I still don't get it. 1: why should we spend resources to attempt producing stuff we have zero chance of being competitive in? National pride? Lack of stuff we might be competitive in? 2: why should we focus on being a light manufacturing hub Daktari? Why not for instance be a net agricultural producer? (Climate, water, and lots of starving peeps in the neighbourhood). 3: suppose we force consumption of said "made in Kenya product" produced by the local manufacturer, why then favour just that. Why not force government to use Mobius? How then , or when do they become global competitive industries? I'm afraid I see no difference between this and Nyayo pioneer. I suspect our education system, and western leaning capitalism has made us incapable of appreciating anything local. That's where change needs to start from; investing in the fabric that ties us. Sent from my Samsung device -------- Original message -------- From: Lawrence Njogu via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Date: 27/08/2016 11:51 pm (GMT+03:00) To: arebacollins@gmail.com Cc: Lawrence Njogu <lnjogu@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop <!-- .hmmessage P { margin:0px; padding:0px } body.hmmessage { font-size: 12pt; font-family:Calibri } --> @Ndemo I totally agree with you !! We need to support our own Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 11:03:32 +0300 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop From: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke CC: bndemo@bitangendemo.me To: lnjogu@hotmail.com Walubengo,MOIC actually bought 100 Madaraka Desk Tops from JKUAT and Multimedia. They are still in use and we never had any complaints. That is why I advocate for a policy to buy locally made electronic products. We have an opportunity to compete with India that is priming itself as the global hub of light electronic producta through it moto Make in India. If you look at Konza's strategic documents, we were high on light electronic manufacturing. KAIST is looking to build that capacity and several mobile handset manufacturers are eyeing the same. We cannot be the ones pouring cold water on an opportunity like this. Ndemo. On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:53 AM, Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Waithaka.. NASA has some of the most sophisticated and quality assured software there is. And the NASA I know wont procure something that will compromise the quality standards they have. Just think about it. They send a space-craft to Pluto against 1000 parameters that they need to get right. The project costs billions of dollars. And they made it to pluto. Thats worth a clap. What is not worth a clap is getting desperate people to buy your technology. On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Waithaka Ngigi <ngigi@at.co.ke> wrote: Ahmed, This is way too simplistic... It's like the German Chancellor saying since they have VW, BMW & Mercedes there's no need for The German Government to buy and promote upcoming German products. Would NASA in the US consider buying a cheaper Super Computer from China, for example, because HP & Dell need to sort out their business models? Huawei, for reasons disguised as 'National Security' cannot sell a single product to the US Govt... Not when US has firms like CISCO & Juniper building similiar equipment. The thinking that there's no patriotism when purchasing products is only propagated at the developing world's so that they can open up their markets. Waithaka Ngigi Alliance Technologies www.at.co.ke From: Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanetSent: Saturday, August 27, 2016 10:01 AMTo: Ngigi WaithakaReply To: KICTAnet ICT Policy DiscussionsCc: Ahmed Mohamed MaawySubject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop Personal comments: A business model that forces success is not a successful business. Its a dictatorial business. Examples of famous products from Kenya that Kenyans use: M-PesaM-Kopa SolarMobius UshahidiBRCKBitPesaKopoKopoPesaPalAnd the list goes on...Some businesses just need to sort out their business models. On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 9:51 AM, Walubengo J via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: @ Prof Ndemo, As you well know and remember, we experimented with our famous e-Maddo machines that were assembled at a local university and we tried to sell them to government ministries - without much success. Each ministry had and perhaps still has its 'owners' who will NOT want to buy local when they can buy foreign - with some good 'personal returns' :-) We have great ideas, but zero execution. #What_Would_Magufuli_Do :-)? walu. From: Bitange Ndemo via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> To: jwalu@yahoo.com Cc: Bitange Ndemo <bndemo@bitangendemo.me> Sent: Friday, August 26, 2016 11:20 PM Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop David,You are a great man. Keep on sharing your experiences. Policy is a democrat's tool for benevolent dictatorship. The Government should just have a policy to buy lab tops and desk tops from JKUAT. Our taxes should be spent on our products. Ndemo. On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 4:24 PM, David Otwoma via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Michael, I first met Taifa laptops when we had the ASK Show in 2015. I thought it great then, and seeing this new development I think it is very good. http://www.jkuat.ac.ke/ departments/it/taifa-a3- laptop/ It reminded me of how I returned to Kenya in 2006 after almost 10 years abroad. The government had just removed duty on PC parts and hence since I was entitled to a 40 foot container with my personal effects I filled it with motherboards, RAMs, HDs and other things not available locally. When it was eventually cleared I got some of my childhood pals we grew together in Eastlands and we would assemble "No Name" tower or desk top and enabled many who could not afford branded i.e. IBM, HP, Dell etc. to still enjoy what a computer can as the hardware of essence is the motherboard, RAM, HD while software those days one could pirate MS without dire consequences. My bossom buddy got his son admitted to JKUAT and when the boy was sent home for not having a laptop I advised he gets the Taifa as he will pay by installments. Going forward what JKUAT may do is enter into an agreement with some commercial bank(s) who can provide soft loans (now that interest rates are coming down by law) to enable those who wish to pay back in 4 or 5 years to have that facility. Globally I used to see German made (Siemen Company) desktops and towers sold to students through local arrangements with European banks not only in Germany but in Austria and Switzerland too. That does not stop those who may wish to buy say Apple, Toshiba, HP etc at a premium doing so. The beauty is we have our own, even if forced down out children's' throats, it eventually will bring about the effect I have seen in far of places like Japan, South Korea, USA just to name a few. I remember a friend who had to attended a 6 months training course in Japan was issued a Toshiba laptop and its cost included in the training package. the whole class had more than 20 Africans and it occurred every year since 1997. If JKUAT can borrow that leaf and extend beyong 1st years reporting to civil servants who have to attend some compulsory courses not available at Kenya School of Government it will be great as it would boost usage and outlet of this Taifa laptops. Better still is making a deal with government entities like the Ministries, Parastatals etc and supply us with this laptops. Only last week I was issued with the biannual replacement of my laptop witha HP imported from United Arab Emirates and I am willing to bet half my August salary that it was purchased in excess of kshs. 70,000 while its specs are not so different from the Taifa laptop! Why are we happier creating jobs for technicians (since someone may argue degree holders should not be assembling laptops) abroad while our own youths are jobless. Why do we wish to export our dollars abroad when we could pass the money to our own locally to spend locally, the bigger chunks, eventually? Finally every-time I visit West African countries I notice they do not wear suits like we do in kenya starting from their President down to the street urchins. They have evolved a sophisticated clothing industry that do not allow 'someone died aka mitumba' industry as we have here. Let me start counting the minutes to Furahi day. -- -- David Otwoma, PhD Chief Scientist, National Commission for Science Technology and Innovation (NACOSTI) Utalii House, P.O Box 30623-00100 Nairobi, Kenya Safcom tel: +254 722 141771, Orange tel: +254 (0)20 2346915, email: otwooma@gmail.com & otwoma@uonbi.ac.ke http://www.facebook.com/ profile.php?ref=profile&id= 100000614284149 http://www.nacosti.go.ke & Chairman, Eastern Africa Association for Radiation Protection, http://www.eaarp.org/ On Thu, Aug 25, 2016 at 12:10 PM, Musya Michael via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke > wrote: Anyone using this laptop? Experiences so far? http://www.the-star.co.ke/news /2016/08/22/parents-protest- jkuats-imposition-of-taifa- laptops-on-students_c1407693 -- Regards, Michael Musya. I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me. Philippians 4:13 ______________________________ _________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/m ailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/m ailman/options/kictanet/otwoma d%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. ______________________________ _________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/ mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/ mailman/options/kictanet/ bndemo%40bitangendemo.me The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/jwalu%40yahoo.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not
Areba has raised a valid and legit point My point in summary forcing someone to use your product = killing competition which ends up in substandard products. The word force if applied on anything something has to break. Why cant all this approach be persuasive and competitive; what are we teaching our marketing and sales students now is basically enforce someone to use your products instead of be creative and convince them that your product is the best. On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 9:47 AM, arebacollins via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
I still don't get it. 1: why should we spend resources to attempt producing stuff we have zero chance of being competitive in? National pride? Lack of stuff we might be competitive in?
