testing. walu. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Walu, I think in my view the Internet study clearly showed that the market structure promoted by CCK has not worked! Why are many ISPs building their own infrastructure through either PDNOs or IBGOs? The study clearly showed that there is no TRUST!! In the Internet market. What do I mean? The Market structure is clear ISPs do not build infrastructure, they buy from licensed infrastructure providers. This would eliminate the need for building multiple networks and ensure we are more dispersed in the country. This is not been the case, we now have about 8 IBGO's in Nairobi and and two operating out of Nairobi why? Trust me if all ISPs were buying capacity through two providers the price would be significantly lower. But since there are all these competing gateway operators the country does not get the necessary economies of scale. That is on the international part ... The local loop, we have approximately 7 operating PDNOs in Nairobi and they too are competing for the same clients in the same space instead of utilising the economies of scale!! Where are they in the rural areas ... My view is the regulator did not do enough to ensure the market structure was fully followed and therefore some people took advantage today there is NO TRUST! in the internet market and most ISPs have opted to build their own networks. I personally believe with a good competition framework and regulation we could begin to see some TRUST between operators and service providers and we could solve this Internet problem once and for all. Further to this, the consumers and the service providers too are going to be the next fighters if the lack of a competitive framework continues. TRUST!!! Again will be lost (if not already). We lost an opportunity and I think and know the problem is TRUST!! How do we build the trust? Is it already too late to do so? -- Joseph Mucheru mucheru@wananchi.com
From: John Walubengo <jwalu@yahoo.com> Reply-To: Kenya ICT Action Network - KICTANet <kictanet@kictanet.or.ke> Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 23:26:27 -0700 (PDT) To: <mucheru@wananchi.com> Subject: [kictanet] Week 1 Online Discussion Summaries- CCK Internet Report
Hi all,
I went off-air for a while - actually I travelled upcountry to my parents home in Bungoma -its a remote town from NRB(450Km away) but the 2nd largest town in Western Province and yes, Internet access in those parts of the world is quite a challenge. But that's a story for another day...
Today, I thought it would be nice to reflect on last weeks contributions before we move into the this final week's discussion. Tomorrow we start on the theme 'The Statistics on Affordability', but below I have put together what I think was last weeks summary contribution and hope you can go through it and raise final (if any) comments on last weeks themes. These were International Bandwidth, Heirarchy of Providers(ISP/IGO) and the Statistics on Infrastructure.
---Last weeks summary begin----- Week 1 Summary.
Day 1:Background Concepts/Overview
Mr. J. Walubengo gave an overview of the Internet Study report saying that it aimed to establish the status of Internet Infrastructure, Internet Affordability and Internet Use & Dispersion in Kenya. He reported that the study had various recommendations aimed at improving on the above internet indicators. This included amongst others; getting the government intervention in extending the domestic internet infrastructure, introducing further competition both within the Fixed Line and Mobile subsectors, utilizing the Universal access fund to extend Internet reach, promoting creation and use of local content as well as supporting Consumer Awareness initiatives.
Mr. A. Gakuru lauded the study as well as its recommendations but noted that a similar study would be required that focused on the demand-side rather than the Supply-side of the internet market. He was glad that the Regulator was finally making deliberate efforts to support consumer awareness initiatives. He wondered if naming and shaming those ISPs that failed to route traffic through the local internet exchange point (KIXP) would help in enhancing the use of KIXP.
Day 2: International & Domestic Bandwidth Usage
In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo said that the report indicated that the International Internet Traffic was skewed (90%) towards external sources (content). Kenya was a net importer of Internet content and was therefore a consumer rather than a creator of Internet content. Value (economic or otherwise) goes to the creators of Internet Content and Kenya should aim to be a generator rather than just consumers of Internet Content.
Mr. M. Michuki observed that most Kenyans visited external sources due to lack of local content. He suggested that ISPs should come up with pricing smodels that encouraged the creation of and access to local content. For example, geo-specific tariffs could be designed that would deliberately make it cheaper to access local (.KE) conent i.e. users could be charged less if and when they accessed or used local services(local websites, emails, etc) as opposed to foreign services. In addition, ISPs could come up with time-based tariffs that took advantage of the traffic models registered on the KIXP i.e. provide even lower rates for local content during evenings and weekends.He however conceded that Online Government Services, eHealth, eBanking, eLearning, etc would have to be in place in order to make such pricing models successful. Mr. J. Ngunjiri added that training or capacity building initiatives must also be supported to further gaurantee the success of the initiative.
Day 3: Hierarchy of Internet Service Providers (IGO,ISP)
The Internet Study Report recommended that the seperation between Internet Gateway Operators (IGO) and Internet Service Providers be dissolved with expected results being cheaper and higher quality services. In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo asked members to react to this recommendation.
Lucy Kimani wondered if IGO would be able to cope with the technical and administrative overheads experienced by ISPs such as a larger number of customer accounts, increased need for support services, etc. She added that the cost of services may not come necessarily come down as expected due to the need to cover such overheads. Mr. Walubengo cited the case of TKL (Telkom Kenya) who are currently operating at both the Gateway and the ISP level without significant cost reductions in their Internet Service.
Mr. S. Buruchara felt that historically, ISPs have had a rough time in trying to set up their own Internet Gateway Operations - having been forced by regulation to route their traffic through expensive and monopolistic Internet Gateways. He argued that if the upstream providers (IGO) were expensive, it was only natural that these costs would be passed downstream to the consumers. In addition, he noted that even todate the Licensing requirements were still prohibitive (expensive) for ISPs to move into the IGO level and if they did, they may need to recoup their (Licensing & other) investments at the expense of offering cheaper Internet Access rates. Mr. Kai Wulff commented that giving ISPs the IGO facilities may not necessarily reduce prices, citing case of Uganda where internet costs are still high despite many ISPs having IGO facilities.
