Thanks Kevit. Actually my appearance and that of other new stakeholders at the last MSF was due to the reforms that have been forced into KEPSA ICT Board under the resitance of KIF. I was not even aware of earlier MSFs. It's like they were arranged secretly on the part of the Private sector by KIF. The PS chairs the MSF but he is not part of how the private sector organizes itself to arrive there. He does his part by offering the forum. Nonetheless I will take your word that you are committed to inclusivity. Recent happenings in KEPSA ICT Board including abandonment of election of vice-chairs/villification of those facilitating the inclusivity agenda had not indicated that. Waudo On Wed, 9 Jul 2008 20:54:40 +0300, "kevit desai" <kevit@centurionsystemsltd.com> said:
Waudo, MSF's up to date have always attracted many associations. All of them being vibrant. GOVT associations are present and DR Ndemo personally chairs them. The system provides equal representation. I assure you i will make them better and also look into the important details, like letterheads. I was delighted to have your presence at the last MSF. You made important contributions. We have to keep collaborating, after all you are a vetran of ICT's. The ICT agenda is far too large for one organization to handle. All the associations in the country are important. Yes certainly keep being hope full, we all need to improve. I wish you had informed me of all your inhibitions directly. If you need further reassurance please come and see me.
Brian was one of the first participants of the MSF's. Back then we were all new to the system that was passed on to us by the founding member off KEPSA, Mike Eldon. We all wanted to make a big difference. The tradition of selfless voluntarism by all members still continues. It's a hallmark of the ICT MSF.
Kevit Desai KEPSA Director
-----Original Message----- From: kictanet-bounces+kevit=centurionsystemsltd.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke [mailto:kictanet-bounces+kevit=centurionsystemsltd.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke] On Behalf Of waudo siganga Sent: 09 July 2008 18:40 To: kevit@centurionsystemsltd.com Cc: kictanet-lists Subject: Re: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for e-Commerce in Kenya
Hi Brian - I do not think that the issue is an interest in the internal operations of KIF. We are talking governance in the context of KEPSA/KIF relationship, something also of interest to the consumer community. For your information last year all stakeholders held a meeting in KEPSA and decided to open membership to all interested Private Sector associations. This was after it was observed that the hitherto stranglehold on KEPSA by KIF meant that the sector was not adequately represented. Some people may have felt unhappy or even insecure with this development. The problem is that my friend Kevit, being the KEPSA ICT director uses his position to constantly market KIF as if it is a favoured player in KEPSA (e.g. "I would like to confirm that the KEPSA/KIF relationship is vibrant." - as if implying the other associations are dead) He is often busy promoting "KIF Positions" instead of "KEPSA Positions" including using KIF letterheads at the MSFs. I have misgivings about the current ICT leadership in KEPSA but I am hopeful things will change.
Waudo
On Wed, 9 Jul 2008 16:54:41 +0300, "Brian Munyao Longwe" <blongwe@gmail.com> said:
Hi Alex,
I would find it hard to imagine how much more Kevit can explain to you about KIF.
I would like to suggest that Kevit extend an invitation to you (and anyone else who might be interested/concerned) to attend the next KIF meeting as an observer and see/feel the animal yourself.
Brian
Sent from my iPhone
On 09 Jul 2008, at 3:45 PM, Alex Gakuru <alex.gakuru@yahoo.com> wrote:
Kevit:
I am afraid you have not clarified well enough. I shall not ask you further KEPSA questions although on your previous email you told Waundo "As the director of KEPSA I welcome CSK and any other association to full membership of KEPSA." Apparently this now appears to have changed. And I doubt Waundo complained of "exclusion" not of his private self, rather of CSK? I could be wrong but he could clarify.
On Jun 23, 2008 it was announced that a "Local Software Industry Association established" with, among others, "3.1 Objective, Market the local software industry to venture capitalists." (see announcement document attached) Was it registered under Societies Act ( Read Public interest) or as Private (non-or-for-profit) Company? I found it strange it was formed 3 days to aour very successful and OPEN BarCamp. Is this one also under your umbrella?