2: why should we focus on being a light manufacturing hub Daktari? Why not for instance be a net agricultural producer? (Climate, water, and lots of starving peeps in the neighbourhood).
3: suppose we force consumption of said "made in Kenya product" produced by the local manufacturer, why then favour just that. Why not force government to use Mobius?
How then , or when do they become global competitive industries? I'm afraid I see no difference between this and Nyayo pioneer. I suspect our education system, and western leaning capitalism has made us incapable of appreciating anything local. That's where change needs to start from; investing in the fabric that ties us.
Sent from my Samsung device
-------- Original message -------- From: Lawrence Njogu via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Date: 27/08/2016 11:51 pm (GMT+03:00) To: arebacollins@gmail.com Cc: Lawrence Njogu <lnjogu@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
@Ndemo I totally agree with you !! We need to support our own
------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 11:03:32 +0300 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop From: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke CC: bndemo@bitangendemo.me To: lnjogu@hotmail.com
Walubengo, MOIC actually bought 100 Madaraka Desk Tops from JKUAT and Multimedia. They are still in use and we never had any complaints. That is why I advocate for a policy to buy locally made electronic products. We have an opportunity to compete with India that is priming itself as the global hub of light electronic producta through it moto Make in India. If you look at Konza's strategic documents, we were high on light electronic manufacturing. KAIST is looking to build that capacity and several mobile handset manufacturers are eyeing the same. We cannot be the ones pouring cold water on an opportunity like this.
Ndemo.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:53 AM, Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Waithaka.. NASA has some of the most sophisticated and quality assured software there is.
And the NASA I know wont procure something that will compromise the quality standards they have. Just think about it. They send a space-craft to Pluto against 1000 parameters that they need to get right. The project costs billions of dollars. And they made it to pluto. Thats worth a clap. What is not worth a clap is getting desperate people to buy your technology.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Waithaka Ngigi <ngigi@at.co.ke> wrote:
Ahmed,
This is way too simplistic...
It's like the German Chancellor saying since they have VW, BMW & Mercedes there's no need for The German Government to buy and promote upcoming German products.
Would NASA in the US consider buying a cheaper Super Computer from China, for example, because HP & Dell need to sort out their business models? Huawei, for reasons disguised as 'National Security' cannot sell a single product to the US Govt... Not when US has firms like CISCO & Juniper building similiar equipment.
The thinking that there's no patriotism when purchasing products is only propagated at the developing world's so that they can open up their markets.
Waithaka Ngigi
Alliance Technologies www.at.co.ke *From: *Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanet *Sent: *Saturday, August 27, 2016 10:01 AM *To: *Ngigi Waithaka *Reply To: *KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions *Cc: *Ahmed Mohamed Maawy *Subject: *Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
Personal comments:
A business model that forces success is not a successful business. Its a dictatorial business.
Examples of famous products from Kenya that Kenyans use:
- M-Pesa - M-Kopa Solar - Mobius - Ushahidi - BRCK - BitPesa - KopoKopo - PesaPal - And the list goes on...
Some businesses just need to sort out their business models.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 9:51 AM, Walubengo J via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
@ Prof Ndemo,
As you well know and remember, we experimented with our famous e-Maddo machines that were assembled at a local university and we tried to sell them to government ministries - without much success.
Each ministry had and perhaps still has its 'owners' who will NOT want to buy local when they can buy foreign - with some good 'personal returns' :-)
We have great ideas, but zero execution.
#What_Would_Magufuli_Do :-)?
walu.
------------------------------ *From:* Bitange Ndemo via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *To:* jwalu@yahoo.com *Cc:* Bitange Ndemo <bndemo@bitangendemo.me> *Sent:* Friday, August 26, 2016 11:20 PM *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
David, You are a great man. Keep on sharing your experiences. Policy is a democrat's tool for benevolent dictatorship. The Government should just have a policy to buy lab tops and desk tops from JKUAT. Our taxes should be spent on our products.
Ndemo.
On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 4:24 PM, David Otwoma via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Michael,
I first met Taifa laptops when we had the ASK Show in 2015. I thought it great then, and seeing this new development I think it is very good. http://www.jkuat.ac.ke/ departments/it/taifa-a3- laptop/ <http://www.jkuat.ac.ke/departments/it/taifa-a3-laptop/>
It reminded me of how I returned to Kenya in 2006 after almost 10 years abroad. The government had just removed duty on PC parts and hence since I was entitled to a 40 foot container with my personal effects I filled it with motherboards, RAMs, HDs and other things not available locally. When it was eventually cleared I got some of my childhood pals we grew together in Eastlands and we would assemble "No Name" tower or desk top and enabled many who could not afford branded i.e. IBM, HP, Dell etc. to still enjoy what a computer can as the hardware of essence is the motherboard, RAM, HD while software those days one could pirate MS without dire consequences.
My bossom buddy got his son admitted to JKUAT and when the boy was sent home for not having a laptop I advised he gets the Taifa as he will pay by installments. Going forward what JKUAT may do is enter into an agreement with some commercial bank(s) who can provide soft loans (now that interest rates are coming down by law) to enable those who wish to pay back in 4 or 5 years to have that facility.
