clause, advertise the job (open it up for everyone) - and still get
(his?) the right man/woman for the job. After all, he has or can create
the required "magnanimity" (opposite of Tyranny :-) of the numbers in
the Board.
The other route is vulnerable to too much and unnecessary litigation that
may cripple the ICT Authority for years before it gets started. E.g
Someone can file a suit to determine whether the contentious clause goes
against the constitutional provision for non-discrimination. While the
suit is being determined ICT Authority will remain crippled/handicapped
for years.
walu.
From: Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
To: jwalu@yahoo.com
Cc: "kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Wednesday, September 4, 2013 2:41 PM
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
@ Walu,
For comparison purposes, see legal notice legal Notice 26 of 2007
http://www.kenyalaw.org/klr/index.php?id=568 (STATE CORPORATION KENYA
INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY BOARD 2007)
From: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
Subject: RE: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 09:13:46 +0000
Thanks Loise for sharing the legal notice.
@ Yawe you are right. That is the nature of the notice. You do not need
to be subjected to public scrutiny:) (On a light note, it is a pity since
I would be interested to know your inside manenos).
@ Brian, Walu, and Alice
I have just skimmed through the notice and in matters of the ICT
Authority appointments (both board and first CEO) it actually gives the
CS carte blanche. There may not be a row after all! Maybe some mischief
at the drafting process of the notice which ensured that it ignored
article 10 of the constitution which lays emphasis on consulting in
policy making processes. @ Kapiyo, @ Grace Bomu, what are your comments?
Rgds
GG
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 09:58:31 +0100
From: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
To: ggithaiga@hotmail.com
CC: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke
Hi,
There goes my opportunity to be appointed without having to jump through
hoops that require me to answer questions from my questionable past.
Regards
Robert Yawe
KAY System Technologies Ltd
Phoenix House, 6th Floor
P O Box 55806 Nairobi, 00200
Kenya
Tel: +254722511225, +254202010696
From: Grace Githaiga <ggithaiga@hotmail.com>
To: robertyawe@yahoo.co.uk
Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
Sent: Monday, 2 September 2013, 15:02
Subject: [kictanet] Row simmers over order on new Information,
Communication and Technology leadership
A row is simmering in the Ministry of Information, Communication and
Technology over a law that gives the Cabinet secretary power to make
unilateral appointment.
Executive Order No. 2 of 2013 by President Uhuru Kenyatta on the
reorganisation of government that establishes the Information and
Communications Technology Authority ( ICTA) gives the ICT Cabinet
Secretary power to appoint the CEO of the authority without involving the
board.
http://www.standardmedia.co.ke/?articleID=2000092541&story_title=row- simmers-over-order-on-new-icta-leadership
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors
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participants (4)
-
Ali Hussein -
Kivuva -
robert yawe -
Victor Kapiyo