Day 4: Statistics on Infrastructure
The report indicated that ISPs (internet services) were only operating in 30% of the districts in Kenya. The leased line services were mainly concentrated in urban centers (NRB & MSA) meaning that Internet Infrastructure was clearly challenged and the Report urges Government to intervene by leading the build-up of Internet/Network infrastructure accross the country.
In her reaction, Alice Munyua, said that a comprehensive, multi-pronged approach must be made to avoid having infrastructure that would eventually serve no purpose. Aggressive infrastructure build up without content would be an exercise in futility since the internet pipes would be idle and underutilised most of the time. She added that additional initiatives such as Construction and Supply of Electrical Power, Literacy Initiatives, Local Content and 'Demand-side' Internet Requirements must move side by side with the infrastructure roll-out.
Day 5- Statistics on Affordability will be on tomorrow (thrs 3rd May) morning. Today is open for final comments on the Day 1, 2, 3 & 4 Themes.
walu.
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Mucheru, A while back ISPs demanded licensing of several IGBOs to compete with Telkom resulting in the current scenario >> they cannot shift the blame to the regulator. Inter-providers mistrust resulting in redundancy of a multitude of infrastructure is good for the consumer because that increases items in the basket of choices. I always thought "competitive advantage" was the name of the game hence now so many (local and international) fibres "competing" to compete Kenyans? Government can only "encourage" not force sharing nor "trust" among operators:- -- National ICT Policy : 3.3.1 Information Technology Infrastructure " The Government will encourage the sharing..." 5.17 NETWORK SECURITY AND RELIABILITY Regulations will therefore be developed to ensure that such infrastructure and networks are robust and resilient and have adequate security, redundancy and backup arrangements..." --- On their network, Vodafone and Orange do not want cheap internet innovation lowers internet cost and increases consumer choice particularly VoIP 30 million+ consumers are affected. Vodafone to be Sued for VoIP Blocking? <http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,131425/article.html> Way Forward: Just let them providers comfortable in the city be. When they realise how profitable rural connectivity can be, they will either follow suite or their businesses will undergo the usual ecosystem consequences. 9.6 ROLE OF CONSUMERS AND USERS Consumers and users will be expected to participate in ensuring: a) Universal access and affordability of ICT services; b) Quality of services is maintained; and c) Continued review of Government policy in accordance with technological and consumer trends. Alex (with ICAK hat on) mucheru@wananchi.com wrote: Walu, I think in my view the Internet study clearly showed that the market structure promoted by CCK has not worked! Why are many ISPs building their own infrastructure through either PDNOs or IBGOs? The study clearly showed that there is no TRUST!! In the Internet market. What do I mean? The Market structure is clear ISPs do not build infrastructure, they buy from licensed infrastructure providers. This would eliminate the need for building multiple networks and ensure we are more dispersed in the country. This is not been the case, we now have about 8 IBGO's in Nairobi and and two operating out of Nairobi why? Trust me if all ISPs were buying capacity through two providers the price would be significantly lower. But since there are all these competing gateway operators the country does not get the necessary economies of scale. That is on the international part ... The local loop, we have approximately 7 operating PDNOs in Nairobi and they too are competing for the same clients in the same space instead of utilising the economies of scale!! Where are they in the rural areas ... My view is the regulator did not do enough to ensure the market structure was fully followed and therefore some people took advantage today there is NO TRUST! in the internet market and most ISPs have opted to build their own networks. I personally believe with a good competition framework and regulation we could begin to see some TRUST between operators and service providers and we could solve this Internet problem once and for all. Further to this, the consumers and the service providers too are going to be the next fighters if the lack of a competitive framework continues. TRUST!!! Again will be lost (if not already). We lost an opportunity and I think and know the problem is TRUST!! How do we build the trust? Is it already too late to do so? -- Joseph Mucheru mucheru@wananchi.com
From: John Walubengo Reply-To: Kenya ICT Action Network - KICTANet Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 23:26:27 -0700 (PDT) To: Subject: [kictanet] Week 1 Online Discussion Summaries- CCK Internet Report
Hi all,
I went off-air for a while - actually I travelled upcountry to my parents home in Bungoma -its a remote town from NRB(450Km away) but the 2nd largest town in Western Province and yes, Internet access in those parts of the world is quite a challenge. But that's a story for another day...
Today, I thought it would be nice to reflect on last weeks contributions before we move into the this final week's discussion. Tomorrow we start on the theme 'The Statistics on Affordability', but below I have put together what I think was last weeks summary contribution and hope you can go through it and raise final (if any) comments on last weeks themes. These were International Bandwidth, Heirarchy of Providers(ISP/IGO) and the Statistics on Infrastructure.
---Last weeks summary begin----- Week 1 Summary.
Day 1:Background Concepts/Overview
Mr. J. Walubengo gave an overview of the Internet Study report saying that it aimed to establish the status of Internet Infrastructure, Internet Affordability and Internet Use & Dispersion in Kenya. He reported that the study had various recommendations aimed at improving on the above internet indicators. This included amongst others; getting the government intervention in extending the domestic internet infrastructure, introducing further competition both within the Fixed Line and Mobile subsectors, utilizing the Universal access fund to extend Internet reach, promoting creation and use of local content as well as supporting Consumer Awareness initiatives.
Mr. A. Gakuru lauded the study as well as its recommendations but noted that a similar study would be required that focused on the demand-side rather than the Supply-side of the internet market. He was glad that the Regulator was finally making deliberate efforts to support consumer awareness initiatives. He wondered if naming and shaming those ISPs that failed to route traffic through the local internet exchange point (KIXP) would help in enhancing the use of KIXP.
Day 2: International & Domestic Bandwidth Usage
In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo said that the report indicated that the International Internet Traffic was skewed (90%) towards external sources (content). Kenya was a net importer of Internet content and was therefore a consumer rather than a creator of Internet content. Value (economic or otherwise) goes to the creators of Internet Content and Kenya should aim to be a generator rather than just consumers of Internet Content.