Globally I used to see German made (Siemen Company) desktops and towers sold to students through local arrangements with European banks not only in Germany but in Austria and Switzerland too. That does not stop those who may wish to buy say Apple, Toshiba, HP etc at a premium doing so. The beauty is we have our own, even if forced down out children's' throats, it eventually will bring about the effect I have seen in far of places like Japan, South Korea, USA just to name a few. I remember a friend who had to attended a 6 months training course in Japan was issued a Toshiba laptop and its cost included in the training package. the whole class had more than 20 Africans and it occurred every year since 1997. If JKUAT can borrow that leaf and extend beyong 1st years reporting to civil servants who have to attend some compulsory courses not available at Kenya School of Government it will be great as it would boost usage and outlet of this Taifa laptops. Better still is making a deal with government entities like the Ministries, Parastatals etc and supply us with this laptops. Only last week I was issued with the biannual replacement of my laptop witha HP imported from United Arab Emirates and I am willing to bet half my August salary that it was purchased in excess of kshs. 70,000 while its specs are not so different from the Taifa laptop! Why are we happier creating jobs for technicians (since someone may argue degree holders should not be assembling laptops) abroad while our own youths are jobless. Why do we wish to export our dollars abroad when we could pass the money to our own locally to spend locally, the bigger chunks, eventually?
Finally every-time I visit West African countries I notice they do not wear suits like we do in kenya starting from their President down to the street urchins. They have evolved a sophisticated clothing industry that do not allow 'someone died aka mitumba' industry as we have here.
Let me start counting the minutes to Furahi day.
-- -- David Otwoma, PhD Chief Scientist, National Commission for Science Technology and Innovation (NACOSTI) Utalii House, P.O Box 30623-00100 Nairobi, Kenya Safcom tel: +254 722 141771, Orange tel: +254 (0)20 2346915, email: otwooma@gmail.com & otwoma@uonbi.ac.ke http://www.facebook.com/ profile.php?ref=profile&id= 100000614284149 <http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?ref=profile&id=100000614284149> http://www.nacosti.go.ke & Chairman, Eastern Africa Association for Radiation Protection, http://www.eaarp.org/
On Thu, Aug 25, 2016 at 12:10 PM, Musya Michael via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke > wrote:
Anyone using this laptop? Experiences so far?
http://www.the-star.co.ke/news /2016/08/22/parents-protest- jkuats-imposition-of-taifa- laptops-on-students_c1407693 <http://www.the-star.co.ke/news/2016/08/22/parents-protest-jkuats-imposition-of-taifa-laptops-on-students_c1407693>
-- Regards,
Michael Musya.
I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me. Philippians 4:13
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
______________________________ _________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/ mailman/listinfo/kictanet <https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet>
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Samson Oduor
You missed Prof. Ndemo's narratives. Support Kenyan build Kenya. Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2016 14:53:56 +0300 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop From: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke CC: sam.oduor@gmail.com To: lnjogu@hotmail.com Areba has raised a valid and legit point My point in summary forcing someone to use your product = killing competition which ends up in substandard products. The word force if applied on anything something has to break. Why cant all this approach be persuasive and competitive; what are we teaching our marketing and sales students now is basically enforce someone to use your products instead of be creative and convince them that your product is the best. On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 9:47 AM, arebacollins via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: I still don't get it. 1: why should we spend resources to attempt producing stuff we have zero chance of being competitive in? National pride? Lack of stuff we might be competitive in? 2: why should we focus on being a light manufacturing hub Daktari? Why not for instance be a net agricultural producer? (Climate, water, and lots of starving peeps in the neighbourhood). 3: suppose we force consumption of said "made in Kenya product" produced by the local manufacturer, why then favour just that. Why not force government to use Mobius? How then , or when do they become global competitive industries? I'm afraid I see no difference between this and Nyayo pioneer. I suspect our education system, and western leaning capitalism has made us incapable of appreciating anything local. That's where change needs to start from; investing in the fabric that ties us. Sent from my Samsung device -------- Original message -------- From: Lawrence Njogu via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Date: 27/08/2016 11:51 pm (GMT+03:00) To: arebacollins@gmail.com Cc: Lawrence Njogu <lnjogu@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop @Ndemo I totally agree with you !! We need to support our own Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 11:03:32 +0300 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop From: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke CC: bndemo@bitangendemo.me To: lnjogu@hotmail.com Walubengo,MOIC actually bought 100 Madaraka Desk Tops from JKUAT and Multimedia. They are still in use and we never had any complaints. That is why I advocate for a policy to buy locally made electronic products. We have an opportunity to compete with India that is priming itself as the global hub of light electronic producta through it moto Make in India. If you look at Konza's strategic documents, we were high on light electronic manufacturing. KAIST is looking to build that capacity and several mobile handset manufacturers are eyeing the same. We cannot be the ones pouring cold water on an opportunity like this. Ndemo. On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:53 AM, Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Waithaka.. NASA has some of the most sophisticated and quality assured software there is. And the NASA I know wont procure something that will compromise the quality standards they have. Just think about it. They send a space-craft to Pluto against 1000 parameters that they need to get right. The project costs billions of dollars. And they made it to pluto. Thats worth a clap. What is not worth a clap is getting desperate people to buy your technology. On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Waithaka Ngigi <ngigi@at.co.ke> wrote: Ahmed, This is way too simplistic... It's like the German Chancellor saying since they have VW, BMW & Mercedes there's no need for The German Government to buy and promote upcoming German products. Would NASA in the US consider buying a cheaper Super Computer from China, for example, because HP & Dell need to sort out their business models? Huawei, for reasons disguised as 'National Security' cannot sell a single product to the US Govt... Not when US has firms like CISCO & Juniper building similiar equipment. The thinking that there's no patriotism when purchasing products is only propagated at the developing world's so that they can open up their markets. Waithaka Ngigi Alliance Technologies www.at.co.ke From: Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanetSent: Saturday, August 27, 2016 10:01 AMTo: Ngigi WaithakaReply To: KICTAnet ICT Policy DiscussionsCc: Ahmed Mohamed MaawySubject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop Personal comments: A business model that forces success is not a successful business. Its a dictatorial business. Examples of famous products from Kenya that Kenyans use: M-PesaM-Kopa SolarMobius UshahidiBRCKBitPesaKopoKopoPesaPalAnd the list goes on...Some businesses just need to sort out their business models. On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 9:51 AM, Walubengo J via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: @ Prof Ndemo, As you well know and remember, we experimented with our famous e-Maddo machines that were assembled at a local university and we tried to sell them to government ministries - without much success. Each ministry had and perhaps still has its 'owners' who will NOT want to buy local when they can buy foreign - with some good 'personal returns' :-) We have great ideas, but zero execution. #What_Would_Magufuli_Do :-)? walu. From: Bitange Ndemo via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> To: jwalu@yahoo.com Cc: Bitange Ndemo <bndemo@bitangendemo.me> Sent: Friday, August 26, 2016 11:20 PM Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop David,You are a great man. Keep on sharing your experiences. Policy is a democrat's tool for benevolent dictatorship. The Government should just have a policy to buy lab tops and desk tops from JKUAT. Our taxes should be spent on our products.Ndemo.On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 