On the links you sent onlist:
www.innovation-africa.net
Domain Name: INNOVATION-AFRICA.NET Registrar: TUCOWS INC. Whois Server: whois.tucows.com Referral URL: http://domainhelp.opensrs.net Name Server: ULTRA103.UK2.NET Name Server: ULTRA104.UK2.NET Status: redemptionPeriod Updated Date: 24-jun-2008 Creation Date: 14-may-2007 Expiration Date: 14-may-2008
I tried www.innovation-africa.co.ke >> was re-directing to >> www.kif.or.ke ( but today it now says "under construction") I gather Centurion Systems offices accommodates KIF, is that correct?
What I am trying is to understand is who speaks in the background when when "KIF" issues "stakeholders" statements on an issue,how representative or public service-oriented, good governance, in trying to understand new and old associations' motives.
With above information, it would clear doubts of public policy participation illegitimacy or inappropriate public procurement involvement(s). For the sake of our growing transparent ICTs abundantly rewarding enterprising citizens.
Alex
--- On Wed, 7/9/08, kevit desai <kevit@centurionsystemsltd.com> wrote:
From: kevit desai <kevit@centurionsystemsltd.com> Subject: RE: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for e-Commerce in Kenya To: alex.gakuru@yahoo.com Cc: "'kictanet-lists'" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Date: Wednesday, July 9, 2008, 2:50 AM Hi Alex,
I'm pleased to clarify as much as I can.
Kepsa has an open membership of PRIVATE sector industry and market segment associations in almost all economic sectors. Independence: KEPSA decisions are dependent on members wishes, and members are drawn from the private sector. In fact, NGO's are not approached for membership in KEPSA, neither are government bodies including parastatals. KIF follows the same approach for membership and decision-making. No NGO's and government agencies are member ofn KIF. However, KEPSA and KIF consult on a REGULAR BASIS with all those stakeholders. Having said that, KEPSA and KIF have no obligation to offer service to non members.
Hopefully this helps to clarify. Do get in touch with Sam Mwaura of KEPSA or Marcel Werner of KIF.
Kevit
-----Original Message----- From: Alex Gakuru [mailto:alex.gakuru@yahoo.com] Sent: 09 July 2008 04:45 To: kevit desai Cc: kictanet-lists Subject: Re: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for e-Commerce in Kenya
Kevit,
How does KEPSA and KIF governance relate ensuring decisions independence? The political issue here may be monopolization to the extent of clouding out other actors thereby generating conflict. The Motive Theory steps in.
We investigate the effects of competition on subjects' attitude towards cooperation. Three groups face three economic environments with different degrees of competition, from a benchmark case with no competition at all up to a perfect competition case. Subjects contribute generously to a public project in the absence of competition, whereas they contribute very little in the presence of a maximum degree of competition. A diminishing attitude towards cooperation clearly emerges as the degree of competition increases. Therefore, if cooperation does enhance well-being, the maximum degree of competition may be not efficient.
<http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/B6W5H-4N0GDV1-1/2/fb32f4c6e9ba
6a6f51d7da9d40d806eb>
react.
--- On Tue, 7/8/08, kevit desai <kevit@centurionsystemsltd.com> wrote:
From: kevit desai <kevit@centurionsystemsltd.com> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for e-Commerce in Kenya To: alex.gakuru@yahoo.com Cc: secretariat@kif.or.ke, "'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions'" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke> Date: Tuesday, July 8, 2008, 1:14 PM Hi Waudo,
As the director of KEPSA I welcome CSK and any other association to full membership of KEPSA. We look forward to a meaningful partnership.
Kevit Desai
_____
From: waudo siganga [mailto:emailsignet@mailcan.com] Sent: 08 July 2008 13:55 To: Kevit Desai Cc: secretariat@kif.or.ke; 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' Subject: Re: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for e-Commerce in Kenya
Hello Kevit - I think one needs to be careful when handling KEPSA and KIF at the same time. Do not use your foothold in KEPSA to promote KIF at the expense of other associations. The explanation is very simple: KEPSA was formed as a focal point, a bringing together characterised by INCLUSIVITY. KIF on the other hand is an independent association and the nature of such an association is EXCLUSIVITY (through membership mechanism). I would like to see the promotion of more associations on the KEPSA ICT Board, not just KIF. Please give us space.