Mr. M. Michuki observed that most Kenyans visited external sources due to lack of local content. He suggested that ISPs should come up with pricing smodels that encouraged the creation of and access to local content. For example, geo-specific tariffs could be designed that would deliberately make it cheaper to access local (.KE) conent i.e. users could be charged less if and when they accessed or used local services(local websites, emails, etc) as opposed to foreign services. In addition, ISPs could come up with time-based tariffs that took advantage of the traffic models registered on the KIXP i.e. provide even lower rates for local content during evenings and weekends.He however conceded that Online Government Services, eHealth, eBanking, eLearning, etc would have to be in place in order to make such pricing models successful. Mr. J. Ngunjiri added that training or capacity building initiatives must also be supported to further gaurantee the success of the initiative.
Day 3: Hierarchy of Internet Service Providers (IGO,ISP)
The Internet Study Report recommended that the seperation between Internet Gateway Operators (IGO) and Internet Service Providers be dissolved with expected results being cheaper and higher quality services. In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo asked members to react to this recommendation.
Lucy Kimani wondered if IGO would be able to cope with the technical and administrative overheads experienced by ISPs such as a larger number of customer accounts, increased need for support services, etc. She added that the cost of services may not come necessarily come down as expected due to the need to cover such overheads. Mr. Walubengo cited the case of TKL (Telkom Kenya) who are currently operating at both the Gateway and the ISP level without significant cost reductions in their Internet Service.
Mr. S. Buruchara felt that historically, ISPs have had a rough time in trying to set up their own Internet Gateway Operations - having been forced by regulation to route their traffic through expensive and monopolistic Internet Gateways. He argued that if the upstream providers (IGO) were expensive, it was only natural that these costs would be passed downstream to the consumers. In addition, he noted that even todate the Licensing requirements were still prohibitive (expensive) for ISPs to move into the IGO level and if they did, they may need to recoup their (Licensing & other) investments at the expense of offering cheaper Internet Access rates. Mr. Kai Wulff commented that giving ISPs the IGO facilities may not necessarily reduce prices, citing case of Uganda where internet costs are still high despite many ISPs having IGO facilities.
Day 4: Statistics on Infrastructure
The report indicated that ISPs (internet services) were only operating in 30% of the districts in Kenya. The leased line services were mainly concentrated in urban centers (NRB & MSA) meaning that Internet Infrastructure was clearly challenged and the Report urges Government to intervene by leading the build-up of Internet/Network infrastructure accross the country.
In her reaction, Alice Munyua, said that a comprehensive, multi-pronged approach must be made to avoid having infrastructure that would eventually serve no purpose. Aggressive infrastructure build up without content would be an exercise in futility since the internet pipes would be idle and underutilised most of the time. She added that additional initiatives such as Construction and Supply of Electrical Power, Literacy Initiatives, Local Content and 'Demand-side' Internet Requirements must move side by side with the infrastructure roll-out.
Day 5- Statistics on Affordability will be on tomorrow (thrs 3rd May) morning. Today is open for final comments on the Day 1, 2, 3 & 4 Themes.
walu.
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Alex, If you read carefully, I did not say there should be no competition, I was responding to the low rural penetration and sustained high prices. Of course competition means most providers operate in more profitable urban centres and each fights for the same market share while prices and geographical reach suffer. There is a clear market structure for an economy like ours. Currently it is not working! ISPs too should have embraced joint purchasing to get economies of scale ... i could go on.
Mucheru,
A while back ISPs demanded licensing of several IGBOs to compete with Telkom resulting in the current scenario >> they cannot shift the blame to the regulator.
Inter-providers mistrust resulting in redundancy of a multitude of infrastructure is good for the consumer because that increases items in the basket of choices.
I always thought "competitive advantage" was the name of the game hence now so many (local and international) fibres "competing" to compete Kenyans?
Government can only "encourage" not force sharing nor "trust" among operators:- -- National ICT Policy :
3.3.1 Information Technology Infrastructure " The Government will encourage the sharing..."
5.17 NETWORK SECURITY AND RELIABILITY Regulations will therefore be developed to ensure that such infrastructure and networks are robust and resilient and have adequate security, redundancy and backup arrangements..." ---
On their network, Vodafone and Orange do not want cheap internet innovation lowers internet cost and increases consumer choice particularly VoIP 30 million+ consumers are affected. Vodafone to be Sued for VoIP Blocking? <http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,131425/article.html>
Way Forward: Just let them providers comfortable in the city be. When they realise how profitable rural connectivity can be, they will either follow suite or their businesses will undergo the usual ecosystem consequences.
9.6 ROLE OF CONSUMERS AND USERS
Consumers and users will be expected to participate in ensuring:
a) Universal access and affordability of ICT services; b) Quality of services is maintained; and c) Continued review of Government policy in accordance with technological and consumer trends.
Alex (with ICAK hat on)
mucheru@wananchi.com wrote: Walu,
I think in my view the Internet study clearly showed that the market structure promoted by CCK has not worked! Why are many ISPs building their own infrastructure through either PDNOs or IBGOs? The study clearly showed that there is no TRUST!! In the Internet market. What do I mean?
The Market structure is clear ISPs do not build infrastructure, they buy from licensed infrastructure providers. This would eliminate the need for building multiple networks and ensure we are more dispersed in the country. This is not been the case, we now have about 8 IBGO's in Nairobi and and two operating out of Nairobi why? Trust me if all ISPs were buying capacity through two providers the price would be significantly lower. But since there are all these competing gateway operators the country does not get the necessary economies of scale. That is on the international part ...
The local loop, we have approximately 7 operating PDNOs in Nairobi and they too are competing for the same clients in the same space instead of utilising the economies of scale!! Where are they in the rural areas ...
My view is the regulator did not do enough to ensure the market structure was fully followed and therefore some people took advantage today there is NO TRUST! in the internet market and most ISPs have opted to build their own networks.
I personally believe with a good competition framework and regulation we could begin to see some TRUST between operators and service providers and we could solve this Internet problem once and for all.
Further to this, the consumers and the service providers too are going to be the next fighters if the lack of a competitive framework continues. TRUST!!! Again will be lost (if not already).