4:24 PM, David Otwoma via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:Michael,I first met Taifa laptops when we had the ASK Show in 2015. I thought it great then, and seeing this new development I think it is very good. http://www.jkuat.ac.ke/ departments/it/taifa-a3- laptop/It reminded me of how I returned to Kenya in 2006 after almost 10 years abroad. The government had just removed duty on PC parts and hence since I was entitled to a 40 foot container with my personal effects I filled it with motherboards, RAMs, HDs and other things not available locally. When it was eventually cleared I got some of my childhood pals we grew together in Eastlands and we would assemble "No Name" tower or desk top and enabled many who could not afford branded i.e. IBM, HP, Dell etc. to still enjoy what a computer can as the hardware of essence is the motherboard, RAM, HD while software those days one could pirate MS without dire consequences.My bossom buddy got his son admitted to JKUAT and when the boy was sent home for not having a laptop I advised he gets the Taifa as he will pay by installments. Going forward what JKUAT may do is enter into an agreement with some commercial bank(s) who can provide soft loans (now that interest rates are coming down by law) to enable those who wish to pay back in 4 or 5 years to have that facility.Globally I used to see German made (Siemen Company) desktops and towers sold to students through local arrangements with European banks not only in Germany but in Austria and Switzerland too. That does not stop those who may wish to buy say Apple, Toshiba, HP etc at a premium doing so. The beauty is we have our own, even if forced down out children's' throats, it eventually will bring about the effect I have seen in far of places like Japan, South Korea, USA just to name a few. I remember a friend who had to attended a 6 months training course in Japan was issued a Toshiba laptop and its cost included in the training package. the whole class had more than 20 Africans and it occurred every year since 1997. If JKUAT can borrow that leaf and extend beyong 1st years reporting to civil servants who have to attend some compulsory courses not available at Kenya School of Government it will be great as it would boost usage and outlet of this Taifa laptops. Better still is making a deal with government entities like the Ministries, Parastatals etc and supply us with this laptops. Only last week I was issued with the biannual replacement of my laptop witha HP imported from United Arab Emirates and I am willing to bet half my August salary that it was purchased in excess of kshs. 70,000 while its specs are not so different from the Taifa laptop! Why are we happier creating jobs for technicians (since someone may argue degree holders should not be assembling laptops) abroad while our own youths are jobless. Why do we wish to export our dollars abroad when we could pass the money to our own locally to spend locally, the bigger chunks, eventually?Finally every-time I visit West African countries I notice they do not wear suits like we do in kenya starting from their President down to the street urchins. They have evolved a sophisticated clothing industry that do not allow 'someone died aka mitumba' industry as we have here. Let me start counting the minutes to Furahi day. ----David Otwoma, PhDChief Scientist,National Commission for Science Technology and Innovation (NACOSTI)Utalii House, P.O Box 30623-00100 Nairobi, KenyaSafcom tel: +254 722 141771,Orange tel: +254 (0)20 2346915,email: otwooma@gmail.com & otwoma@uonbi.ac.kehttp://www.facebook.com/ profile.php?ref=profile&id= 100000614284149http://www.nacosti.go.ke&Chairman,Eastern Africa Association for Radiation Protection, http://www.eaarp.org/ On Thu, Aug 25, 2016 at 12:10 PM, Musya Michael via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke > wrote:Anyone using this laptop? Experiences so far?http://www.the-star.co.ke/news /2016/08/22/parents-protest- jkuats-imposition-of-taifa- laptops-on-students_c1407693-- Regards,Michael Musya.I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.Philippians 4:13 ______________________________ _________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/m ailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/m ailman/options/kictanet/otwoma d%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. ______________________________ _________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/ mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/ mailman/options/kictanet/ bndemo%40bitangendemo.me The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________kictanet mailing listkictanet@lists.kictanet.or.kehttps://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanetUnsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/jwalu%40yahoo.comThe Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/sam.oduor%40gmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. -- Samson Oduor _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/lnjogu%40hotmail.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Areba/Sam, Somehow we must start somewhere. We can become competitive depending on how fast we go through the learning curve. To get on to the learning curve is where the problem lies. Our appetite for foreign goods and the freedom without responsibility blinds us. Our future security is predicated upon how many of the youths would be in employment. Whether we are forced or not the goal is to create a manufacturing culture locally. Indeed most of "forced" marriages in the past worked better than the current love based marriages. Majority of us were basically "forced" to acquire an education. Let us support local initiatives that have potential for a better future. Ndemo. On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 2:53 PM, Sam Oduor via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Areba has raised a valid and legit point
My point in summary forcing someone to use your product = killing competition which ends up in substandard products.
The word force if applied on anything something has to break. Why cant all this approach be persuasive and competitive; what are we teaching our marketing and sales students now is basically enforce someone to use your products instead of be creative and convince them that your product is the best.
On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 9:47 AM, arebacollins via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
I still don't get it. 1: why should we spend resources to attempt producing stuff we have zero chance of being competitive in? National pride? Lack of stuff we might be competitive in?
2: why should we focus on being a light manufacturing hub Daktari? Why not for instance be a net agricultural producer? (Climate, water, and lots of starving peeps in the neighbourhood).
3: suppose we force consumption of said "made in Kenya product" produced by the local manufacturer, why then favour just that. Why not force government to use Mobius?
How then , or when do they become global competitive industries? I'm afraid I see no difference between this and Nyayo pioneer. I suspect our education system, and western leaning capitalism has made us incapable of appreciating anything local. That's where change needs to start from; investing in the fabric that ties us.
Sent from my Samsung device
-------- Original message -------- From: Lawrence Njogu via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Date: 27/08/2016 11:51 pm (GMT+03:00) To: arebacollins@gmail.com Cc: Lawrence Njogu <lnjogu@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
@Ndemo I totally agree with you !! We need to support our own
------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 11:03:32 +0300 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop From: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke CC: bndemo@bitangendemo.me To: lnjogu@hotmail.com
Walubengo, MOIC actually bought 100 Madaraka Desk Tops from JKUAT and Multimedia. They are still in use and we never had any complaints. That is why I advocate for a policy to buy locally made electronic products. We have an opportunity to compete with India that is priming itself as the global hub of light electronic producta through it moto Make in India. If you look at Konza's strategic documents, we were high on light electronic manufacturing. KAIST is looking to build that capacity and several mobile handset manufacturers are eyeing the same. We cannot be the ones pouring cold water on an opportunity like this.
Ndemo.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:53 AM, Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Waithaka.. NASA has some of the most sophisticated and quality assured software there is.
And the NASA I know wont procure something that will compromise the quality standards they have. Just think about it. They send a space-craft to Pluto against 1000 parameters that they need to get right. The project costs billions of dollars. And they made it to pluto. Thats worth a clap. What is not worth a clap is getting desperate people to buy your technology.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Waithaka Ngigi <ngigi@at.co.ke> wrote:
Ahmed,
This is way too simplistic...