Waudo
On Tue, 8 Jul 2008 11:07:07 +0300, "Kevit Desai" <kevit@centurionsystemsltd.com> said:
Hi Alex,
KEPSA (info@kepsa.or.ke): private sector policy body with its own governance structure. Elected as a director in private capacity and as KIF vice chairman.
KIF (secretariat@kif.or.ke): membership-based industry association, member of KEPSA's ICT section. Elected as vice-chairman.
Centurion Systems Ltd: (www.centurionsystemsltd.com) private company, director, member of KIF.
Director of Engineering - Centurion Systems Ltd
Chairperson IEEE - Kenya Section
Chairperson - Engineering Students Exhibition
Governor - KEPSA
Director - KEPSA
Director - Innovation Africa
Director- Kenya ICT Board
Vice Chairman - Kenya ICT Federation
BOA - AIESEC
Member - National Strategy for University Education
Co-ordinator - Growing Sustainable Business(GSB)-UNDP Kenya
General Co-Chair - Africon 2009
2nd Fl, New Rehema Hse,
Raphta Rd
, Westlands -Nairobi
P.O. BOX 66031 - 00800 Nrb.
Tel:+254 20 4440102/3 Fax: +254 20 4440104 CDMA: 020 2049750
Mobile: +254 722 517067
http://www.centurionsystemsltd.com
http://www.engineeringexhibition.co.ke
http://www.innovation-africa.net
htpp://www.ict.go.ke
http://www.undp.org/business/gsb
-----Original Message----- From: waudo siganga [mailto:emailsignet@mailcan.com] Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 9:40 PM To: kevit desai Cc: secretariat@kif.or.ke; 'KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions' Subject: RE: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for e-Commerce in Kenya
Hello Kevit - Since you sent this message to KICTANET I can answer it on
the same forum. I think the picture being painted about a rosy situation
including "collaboration" is simply not true. The reason to be frank is
that there a few in your KIF who do not want any other association to
have a voice in KEPSA or to interact with Government. Could you as a
KEPSA director ensure that all interested associations including the
major ones not in KIF are allowed room to contribute in KEPSA? It can be
sad if you mis-use your position in KEPSA only to promote KIF and crack
down on those you feel are in the way.
Waudo
On Mon, 7 Jul 2008 21:02:31 +0300, "kevit desai"
<kevit@centurionsystemsltd.com> said:
Hi Walu,
Associations are welcome to be members of KEPSA. I would like to confirm
that the KEPSA/KIF relationship is vibrant. We would like to do a lot
more
and welcome more support.
We appreciate Waudo's contributions at our last ministerial stakeholder
forum.
Collaboration is the way forward.
Kevit Desai
KEPSA Director
-----Original Message-----
From:
kictanet-bounces+kevit=centurionsystemsltd.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
[mailto:kictanet-bounces+kevit=centurionsystemsltd.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke
]
On Behalf Of waudo siganga
Sent: 07 July 2008 19:02
To: kevit@centurionsystemsltd.com
Cc: secretariat@kif.or.ke; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions
Subject: Re: [kictanet] Legislation and
e-Commerce in
Kenya
Hi Walu - I am catching you loud and clear on GPRS somewhere in the
bush. I did bring out the issue of regulating the IT (or ICT) Profession
on this list a few months ago. But the rather unenthusiastic response I
got gave me the sense that possibly this was not
correct list since
many of the subscribers appear just interested in ICT Policy rather than
being actual IT Experts. Within the next two weeks there will be another
list for professionals and you will be informed (you have the
qualifications, don't you??). We are pushing for a registration board
like thise done last yeaer for nutritionists and Procurement
Practitioners. There is a lot of work going on unheralded. All we need
is a champion or chanpions in the right place.