We lost an opportunity and I think and know the problem is TRUST!! How do we build the trust? Is it already too late to do so?
-- Joseph Mucheru mucheru@wananchi.com
From: John Walubengo Reply-To: Kenya ICT Action Network - KICTANet Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 23:26:27 -0700 (PDT) To: Subject: [kictanet] Week 1 Online Discussion Summaries- CCK Internet Report
Hi all,
I went off-air for a while - actually I travelled upcountry to my parents home in Bungoma -its a remote town from NRB(450Km away) but the 2nd largest town in Western Province and yes, Internet access in those parts of the world is quite a challenge. But that's a story for another day...
Today, I thought it would be nice to reflect on last weeks contributions before we move into the this final week's discussion. Tomorrow we start on the theme 'The Statistics on Affordability', but below I have put together what I think was last weeks summary contribution and hope you can go through it and raise final (if any) comments on last weeks themes. These were International Bandwidth, Heirarchy of Providers(ISP/IGO) and the Statistics on Infrastructure.
---Last weeks summary begin----- Week 1 Summary.
Day 1:Background Concepts/Overview
Mr. J. Walubengo gave an overview of the Internet Study report saying that it aimed to establish the status of Internet Infrastructure, Internet Affordability and Internet Use & Dispersion in Kenya. He reported that the study had various recommendations aimed at improving on the above internet indicators. This included amongst others; getting the government intervention in extending the domestic internet infrastructure, introducing further competition both within the Fixed Line and Mobile subsectors, utilizing the Universal access fund to extend Internet reach, promoting creation and use of local content as well as supporting Consumer Awareness initiatives.
Mr. A. Gakuru lauded the study as well as its recommendations but noted that a similar study would be required that focused on the demand-side rather than the Supply-side of the internet market. He was glad that the Regulator was finally making deliberate efforts to support consumer awareness initiatives. He wondered if naming and shaming those ISPs that failed to route traffic through the local internet exchange point (KIXP) would help in enhancing the use of KIXP.
Day 2: International & Domestic Bandwidth Usage
In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo said that the report indicated that the International Internet Traffic was skewed (90%) towards external sources (content). Kenya was a net importer of Internet content and was therefore a consumer rather than a creator of Internet content. Value (economic or otherwise) goes to the creators of Internet Content and Kenya should aim to be a generator rather than just consumers of Internet Content.
Mr. M. Michuki observed that most Kenyans visited external sources due to lack of local content. He suggested that ISPs should come up with pricing smodels that encouraged the creation of and access to local content. For example, geo-specific tariffs could be designed that would deliberately make it cheaper to access local (.KE) conent i.e. users could be charged less if and when they accessed or used local services(local websites, emails, etc) as opposed to foreign services. In addition, ISPs could come up with time-based tariffs that took advantage of the traffic models registered on the KIXP i.e. provide even lower rates for local content during evenings and weekends.He however conceded that Online Government Services, eHealth, eBanking, eLearning, etc would have to be in place in order to make such pricing models successful. Mr. J. Ngunjiri added that training or capacity building initiatives must also be supported to further gaurantee the success of the initiative.
Day 3: Hierarchy of Internet Service Providers (IGO,ISP)
The Internet Study Report recommended that the seperation between Internet Gateway Operators (IGO) and Internet Service Providers be dissolved with expected results being cheaper and higher quality services. In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo asked members to react to this recommendation.
Lucy Kimani wondered if IGO would be able to cope with the technical and administrative overheads experienced by ISPs such as a larger number of customer accounts, increased need for support services, etc. She added that the cost of services may not come necessarily come down as expected due to the need to cover such overheads. Mr. Walubengo cited the case of TKL (Telkom Kenya) who are currently operating at both the Gateway and the ISP level without significant cost reductions in their Internet Service.
Mr. S. Buruchara felt that historically, ISPs have had a rough time in trying to set up their own Internet Gateway Operations - having been forced by regulation to route their traffic through expensive and monopolistic Internet Gateways. He argued that if the upstream providers (IGO) were expensive, it was only natural that these costs would be passed downstream to the consumers. In addition, he noted that even todate the Licensing requirements were still prohibitive (expensive) for ISPs to move into the IGO level and if they did, they may need to recoup their (Licensing & other) investments at the expense of offering cheaper Internet Access rates. Mr. Kai Wulff commented that giving ISPs the IGO facilities may not necessarily reduce prices, citing case of Uganda where internet costs are still high despite many ISPs having IGO facilities.
Day 4: Statistics on Infrastructure
The report indicated that ISPs (internet services) were only operating in 30% of the districts in Kenya. The leased line services were mainly concentrated in urban centers (NRB & MSA) meaning that Internet Infrastructure was clearly challenged and the Report urges Government to intervene by leading the build-up of Internet/Network infrastructure accross the country.
In her reaction, Alice Munyua, said that a comprehensive, multi-pronged approach must be made to avoid having infrastructure that would eventually serve no purpose. Aggressive infrastructure build up without content would be an exercise in futility since the internet pipes would be idle and underutilised most of the time. She added that additional initiatives such as Construction and Supply of Electrical Power, Literacy Initiatives, Local Content and 'Demand-side' Internet Requirements must move side by side with the infrastructure roll-out.
Day 5- Statistics on Affordability will be on tomorrow (thrs 3rd May) morning. Today is open for final comments on the Day 1, 2, 3 & 4 Themes.
walu.
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Mucheru, you know my position: KDN has never done the ISP part and we stayed clean with the IBGO and PDNO license serving 30+ ISPs. We are covering 68 towns and cities with Wimax (as far as Loki, Mara, Kakamega, Meru ..) and this was ONLY possible because the ISPs trusted us and used us. The main reason for the ISPs to run to infrastructure is an attitude that is still prevailing after having a raw deal with a monopoly a long time and the fact that from the face value the "black sheep" who were bundling services are doing fine. We will stick to the separation of infrastructure and services as long as we can, the question is, how long this is possible in the light of EVERYBODY SEEMINGLY BEING ALLOWED TO DO EVERYTHING. Rgds Kai ----- Original Message ----- From: <mucheru@wananchi.com> To: <kai.wulff@kdn.co.ke> Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2007 23:20 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Week 1 Online Discussion Summaries- CCK Internet Report
Walu,
I think in my view the Internet study clearly showed that the market structure promoted by CCK has not worked! Why are many ISPs building their own infrastructure through either PDNOs or IBGOs? The study clearly showed that there is no TRUST!! In the Internet market. What do I mean?