It's like the German Chancellor saying since they have VW, BMW & Mercedes there's no need for The German Government to buy and promote upcoming German products.
Would NASA in the US consider buying a cheaper Super Computer from China, for example, because HP & Dell need to sort out their business models? Huawei, for reasons disguised as 'National Security' cannot sell a single product to the US Govt... Not when US has firms like CISCO & Juniper building similiar equipment.
The thinking that there's no patriotism when purchasing products is only propagated at the developing world's so that they can open up their markets.
Waithaka Ngigi
Alliance Technologies www.at.co.ke *From: *Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanet *Sent: *Saturday, August 27, 2016 10:01 AM *To: *Ngigi Waithaka *Reply To: *KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions *Cc: *Ahmed Mohamed Maawy *Subject: *Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
Personal comments:
A business model that forces success is not a successful business. Its a dictatorial business.
Examples of famous products from Kenya that Kenyans use:
- M-Pesa - M-Kopa Solar - Mobius - Ushahidi - BRCK - BitPesa - KopoKopo - PesaPal - And the list goes on...
Some businesses just need to sort out their business models.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 9:51 AM, Walubengo J via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
@ Prof Ndemo,
As you well know and remember, we experimented with our famous e-Maddo machines that were assembled at a local university and we tried to sell them to government ministries - without much success.
Each ministry had and perhaps still has its 'owners' who will NOT want to buy local when they can buy foreign - with some good 'personal returns' :-)
We have great ideas, but zero execution.
#What_Would_Magufuli_Do :-)?
walu.
------------------------------ *From:* Bitange Ndemo via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *To:* jwalu@yahoo.com *Cc:* Bitange Ndemo <bndemo@bitangendemo.me> *Sent:* Friday, August 26, 2016 11:20 PM *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
David, You are a great man. Keep on sharing your experiences. Policy is a democrat's tool for benevolent dictatorship. The Government should just have a policy to buy lab tops and desk tops from JKUAT. Our taxes should be spent on our products.
Ndemo.
On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 4:24 PM, David Otwoma via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Michael,
I first met Taifa laptops when we had the ASK Show in 2015. I thought it great then, and seeing this new development I think it is very good. http://www.jkuat.ac.ke/ departments/it/taifa-a3- laptop/ <http://www.jkuat.ac.ke/departments/it/taifa-a3-laptop/>
It reminded me of how I returned to Kenya in 2006 after almost 10 years abroad. The government had just removed duty on PC parts and hence since I was entitled to a 40 foot container with my personal effects I filled it with motherboards, RAMs, HDs and other things not available locally. When it was eventually cleared I got some of my childhood pals we grew together in Eastlands and we would assemble "No Name" tower or desk top and enabled many who could not afford branded i.e. IBM, HP, Dell etc. to still enjoy what a computer can as the hardware of essence is the motherboard, RAM, HD while software those days one could pirate MS without dire consequences.
My bossom buddy got his son admitted to JKUAT and when the boy was sent home for not having a laptop I advised he gets the Taifa as he will pay by installments. Going forward what JKUAT may do is enter into an agreement with some commercial bank(s) who can provide soft loans (now that interest rates are coming down by law) to enable those who wish to pay back in 4 or 5 years to have that facility.
Globally I used to see German made (Siemen Company) desktops and towers sold to students through local arrangements with European banks not only in Germany but in Austria and Switzerland too. That does not stop those who may wish to buy say Apple, Toshiba, HP etc at a premium doing so. The beauty is we have our own, even if forced down out children's' throats, it eventually will bring about the effect I have seen in far of places like Japan, South Korea, USA just to name a few. I remember a friend who had to attended a 6 months training course in Japan was issued a Toshiba laptop and its cost included in the training package. the whole class had more than 20 Africans and it occurred every year since 1997. If JKUAT can borrow that leaf and extend beyong 1st years reporting to civil servants who have to attend some compulsory courses not available at Kenya School of Government it will be great as it would boost usage and outlet of this Taifa laptops. Better still is making a deal with government entities like the Ministries, Parastatals etc and supply us with this laptops. Only last week I was issued with the biannual replacement of my laptop witha HP imported from United Arab Emirates and I am willing to bet half my August salary that it was purchased in excess of kshs. 70,000 while its specs are not so different from the Taifa laptop! Why are we happier creating jobs for technicians (since someone may argue degree holders should not be assembling laptops) abroad while our own youths are jobless. Why do we wish to export our dollars abroad when we could pass the money to our own locally to spend locally, the bigger chunks, eventually?
Finally every-time I visit West African countries I notice they do not wear suits like we do in kenya starting from their President down to the street urchins. They have evolved a sophisticated clothing industry that do not allow 'someone died aka mitumba' industry as we have here.
Let me start counting the minutes to Furahi day.
-- -- David Otwoma, PhD Chief Scientist, National Commission for Science Technology and Innovation (NACOSTI) Utalii House, P.O Box 30623-00100 Nairobi, Kenya Safcom tel: +254 722 141771, Orange tel: +254 (0)20 2346915, email: otwooma@gmail.com & otwoma@uonbi.ac.ke http://www.facebook.com/ profile.php?ref=profile&id= 100000614284149 <http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?ref=profile&id=100000614284149> http://www.nacosti.go.ke & Chairman, Eastern Africa Association for Radiation Protection, http://www.eaarp.org/
On Thu, Aug 25, 2016 at 12:10 PM, Musya Michael via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke > wrote:
Anyone using this laptop? Experiences so far?
http://www.the-star.co.ke/news /2016/08/22/parents-protest- jkuats-imposition-of-taifa- laptops-on-students_c1407693 <http://www.the-star.co.ke/news/2016/08/22/parents-protest-jkuats-imposition-of-taifa-laptops-on-students_c1407693>
-- Regards,
Michael Musya.