Waudo
On Mon, 7 Jul 2008 02:45:53 -0700 (PDT), "John Walubengo"
<jwalu@yahoo.com> said:
> Marcel,
>
> It looks like quite some work has been ongoing in this
> area...unfortunately it seems as if it was restricted within KIF only? I
> wonder if Computer Society of Kenya (CSK, Waudo r u there?) or
> Information Security Audit & Control (ISACA-Kenya Chapter) just to
> mention some of the big IT Associations in Kenya were involved. I beg to
> be enlightened.
>
> This brings in an old question - who really represents the IT Profession
> in Kenya? Shem has been on record as saying
IT is the only
> discipline where we seem to lack bodies with
same authority as LSK
> (Law Society of Kenya), IEK (Institute of Engineers of Kenya), Medical
> Practictioners Board amongst others to regulate the IT Profession.
>
> And by the way, KICTAnet does not fit the bill either (and has a
> different objective anyway). But time has come to really start thinking
> of regulating the IT profession, even as we struggle to regulate the
> industry...Ideally, CSK should take the lead on this, but they have been
> awfully quite except when they award prizes at the end of the year (Waudo
> I know u will kill me offline but I just had to say it!).
>
> KEPSA? very reputable and effective
in the Manufacturing
> sector but on IT? am not sure they have been as effective - particularly
> because the link between KEPSA/KIF and the IT industry has been 'cloudy'
> for lack of a better word...Can for example CSK or ISACA be part of
> KEPSA without being part of KIF? I again need to be enlightened.
>
> O.K. I agree I did digress, but just
loudly and saying that as
> we think of regulating electronic
Regulation for the that the particularly thinking transactions,
we also need to
> simultaneously start regulating the IT profession..but maybe I am wrong.
> Particularly because regulation can and often leads to suppression...
>
> walu.
> --- On Sun, 7/6/08, Marcel Werner <marcelcwerner@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> From: Marcel Werner <marcelcwerner@gmail.com>
>> Subject: [kictanet] Legislation and Regulation for e-Commerce in Kenya
>> To: jwalu@yahoo.com
>> Cc: secretariat@kif.or.ke, "KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions"
<kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>
>> Date: Sunday, July 6, 2008, 6:43 PM
>> Legislation and Regulation for e-Commerce in Kenya
>>
>> Kenya ICT Federation (KIF) - Briefing Note # 3 - Report -
>> Public Panel 19
>> June 2008
>>
>> *Electronic commerce (e-commerce) will add at least one
>> percent point growth
>> to Kenya's overall economic growth within five years.
>> This is contingent
>> upon the adoption of legislation that supports electronic
>> transactions. *Kenya,
>> as an emerging economy and regional leader, lags behind in
>> having a legal
>> framework for e-commerce in place. The current situation is
>> an anachronism
>> hampering national development, placing provincial centres
>> at a
>> disadvantage, and harming global competitiveness. Both
>> external and internal
>> trade require the new framework.The Kenyan private sector
>> strongly supports
>> e-commerce legislation, as well as legislation of the
>> Information and
>> Communication Technology sector that guarantees an open
>> market and promotes
>> innovation.
>>
>> Why e-commerce law? Today, legislation supporting
>> electronic transactions
>> represents the single most powerful innovation opportunity
>> in the legal
>> framework of the ICT sector. Legislation is needed to:
>> -Legalize e-commerce transactions by recognizing an
>> electronic signature
>> -Manage and control e-commerce r <KENYA SOFTWARE INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION.doc>
kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: blongwe@gmail.com Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/blongwe%40gmail.com
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: emailsignet@mailcan.com Unsubscribe or change your options at
http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/emailsignet%40mailcan.c om People make a plan work, a plan alone seldom makes people work (Confucius).
_______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet
This message was sent to: kevit@centurionsystemsltd.com Unsubscribe or change your options at http://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/kevit%40centurionsystem sltd.com
People make a plan work, a plan alone seldom makes people work (Confucius).