The Market structure is clear ISPs do not build infrastructure, they buy from licensed infrastructure providers. This would eliminate the need for building multiple networks and ensure we are more dispersed in the country. This is not been the case, we now have about 8 IBGO's in Nairobi and and two operating out of Nairobi why? Trust me if all ISPs were buying capacity through two providers the price would be significantly lower. But since there are all these competing gateway operators the country does not get the necessary economies of scale. That is on the international part ...
The local loop, we have approximately 7 operating PDNOs in Nairobi and they too are competing for the same clients in the same space instead of utilising the economies of scale!! Where are they in the rural areas ...
My view is the regulator did not do enough to ensure the market structure was fully followed and therefore some people took advantage today there is NO TRUST! in the internet market and most ISPs have opted to build their own networks.
I personally believe with a good competition framework and regulation we could begin to see some TRUST between operators and service providers and we could solve this Internet problem once and for all.
Further to this, the consumers and the service providers too are going to be the next fighters if the lack of a competitive framework continues. TRUST!!! Again will be lost (if not already).
We lost an opportunity and I think and know the problem is TRUST!! How do we build the trust? Is it already too late to do so?
-- Joseph Mucheru mucheru@wananchi.com
From: John Walubengo <jwalu@yahoo.com> Reply-To: Kenya ICT Action Network - KICTANet <kictanet@kictanet.or.ke> Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 23:26:27 -0700 (PDT) To: <mucheru@wananchi.com> Subject: [kictanet] Week 1 Online Discussion Summaries- CCK Internet Report
Hi all,
I went off-air for a while - actually I travelled upcountry to my parents home in Bungoma -its a remote town from NRB(450Km away) but the 2nd largest town in Western Province and yes, Internet access in those parts of the world is quite a challenge. But that's a story for another day...
Today, I thought it would be nice to reflect on last weeks contributions before we move into the this final week's discussion. Tomorrow we start on the theme 'The Statistics on Affordability', but below I have put together what I think was last weeks summary contribution and hope you can go through it and raise final (if any) comments on last weeks themes. These were International Bandwidth, Heirarchy of Providers(ISP/IGO) and the Statistics on Infrastructure.
---Last weeks summary begin----- Week 1 Summary.
Day 1:Background Concepts/Overview
Mr. J. Walubengo gave an overview of the Internet Study report saying that it aimed to establish the status of Internet Infrastructure, Internet Affordability and Internet Use & Dispersion in Kenya. He reported that the study had various recommendations aimed at improving on the above internet indicators. This included amongst others; getting the government intervention in extending the domestic internet infrastructure, introducing further competition both within the Fixed Line and Mobile subsectors, utilizing the Universal access fund to extend Internet reach, promoting creation and use of local content as well as supporting Consumer Awareness initiatives.
Mr. A. Gakuru lauded the study as well as its recommendations but noted that a similar study would be required that focused on the demand-side rather than the Supply-side of the internet market. He was glad that the Regulator was finally making deliberate efforts to support consumer awareness initiatives. He wondered if naming and shaming those ISPs that failed to route traffic through the local internet exchange point (KIXP) would help in enhancing the use of KIXP.
Day 2: International & Domestic Bandwidth Usage
In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo said that the report indicated that the International Internet Traffic was skewed (90%) towards external sources (content). Kenya was a net importer of Internet content and was therefore a consumer rather than a creator of Internet content. Value (economic or otherwise) goes to the creators of Internet Content and Kenya should aim to be a generator rather than just consumers of Internet Content.
Mr. M. Michuki observed that most Kenyans visited external sources due to lack of local content. He suggested that ISPs should come up with pricing smodels that encouraged the creation of and access to local content. For example, geo-specific tariffs could be designed that would deliberately make it cheaper to access local (.KE) conent i.e. users could be charged less if and when they accessed or used local services(local websites, emails, etc) as opposed to foreign services. In addition, ISPs could come up with time-based tariffs that took advantage of the traffic models registered on the KIXP i.e. provide even lower rates for local content during evenings and weekends.He however conceded that Online Government Services, eHealth, eBanking, eLearning, etc would have to be in place in order to make such pricing models successful. Mr. J. Ngunjiri added that training or capacity building initiatives must also be supported to further gaurantee the success of the initiative.
Day 3: Hierarchy of Internet Service Providers (IGO,ISP)
The Internet Study Report recommended that the seperation between Internet Gateway Operators (IGO) and Internet Service Providers be dissolved with expected results being cheaper and higher quality services. In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo asked members to react to this recommendation.
Lucy Kimani wondered if IGO would be able to cope with the technical and administrative overheads experienced by ISPs such as a larger number of customer accounts, increased need for support services, etc. She added that the cost of services may not come necessarily come down as expected due to the need to cover such overheads. Mr. Walubengo cited the case of TKL (Telkom Kenya) who are currently operating at both the Gateway and the ISP level without significant cost reductions in their Internet Service.
Mr. S. Buruchara felt that historically, ISPs have had a rough time in trying to set up their own Internet Gateway Operations - having been forced by regulation to route their traffic through expensive and monopolistic Internet Gateways. He argued that if the upstream providers (IGO) were expensive, it was only natural that these costs would be passed downstream to the consumers. In addition, he noted that even todate the Licensing requirements were still prohibitive (expensive) for ISPs to move into the IGO level and if they did, they may need to recoup their (Licensing & other) investments at the expense of offering cheaper Internet Access rates. Mr. Kai Wulff commented that giving ISPs the IGO facilities may not necessarily reduce prices, citing case of Uganda where internet costs are still high despite many ISPs having IGO facilities.