I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me. Philippians 4:13
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
______________________________ _________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/ mailman/listinfo/kictanet <https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet>
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
Hello Hon. Ndemo Thank you so much for the quick response on a Sunday ! - I feel so honored that you have read my sentiments which shows your unwavering commitment to growing our nation. I am not opposed to the fact that Kenyans ought to support Kenyan products - I fully support it and I am looking forward to owning this Laptop for personal use and "critique". What I disagree with is the approach and suggestions of enforcing this on pretext of nationalism. We live in a free world and freedom choice is something that should be left to individuals(consumers). No offense to anyone who does not practice my faith - but the Salvation of our Lord Jesus Christ is also by choice, as Christians we live a life that is admirable - marketing Christian values to others; not forcing them to practice the Faith. To my sentiments:- Have we looked at other road-maps and incentives to market our own products and convince people beyond our borders to buy Kenyan ? What measures are we taking to ensure other products will still independently compete with Kenyan products within Kenyan borders - we cant kill them locally ? How does companies like the "IBM's" who have done noble courses in Kenya feel when we are planning to shut them down for our own products ? What are the ramifications of this "companies" saying , fine - we are also shutting you Kenyans from our market and also locking our codes, skills and products from your Markets - wont our Kenyan youths suffer more joblessness in this case and be locked to a single market - Kenya ? As much as I believe every single Kenyan should own Kenyan - I still believe we can harness our Marketing and Sales skills to not only convince Kenyans to have Kenyan but have this product go beyond our borders. It should be more or less like willing buyer because they are firmly convince this is the way we ought to go; in the long run - enforcing looks negative in a free consumer world. People will be more at peace if they make the choice independently on what they want to use. Thank you once again for your considerations On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 5:04 PM, Bitange Ndemo <bndemo@bitangendemo.me> wrote:
Areba/Sam, Somehow we must start somewhere. We can become competitive depending on how fast we go through the learning curve. To get on to the learning curve is where the problem lies. Our appetite for foreign goods and the freedom without responsibility blinds us. Our future security is predicated upon how many of the youths would be in employment. Whether we are forced or not the goal is to create a manufacturing culture locally. Indeed most of "forced" marriages in the past worked better than the current love based marriages. Majority of us were basically "forced" to acquire an education. Let us support local initiatives that have potential for a better future.
Ndemo.
On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 2:53 PM, Sam Oduor via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Areba has raised a valid and legit point
My point in summary forcing someone to use your product = killing competition which ends up in substandard products.
The word force if applied on anything something has to break. Why cant all this approach be persuasive and competitive; what are we teaching our marketing and sales students now is basically enforce someone to use your products instead of be creative and convince them that your product is the best.
On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 9:47 AM, arebacollins via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
I still don't get it. 1: why should we spend resources to attempt producing stuff we have zero chance of being competitive in? National pride? Lack of stuff we might be competitive in?
2: why should we focus on being a light manufacturing hub Daktari? Why not for instance be a net agricultural producer? (Climate, water, and lots of starving peeps in the neighbourhood).
3: suppose we force consumption of said "made in Kenya product" produced by the local manufacturer, why then favour just that. Why not force government to use Mobius?
How then , or when do they become global competitive industries? I'm afraid I see no difference between this and Nyayo pioneer. I suspect our education system, and western leaning capitalism has made us incapable of appreciating anything local. That's where change needs to start from; investing in the fabric that ties us.
Sent from my Samsung device
-------- Original message -------- From: Lawrence Njogu via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Date: 27/08/2016 11:51 pm (GMT+03:00) To: arebacollins@gmail.com Cc: Lawrence Njogu <lnjogu@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
@Ndemo I totally agree with you !! We need to support our own
------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 11:03:32 +0300 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop From: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke CC: bndemo@bitangendemo.me To: lnjogu@hotmail.com
Walubengo, MOIC actually bought 100 Madaraka Desk Tops from JKUAT and Multimedia. They are still in use and we never had any complaints. That is why I advocate for a policy to buy locally made electronic products. We have an opportunity to compete with India that is priming itself as the global hub of light electronic producta through it moto Make in India. If you look at Konza's strategic documents, we were high on light electronic manufacturing. KAIST is looking to build that capacity and several mobile handset manufacturers are eyeing the same. We cannot be the ones pouring cold water on an opportunity like this.
Ndemo.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:53 AM, Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Waithaka.. NASA has some of the most sophisticated and quality assured software there is.
And the NASA I know wont procure something that will compromise the quality standards they have. Just think about it. They send a space-craft to Pluto against 1000 parameters that they need to get right. The project costs billions of dollars. And they made it to pluto. Thats worth a clap. What is not worth a clap is getting desperate people to buy your technology.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Waithaka Ngigi <ngigi@at.co.ke> wrote:
Ahmed,
This is way too simplistic...
It's like the German Chancellor saying since they have VW, BMW & Mercedes there's no need for The German Government to buy and promote upcoming German products.
Would NASA in the US consider buying a cheaper Super Computer from China, for example, because HP & Dell need to sort out their business models? Huawei, for reasons disguised as 'National Security' cannot sell a single product to the US Govt... Not when US has firms like CISCO & Juniper building similiar equipment.
The thinking that there's no patriotism when purchasing products is only propagated at the developing world's so that they can open up their markets.
Waithaka Ngigi
Alliance Technologies www.at.co.ke *From: *Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanet *Sent: *Saturday, August 27, 2016 10:01 AM *To: *Ngigi Waithaka *Reply To: *KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions *Cc: *Ahmed Mohamed Maawy *Subject: *Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
Personal comments:
A business model that forces success is not a successful business. Its a dictatorial business.
Examples of famous products from Kenya that Kenyans use:
- M-Pesa - M-Kopa Solar - Mobius - Ushahidi - BRCK - BitPesa - KopoKopo - PesaPal - And the list goes on...
Some businesses just need to sort out their business models.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 9:51 AM, Walubengo J via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
@ Prof Ndemo,
As you well know and remember, we experimented with our famous e-Maddo machines that were assembled at a local university and we tried to sell them to government ministries - without much success.
Each ministry had and perhaps still has its 'owners' who will NOT want to buy local when they can buy foreign - with some good 'personal returns' :-)
We have great ideas, but zero execution.
#What_Would_Magufuli_Do :-)?
walu.
------------------------------ *From:* Bitange Ndemo via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *To:* jwalu@yahoo.com *Cc:* Bitange Ndemo <bndemo@bitangendemo.me> *Sent:* Friday, August 26, 2016 11:20 PM *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
David, You are a great man. Keep on sharing your experiences. Policy is a democrat's tool for benevolent dictatorship. The Government should just have a policy to buy lab tops and desk tops from JKUAT. Our taxes should be spent on our products.
Ndemo.
On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 4:24 PM, David Otwoma via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Michael,
I first met Taifa laptops when we had the ASK Show in 2015. I thought it great then, and seeing this new development I think it is very good. http://www.jkuat.ac.ke/ departments/it/taifa-a3- laptop/ <http://www.jkuat.ac.ke/departments/it/taifa-a3-laptop/>
It reminded me of how I returned to Kenya in 2006 after almost 10 years abroad. The government had just removed duty on PC parts and hence since I was entitled to a 40 foot container with my personal effects I filled it with motherboards, RAMs, HDs and other things not available locally. When it was eventually cleared I got some of my childhood pals we grew together in Eastlands and we would assemble "No Name" tower or desk top and enabled many who could not afford branded i.e. IBM, HP, Dell etc. to still enjoy what a computer can as the hardware of essence is the motherboard, RAM, HD while software those days one could pirate MS without dire consequences.
My bossom buddy got his son admitted to JKUAT and when the boy was sent home for not having a laptop I advised he gets the Taifa as he will pay by installments. Going forward what JKUAT may do is enter into an agreement with some commercial bank(s) who can provide soft loans (now that interest rates are coming down by law) to enable those who wish to pay back in 4 or 5 years to have that facility.