Day 4: Statistics on Infrastructure
The report indicated that ISPs (internet services) were only operating in 30% of the districts in Kenya. The leased line services were mainly concentrated in urban centers (NRB & MSA) meaning that Internet Infrastructure was clearly challenged and the Report urges Government to intervene by leading the build-up of Internet/Network infrastructure accross the country.
In her reaction, Alice Munyua, said that a comprehensive, multi-pronged approach must be made to avoid having infrastructure that would eventually serve no purpose. Aggressive infrastructure build up without content would be an exercise in futility since the internet pipes would be idle and underutilised most of the time. She added that additional initiatives such as Construction and Supply of Electrical Power, Literacy Initiatives, Local Content and 'Demand-side' Internet Requirements must move side by side with the infrastructure roll-out.
Day 5- Statistics on Affordability will be on tomorrow (thrs 3rd May) morning. Today is open for final comments on the Day 1, 2, 3 & 4 Themes.
walu.
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On 3 May 2007, at 06:54, Kai Wulff wrote:
We will stick to the separation of infrastructure and services as long as we can, the question is, how long this is possible in the light of EVERYBODY SEEMINGLY BEING ALLOWED TO DO EVERYTHING.
I would say this again, it is important for the regulatory policy in Kenya (and anywhere else for that matter) to be clear on either Open Access or Unified Licensing and not both. In Open Access, you differentiate Infrastructure from Services and license operators to compete in those layers without anyone having an "overlap" advantage. This is the Horizontal framework. The Unified Licensing regime has no distinction and all the operators are licensed to build infrastructure and provide services as a single unit with "overlaps. This is Vertical framework. The danger in allowing everybody to do everything is; 1. enumorse duplication of investment in the highend of the market which gets so choked that the investment is wasted to the detriment of no infrastructure and or service to the other elements of the market. 2. creates monopoly combines which exert their forces on the market and can exhibit other tendencies like "cartel moves" 3. lack of SME uptake which is anti-economy development and innovation 4. i can list more but even the WorldBank Group has seen "the fortune at the bottom of the pyramid" so together with the World Resource Institute they recently launched the next 4 billion market and this is the developing world market which requires in my view the Open Access Model to deliver telecom services and empower that market. Eric here
----- Original Message ----- From: <mucheru@wananchi.com> To: <kai.wulff@kdn.co.ke> Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2007 23:20 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Week 1 Online Discussion Summaries- CCK Internet Report
Walu,
I think in my view the Internet study clearly showed that the market structure promoted by CCK has not worked! Why are many ISPs building their own infrastructure through either PDNOs or IBGOs? The study clearly showed that there is no TRUST!! In the Internet market. What do I mean?
The Market structure is clear ISPs do not build infrastructure, they buy from licensed infrastructure providers. This would eliminate the need for building multiple networks and ensure we are more dispersed in the country. This is not been the case, we now have about 8 IBGO's in Nairobi and and two operating out of Nairobi why? Trust me if all ISPs were buying capacity through two providers the price would be significantly lower. But since there are all these competing gateway operators the country does not get the necessary economies of scale. That is on the international part ...
The local loop, we have approximately 7 operating PDNOs in Nairobi and they too are competing for the same clients in the same space instead of utilising the economies of scale!! Where are they in the rural areas ...
My view is the regulator did not do enough to ensure the market structure was fully followed and therefore some people took advantage today there is NO TRUST! in the internet market and most ISPs have opted to build their own networks.
I personally believe with a good competition framework and regulation we could begin to see some TRUST between operators and service providers and we could solve this Internet problem once and for all.
Further to this, the consumers and the service providers too are going to be the next fighters if the lack of a competitive framework continues. TRUST!!! Again will be lost (if not already).
We lost an opportunity and I think and know the problem is TRUST!! How do we build the trust? Is it already too late to do so?
-- Joseph Mucheru mucheru@wananchi.com
From: John Walubengo <jwalu@yahoo.com> Reply-To: Kenya ICT Action Network - KICTANet <kictanet@kictanet.or.ke> Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 23:26:27 -0700 (PDT) To: <mucheru@wananchi.com> Subject: [kictanet] Week 1 Online Discussion Summaries- CCK Internet Report
Hi all,
I went off-air for a while - actually I travelled upcountry to my parents home in Bungoma -its a remote town from NRB(450Km away) but the 2nd largest town in Western Province and yes, Internet access in those parts of the world is quite a challenge. But that's a story for another day...
Today, I thought it would be nice to reflect on last weeks contributions before we move into the this final week's discussion. Tomorrow we start on the theme 'The Statistics on Affordability', but below I have put together what I think was last weeks summary contribution and hope you can go through it and raise final (if any) comments on last weeks themes. These were International Bandwidth, Heirarchy of Providers(ISP/IGO) and the Statistics on Infrastructure.
---Last weeks summary begin----- Week 1 Summary.
Day 1:Background Concepts/Overview
Mr. J. Walubengo gave an overview of the Internet Study report saying that it aimed to establish the status of Internet Infrastructure, Internet Affordability and Internet Use & Dispersion in Kenya. He reported that the study had various recommendations aimed at improving on the above internet indicators. This included amongst others; getting the government intervention in extending the domestic internet infrastructure, introducing further competition both within the Fixed Line and Mobile subsectors, utilizing the Universal access fund to extend Internet reach, promoting creation and use of local content as well as supporting Consumer Awareness initiatives.
Mr. A. Gakuru lauded the study as well as its recommendations but noted that a similar study would be required that focused on the demand-side rather than the Supply-side of the internet market. He was glad that the Regulator was finally making deliberate efforts to support consumer awareness initiatives. He wondered if naming and shaming those ISPs that failed to route traffic through the local internet exchange point (KIXP) would help in enhancing the use of KIXP.
Day 2: International & Domestic Bandwidth Usage
In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo said that the report indicated that the International Internet Traffic was skewed (90%) towards external sources (content). Kenya was a net importer of Internet content and was therefore a consumer rather than a creator of Internet content. Value (economic or otherwise) goes to the creators of Internet Content and Kenya should aim to be a generator rather than just consumers of Internet Content.
Mr. M. Michuki observed that most Kenyans visited external sources due to lack of local content. He suggested that ISPs should come up with pricing smodels that encouraged the creation of and access to local content. For example, geo-specific tariffs could be designed that would deliberately make it cheaper to access local (.KE) conent i.e. users could be charged less if and when they accessed or used local services(local websites, emails, etc) as opposed to foreign services. In addition, ISPs could come up with time-based tariffs that took advantage of the traffic models registered on the KIXP i.e. provide even lower rates for local content during evenings and weekends.He however conceded that Online Government Services, eHealth, eBanking, eLearning, etc would have to be in place in order to make such pricing models successful. Mr. J. Ngunjiri added that training or capacity building initiatives must also be supported to further gaurantee the success of the initiative.
Day 3: Hierarchy of Internet Service Providers (IGO,ISP)
The Internet Study Report recommended that the seperation between Internet Gateway Operators (IGO) and Internet Service Providers be dissolved with expected results being cheaper and higher quality services. In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo asked members to react to this recommendation.
Lucy Kimani wondered if IGO would be able to cope with the technical and administrative overheads experienced by ISPs such as a larger number of customer accounts, increased need for support services, etc. She added that the cost of services may not come necessarily come down as expected due to the need to cover such overheads. Mr. Walubengo cited the case of TKL (Telkom Kenya) who are currently operating at both the Gateway and the ISP level without significant cost reductions in their Internet Service.
Mr. S. Buruchara felt that historically, ISPs have had a rough time in trying to set up their own Internet Gateway Operations - having been forced by regulation to route their traffic through expensive and monopolistic Internet Gateways. He argued that if the upstream providers (IGO) were expensive, it was only natural that these costs would be passed downstream to the consumers. In addition, he noted that even todate the Licensing requirements were still prohibitive (expensive) for ISPs to move into the IGO level and if they did, they may need to recoup their (Licensing & other) investments at the expense of offering cheaper Internet Access rates. Mr. Kai Wulff commented that giving ISPs the IGO facilities may not necessarily reduce prices, citing case of Uganda where internet costs are still high despite many ISPs having IGO facilities.
Day 4: Statistics on Infrastructure
The report indicated that ISPs (internet services) were only operating in 30% of the districts in Kenya. The leased line services were mainly concentrated in urban centers (NRB & MSA) meaning that Internet Infrastructure was clearly challenged and the Report urges Government to intervene by leading the build-up of Internet/Network infrastructure accross the country.
In her reaction, Alice Munyua, said that a comprehensive, multi-pronged approach must be made to avoid having infrastructure that would eventually serve no purpose. Aggressive infrastructure build up without content would be an exercise in futility since the internet pipes would be idle and underutilised most of the time. She added that additional initiatives such as Construction and Supply of Electrical Power, Literacy Initiatives, Local Content and 'Demand-side' Internet Requirements must move side by side with the infrastructure roll-out.
Day 5- Statistics on Affordability will be on tomorrow (thrs 3rd May) morning. Today is open for final comments on the Day 1, 2, 3 & 4 Themes.
walu.
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Eric M.K Osiakwan Executive Secretary AfrISPA (www.afrispa.org) Tel: + 233.21.258800 ext 2031 Fax: + 233.21.258811 Cell: + 233.244.386792 Handle: eosiakwan Snail Mail: Pmb 208, Accra-North Office: BusyInternet - 42 Ring Road Central, Accra-North Blog: http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/eric/ Slang: "Tomorrow Now"
On 5/3/07, Eric Osiakwan <eric@afrispa.org> wrote:
The danger in allowing everybody to do everything is; 1. enumorse duplication of investment in the highend of the market
????? Nini hii??
True Kai, KDN is an exception not the rule :-) .... I am avoiding an operator debate on who is doing right or wrong. Am sure those in the industry surely understand what am saying.
Mucheru,
you know my position: KDN has never done the ISP part and we stayed clean with the IBGO and PDNO license serving 30+ ISPs. We are covering 68 towns and cities with Wimax (as far as Loki, Mara, Kakamega, Meru ..) and this was ONLY possible because the ISPs trusted us and used us. The main reason for the ISPs to run to infrastructure is an attitude that is still prevailing after having a raw deal with a monopoly a long time and the fact that from the face value the "black sheep" who were bundling services are doing fine.
We will stick to the separation of infrastructure and services as long as we can, the question is, how long this is possible in the light of EVERYBODY SEEMINGLY BEING ALLOWED TO DO EVERYTHING.
Rgds
Kai
----- Original Message ----- From: <mucheru@wananchi.com> To: <kai.wulff@kdn.co.ke> Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2007 23:20 Subject: Re: [kictanet] Week 1 Online Discussion Summaries- CCK Internet Report
Walu,
I think in my view the Internet study clearly showed that the market structure promoted by CCK has not worked! Why are many ISPs building their own infrastructure through either PDNOs or IBGOs? The study clearly showed that there is no TRUST!! In the Internet market. What do I mean?
The Market structure is clear ISPs do not build infrastructure, they buy from licensed infrastructure providers. This would eliminate the need for building multiple networks and ensure we are more dispersed in the country. This is not been the case, we now have about 8 IBGO's in Nairobi and and two operating out of Nairobi why? Trust me if all ISPs were buying capacity through two providers the price would be significantly lower. But since there are all these competing gateway operators the country does not get the necessary economies of scale. That is on the international part ...
The local loop, we have approximately 7 operating PDNOs in Nairobi and they too are competing for the same clients in the same space instead of utilising the economies of scale!! Where are they in the rural areas ...
My view is the regulator did not do enough to ensure the market structure was fully followed and therefore some people took advantage today there is NO TRUST! in the internet market and most ISPs have opted to build their own networks.