Globally I used to see German made (Siemen Company) desktops and towers sold to students through local arrangements with European banks not only in Germany but in Austria and Switzerland too. That does not stop those who may wish to buy say Apple, Toshiba, HP etc at a premium doing so. The beauty is we have our own, even if forced down out children's' throats, it eventually will bring about the effect I have seen in far of places like Japan, South Korea, USA just to name a few. I remember a friend who had to attended a 6 months training course in Japan was issued a Toshiba laptop and its cost included in the training package. the whole class had more than 20 Africans and it occurred every year since 1997. If JKUAT can borrow that leaf and extend beyong 1st years reporting to civil servants who have to attend some compulsory courses not available at Kenya School of Government it will be great as it would boost usage and outlet of this Taifa laptops. Better still is making a deal with government entities like the Ministries, Parastatals etc and supply us with this laptops. Only last week I was issued with the biannual replacement of my laptop witha HP imported from United Arab Emirates and I am willing to bet half my August salary that it was purchased in excess of kshs. 70,000 while its specs are not so different from the Taifa laptop! Why are we happier creating jobs for technicians (since someone may argue degree holders should not be assembling laptops) abroad while our own youths are jobless. Why do we wish to export our dollars abroad when we could pass the money to our own locally to spend locally, the bigger chunks, eventually?
Finally every-time I visit West African countries I notice they do not wear suits like we do in kenya starting from their President down to the street urchins. They have evolved a sophisticated clothing industry that do not allow 'someone died aka mitumba' industry as we have here.
Let me start counting the minutes to Furahi day.
-- -- David Otwoma, PhD Chief Scientist, National Commission for Science Technology and Innovation (NACOSTI) Utalii House, P.O Box 30623-00100 Nairobi, Kenya Safcom tel: +254 722 141771, Orange tel: +254 (0)20 2346915, email: otwooma@gmail.com & otwoma@uonbi.ac.ke http://www.facebook.com/ profile.php?ref=profile&id= 100000614284149 <http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?ref=profile&id=100000614284149> http://www.nacosti.go.ke & Chairman, Eastern Africa Association for Radiation Protection, http://www.eaarp.org/
On Thu, Aug 25, 2016 at 12:10 PM, Musya Michael via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke > wrote:
Anyone using this laptop? Experiences so far?
http://www.the-star.co.ke/news /2016/08/22/parents-protest- jkuats-imposition-of-taifa- laptops-on-students_c1407693 <http://www.the-star.co.ke/news/2016/08/22/parents-protest-jkuats-imposition-of-taifa-laptops-on-students_c1407693>
-- Regards,
Michael Musya.
I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me. Philippians 4:13
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development.
KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
-- Samson Oduor
Good arguments and counter arguments, I think the Taifa idea is noble, from the arguments its clear we need a deliberate and intentional policy driven approach led by government to promote and support local products and innovation. If it means compelling all government officers to use it as the defacto machine, so be it. Nothing stops individual government officers from buying other brands for personal use, choice seems to be the source of this corruption monster. Let us find a way of supporting locally assembled gadgets. Regards On 8/28/16, Sam Oduor via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Hello Hon. Ndemo
Thank you so much for the quick response on a Sunday ! - I feel so honored that you have read my sentiments which shows your unwavering commitment to growing our nation.
I am not opposed to the fact that Kenyans ought to support Kenyan products - I fully support it and I am looking forward to owning this Laptop for personal use and "critique".
What I disagree with is the approach and suggestions of enforcing this on pretext of nationalism. We live in a free world and freedom choice is something that should be left to individuals(consumers).
No offense to anyone who does not practice my faith - but the Salvation of our Lord Jesus Christ is also by choice, as Christians we live a life that is admirable - marketing Christian values to others; not forcing them to practice the Faith.
To my sentiments:-
Have we looked at other road-maps and incentives to market our own products and convince people beyond our borders to buy Kenyan ?
What measures are we taking to ensure other products will still independently compete with Kenyan products within Kenyan borders - we cant kill them locally ?
How does companies like the "IBM's" who have done noble courses in Kenya feel when we are planning to shut them down for our own products ?
What are the ramifications of this "companies" saying , fine - we are also shutting you Kenyans from our market and also locking our codes, skills and products from your Markets - wont our Kenyan youths suffer more joblessness in this case and be locked to a single market - Kenya ?
As much as I believe every single Kenyan should own Kenyan - I still believe we can harness our Marketing and Sales skills to not only convince Kenyans to have Kenyan but have this product go beyond our borders.
It should be more or less like willing buyer because they are firmly convince this is the way we ought to go; in the long run - enforcing looks negative in a free consumer world. People will be more at peace if they make the choice independently on what they want to use.
Thank you once again for your considerations
On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 5:04 PM, Bitange Ndemo <bndemo@bitangendemo.me> wrote:
Areba/Sam, Somehow we must start somewhere. We can become competitive depending on how fast we go through the learning curve. To get on to the learning curve is where the problem lies. Our appetite for foreign goods and the freedom without responsibility blinds us. Our future security is predicated upon how many of the youths would be in employment. Whether we are forced or not the goal is to create a manufacturing culture locally. Indeed most of "forced" marriages in the past worked better than the current love based marriages. Majority of us were basically "forced" to acquire an education. Let us support local initiatives that have potential for a better future.
Ndemo.
On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 2:53 PM, Sam Oduor via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Areba has raised a valid and legit point
My point in summary forcing someone to use your product = killing competition which ends up in substandard products.
The word force if applied on anything something has to break. Why cant all this approach be persuasive and competitive; what are we teaching our marketing and sales students now is basically enforce someone to use your products instead of be creative and convince them that your product is the best.
On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 9:47 AM, arebacollins via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
I still don't get it. 1: why should we spend resources to attempt producing stuff we have zero chance of being competitive in? National pride? Lack of stuff we might be competitive in?
2: why should we focus on being a light manufacturing hub Daktari? Why not for instance be a net agricultural producer? (Climate, water, and lots of starving peeps in the neighbourhood).
3: suppose we force consumption of said "made in Kenya product" produced by the local manufacturer, why then favour just that. Why not force government to use Mobius?
How then , or when do they become global competitive industries? I'm afraid I see no difference between this and Nyayo pioneer. I suspect our education system, and western leaning capitalism has made us incapable of appreciating anything local. That's where change needs to start from; investing in the fabric that ties us.
Sent from my Samsung device
-------- Original message -------- From: Lawrence Njogu via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Date: 27/08/2016 11:51 pm (GMT+03:00) To: arebacollins@gmail.com Cc: Lawrence Njogu <lnjogu@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
@Ndemo I totally agree with you !! We need to support our own
------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 11:03:32 +0300 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop From: kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke CC: bndemo@bitangendemo.me To: lnjogu@hotmail.com
Walubengo, MOIC actually bought 100 Madaraka Desk Tops from JKUAT and Multimedia. They are still in use and we never had any complaints. That is why I advocate for a policy to buy locally made electronic products. We have an opportunity to compete with India that is priming itself as the global hub of light electronic producta through it moto Make in India. If you look at Konza's strategic documents, we were high on light electronic manufacturing. KAIST is looking to build that capacity and several mobile handset manufacturers are eyeing the same. We cannot be the ones pouring cold water on an opportunity like this.