I personally believe with a good competition framework and regulation we could begin to see some TRUST between operators and service providers and we could solve this Internet problem once and for all.
Further to this, the consumers and the service providers too are going to be the next fighters if the lack of a competitive framework continues. TRUST!!! Again will be lost (if not already).
We lost an opportunity and I think and know the problem is TRUST!! How do we build the trust? Is it already too late to do so?
-- Joseph Mucheru mucheru@wananchi.com
From: John Walubengo <jwalu@yahoo.com> Reply-To: Kenya ICT Action Network - KICTANet <kictanet@kictanet.or.ke> Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 23:26:27 -0700 (PDT) To: <mucheru@wananchi.com> Subject: [kictanet] Week 1 Online Discussion Summaries- CCK Internet Report
Hi all,
I went off-air for a while - actually I travelled upcountry to my parents home in Bungoma -its a remote town from NRB(450Km away) but the 2nd largest town in Western Province and yes, Internet access in those parts of the world is quite a challenge. But that's a story for another day...
Today, I thought it would be nice to reflect on last weeks contributions before we move into the this final week's discussion. Tomorrow we start on the theme 'The Statistics on Affordability', but below I have put together what I think was last weeks summary contribution and hope you can go through it and raise final (if any) comments on last weeks themes. These were International Bandwidth, Heirarchy of Providers(ISP/IGO) and the Statistics on Infrastructure.
---Last weeks summary begin----- Week 1 Summary.
Day 1:Background Concepts/Overview
Mr. J. Walubengo gave an overview of the Internet Study report saying that it aimed to establish the status of Internet Infrastructure, Internet Affordability and Internet Use & Dispersion in Kenya. He reported that the study had various recommendations aimed at improving on the above internet indicators. This included amongst others; getting the government intervention in extending the domestic internet infrastructure, introducing further competition both within the Fixed Line and Mobile subsectors, utilizing the Universal access fund to extend Internet reach, promoting creation and use of local content as well as supporting Consumer Awareness initiatives.
Mr. A. Gakuru lauded the study as well as its recommendations but noted that a similar study would be required that focused on the demand-side rather than the Supply-side of the internet market. He was glad that the Regulator was finally making deliberate efforts to support consumer awareness initiatives. He wondered if naming and shaming those ISPs that failed to route traffic through the local internet exchange point (KIXP) would help in enhancing the use of KIXP.
Day 2: International & Domestic Bandwidth Usage
In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo said that the report indicated that the International Internet Traffic was skewed (90%) towards external sources (content). Kenya was a net importer of Internet content and was therefore a consumer rather than a creator of Internet content. Value (economic or otherwise) goes to the creators of Internet Content and Kenya should aim to be a generator rather than just consumers of Internet Content.
Mr. M. Michuki observed that most Kenyans visited external sources due to lack of local content. He suggested that ISPs should come up with pricing smodels that encouraged the creation of and access to local content. For example, geo-specific tariffs could be designed that would deliberately make it cheaper to access local (.KE) conent i.e. users could be charged less if and when they accessed or used local services(local websites, emails, etc) as opposed to foreign services. In addition, ISPs could come up with time-based tariffs that took advantage of the traffic models registered on the KIXP i.e. provide even lower rates for local content during evenings and weekends.He however conceded that Online Government Services, eHealth, eBanking, eLearning, etc would have to be in place in order to make such pricing models successful. Mr. J. Ngunjiri added that training or capacity building initiatives must also be supported to further gaurantee the success of the initiative.
Day 3: Hierarchy of Internet Service Providers (IGO,ISP)
The Internet Study Report recommended that the seperation between Internet Gateway Operators (IGO) and Internet Service Providers be dissolved with expected results being cheaper and higher quality services. In his opening remarks, Mr. Walubengo asked members to react to this recommendation.
Lucy Kimani wondered if IGO would be able to cope with the technical and administrative overheads experienced by ISPs such as a larger number of customer accounts, increased need for support services, etc. She added that the cost of services may not come necessarily come down as expected due to the need to cover such overheads. Mr. Walubengo cited the case of TKL (Telkom Kenya) who are currently operating at both the Gateway and the ISP level without significant cost reductions in their Internet Service.
Mr. S. Buruchara felt that historically, ISPs have had a rough time in trying to set up their own Internet Gateway Operations - having been forced by regulation to route their traffic through expensive and monopolistic Internet Gateways. He argued that if the upstream providers (IGO) were expensive, it was only natural that these costs would be passed downstream to the consumers. In addition, he noted that even todate the Licensing requirements were still prohibitive (expensive) for ISPs to move into the IGO level and if they did, they may need to recoup their (Licensing & other) investments at the expense of offering cheaper Internet Access rates. Mr. Kai Wulff commented that giving ISPs the IGO facilities may not necessarily reduce prices, citing case of Uganda where internet costs are still high despite many ISPs having IGO facilities.
Day 4: Statistics on Infrastructure
The report indicated that ISPs (internet services) were only operating in 30% of the districts in Kenya. The leased line services were mainly concentrated in urban centers (NRB & MSA) meaning that Internet Infrastructure was clearly challenged and the Report urges Government to intervene by leading the build-up of Internet/Network infrastructure accross the country.
In her reaction, Alice Munyua, said that a comprehensive, multi-pronged approach must be made to avoid having infrastructure that would eventually serve no purpose. Aggressive infrastructure build up without content would be an exercise in futility since the internet pipes would be idle and underutilised most of the time. She added that additional initiatives such as Construction and Supply of Electrical Power, Literacy Initiatives, Local Content and 'Demand-side' Internet Requirements must move side by side with the infrastructure roll-out.
Day 5- Statistics on Affordability will be on tomorrow (thrs 3rd May) morning. Today is open for final comments on the Day 1, 2, 3 & 4 Themes.
walu.
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participants (6)
-
Alex Gakuru -
Bill Kagai -
Eric Osiakwan -
John Walubengo -
Kai Wulff -
mucheru＠wananchi.com