Ndemo.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:53 AM, Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Waithaka.. NASA has some of the most sophisticated and quality assured software there is.
And the NASA I know wont procure something that will compromise the quality standards they have. Just think about it. They send a space-craft to Pluto against 1000 parameters that they need to get right. The project costs billions of dollars. And they made it to pluto. Thats worth a clap. What is not worth a clap is getting desperate people to buy your technology.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Waithaka Ngigi <ngigi@at.co.ke> wrote:
Ahmed,
This is way too simplistic...
It's like the German Chancellor saying since they have VW, BMW & Mercedes there's no need for The German Government to buy and promote upcoming German products.
Would NASA in the US consider buying a cheaper Super Computer from China, for example, because HP & Dell need to sort out their business models? Huawei, for reasons disguised as 'National Security' cannot sell a single product to the US Govt... Not when US has firms like CISCO & Juniper building similiar equipment.
The thinking that there's no patriotism when purchasing products is only propagated at the developing world's so that they can open up their markets.
Waithaka Ngigi
Alliance Technologies www.at.co.ke *From: *Ahmed Mohamed Maawy via kictanet *Sent: *Saturday, August 27, 2016 10:01 AM *To: *Ngigi Waithaka *Reply To: *KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions *Cc: *Ahmed Mohamed Maawy *Subject: *Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
Personal comments:
A business model that forces success is not a successful business. Its a dictatorial business.
Examples of famous products from Kenya that Kenyans use:
- M-Pesa - M-Kopa Solar - Mobius - Ushahidi - BRCK - BitPesa - KopoKopo - PesaPal - And the list goes on...
Some businesses just need to sort out their business models.
On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 9:51 AM, Walubengo J via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
@ Prof Ndemo,
As you well know and remember, we experimented with our famous e-Maddo machines that were assembled at a local university and we tried to sell them to government ministries - without much success.
Each ministry had and perhaps still has its 'owners' who will NOT want to buy local when they can buy foreign - with some good 'personal returns' :-)
We have great ideas, but zero execution.
#What_Would_Magufuli_Do :-)?
walu.
------------------------------ *From:* Bitange Ndemo via kictanet <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> *To:* jwalu@yahoo.com *Cc:* Bitange Ndemo <bndemo@bitangendemo.me> *Sent:* Friday, August 26, 2016 11:20 PM *Subject:* Re: [kictanet] Taifa Laptop
David, You are a great man. Keep on sharing your experiences. Policy is a democrat's tool for benevolent dictatorship. The Government should just have a policy to buy lab tops and desk tops from JKUAT. Our taxes should be spent on our products.
Ndemo.
On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 4:24 PM, David Otwoma via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:
Michael,
I first met Taifa laptops when we had the ASK Show in 2015. I thought it great then, and seeing this new development I think it is very good. http://www.jkuat.ac.ke/ departments/it/taifa-a3- laptop/ <http://www.jkuat.ac.ke/departments/it/taifa-a3-laptop/>
It reminded me of how I returned to Kenya in 2006 after almost 10 years abroad. The government had just removed duty on PC parts and hence since I was entitled to a 40 foot container with my personal effects I filled it with motherboards, RAMs, HDs and other things not available locally. When it was eventually cleared I got some of my childhood pals we grew together in Eastlands and we would assemble "No Name" tower or desk top and enabled many who could not afford branded i.e. IBM, HP, Dell etc. to still enjoy what a computer can as the hardware of essence is the motherboard, RAM, HD while software those days one could pirate MS without dire consequences.
My bossom buddy got his son admitted to JKUAT and when the boy was sent home for not having a laptop I advised he gets the Taifa as he will pay by installments. Going forward what JKUAT may do is enter into an agreement with some commercial bank(s) who can provide soft loans (now that interest rates are coming down by law) to enable those who wish to pay back in 4 or 5 years to have that facility.
Globally I used to see German made (Siemen Company) desktops and towers sold to students through local arrangements with European banks not only in Germany but in Austria and Switzerland too. That does not stop those who may wish to buy say Apple, Toshiba, HP etc at a premium doing so. The beauty is we have our own, even if forced down out children's' throats, it eventually will bring about the effect I have seen in far of places like Japan, South Korea, USA just to name a few. I remember a friend who had to attended a 6 months training course in Japan was issued a Toshiba laptop and its cost included in the training package. the whole class had more than 20 Africans and it occurred every year since 1997. If JKUAT can borrow that leaf and extend beyong 1st years reporting to civil servants who have to attend some compulsory courses not available at Kenya School of Government it will be great as it would boost usage and outlet of this Taifa laptops. Better still is making a deal with government entities like the Ministries, Parastatals etc and supply us with this laptops. Only last week I was issued with the biannual replacement of my laptop witha HP imported from United Arab Emirates and I am willing to bet half my August salary that it was purchased in excess of kshs. 70,000 while its specs are not so different from the Taifa laptop! Why are we happier creating jobs for technicians (since someone may argue degree holders should not be assembling laptops) abroad while our own youths are jobless. Why do we wish to export our dollars abroad when we could pass the money to our own locally to spend locally, the bigger chunks, eventually?
Finally every-time I visit West African countries I notice they do not wear suits like we do in kenya starting from their President down to the street urchins. They have evolved a sophisticated clothing industry that do not allow 'someone died aka mitumba' industry as we have here.
Let me start counting the minutes to Furahi day.
-- -- David Otwoma, PhD Chief Scientist, National Commission for Science Technology and Innovation (NACOSTI) Utalii House, P.O Box 30623-00100 Nairobi, Kenya Safcom tel: +254 722 141771, Orange tel: +254 (0)20 2346915, email: otwooma@gmail.com & otwoma@uonbi.ac.ke http://www.facebook.com/ profile.php?ref=profile&id= 100000614284149 <http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?ref=profile&id=100000614284149> http://www.nacosti.go.ke & Chairman, Eastern Africa Association for Radiation Protection, http://www.eaarp.org/
On Thu, Aug 25, 2016 at 12:10 PM, Musya Michael via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke > wrote:
Anyone using this laptop? Experiences so far?
http://www.the-star.co.ke/news /2016/08/22/parents-protest- jkuats-imposition-of-taifa- laptops-on-students_c1407693 <http://www.the-star.co.ke/news/2016/08/22/parents-protest-jkuats-imposition-of-taifa-laptops-on-students_c1407693>
-- Regards,
Michael Musya.
I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me. Philippians 4:13
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KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications.
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participants (5)
-
arebacollins -
Barrack Otieno -
Bitange Ndemo -
Lawrence Njogu -
Sam Oduor