Oh I agree those may condemn homosexuality - but kenya is not limited to abrahamic religions and the constitution affords them no special privilege. I also point out that we cannot discount the religions of approximately 2.1 billion people on the planet that do not follow the abrahamic religions and choose other forms of faith - including Kenyans (and that’s not history - it’s current day reality) Andrew ________________________________ From: Twahir Hussein Kassim <twahir@hussein.me.ke> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2018 7:55:45 PM To: Andrew Alston Cc: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Banning of the FILM Rafiki Andrew, Thanks for the history class. By religion I meant the Abrahamic religions; namely Judaism, Christianity and Islam. I am yet to see any text from the above mentioned condoning homosexuality. Twahir On Apr 30, 2018 16:17, "Andrew Alston" <Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com<mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com>> wrote: Actually – there are many religions that have no issue with homosexuality. Buddhism makes no distinction between hetrosexual or homosexual relations The wiccan religion has a text that says “all acts of love and pleasure are my rituals” Hinduism makes no distinction (and in 2009 the Hindu Council UK explicity stated this) The Vedas religious texts even go so far as to refer to people in a third gender that is neither male nor female. In Sikhism marriage is seen as a union of souls, and the soul is seen as genderless. The list goes on and on and on – so sorry – your stance that no religion supports LGBT relationships as ok – is factually incorrect. Andrew From: kictanet [mailto:kictanet-bounces+andrew.alston<mailto:kictanet-bounces%2Bandrew.alston>=liquidtelecom.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:liquidtelecom.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke>] On Behalf Of Twahir Hussein Kassim via kictanet Sent: 30 April 2018 15:55 To: Andrew Alston <Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com<mailto:Andrew.Alston@liquidtelecom.com>> Cc: Twahir Hussein Kassim <twahir@hussein.me.ke<mailto:twahir@hussein.me.ke>> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Banning of the FILM Rafiki Reading from the preamble to the constitution, I would like to give my thoughts below within the text of the constitution copied from a previous email CONSTITUTION OF KENYA PREAMBLE ACKNOWLEDGING the supremacy of the Almighty God of all creation: My belief is that this is a declaration within the constitution that the supremacy of The Almighty is ABOVE ALL. I doubt if there is any religion that accepts LGBT relationships to be fine. Going back to the scripts we will NOTE a whole nation being destroyed due to this very act. Whether Kenya has a state religion or not GAY relations shouldn't be ok. HONOURING those who heroically struggled to bring freedom and justice to our land: PROUD of our ethnic, cultural and religious diversity, and determined to live in peace and unity as one indivisible sovereign nation: Proud of ethnic diversity, none of our diverse culture agree with this act. Am not refuting that it has been practised for donkey years; however NEVER has it been FORCED DOWN our throats to accept it as a norm. We did interact with gays before but they were not openly blatantly plying their trade. This only started when the west started pushing. There is a LINE we as a people MUST DRAW! Come on guys! RESPECTFUL of the environment, which is our heritage, and determined to sustain it for the benefit of future generations: COMMITTED to nurturing and protecting the well-being of the individual, the family, communities and the nation: RECOGNISING the aspirations of all Kenyans for a government based on the essential values of human rights, equality, freedom, democracy, social justice and the rule of law: If we play the HUMAN RIGHT card, then why arrest a consenting adult who chooses to commit suicide? Isn't it his right to live? Freedom comes with responsibility and most of all we OWE it to the generations to come to maintain a MORAL FABRIC that reflects us as a people! LGBT doesn't stand the test of morality if it goes against the very supreme being that we claim to acknowledge! EXERCISING our sovereign and inalienable right to determine the form of governance of our country and having participated fully in the making of this Constitution: ADOPT, ENACT and give this Constitution to ourselves and to our future generations. GOD BLESS KENYA These are my opinions, I don't mean to disrespect anyone. Twahir On Apr 30, 2018 15:26, "Lawrence Dinga, CISSP via kictanet" <kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>> wrote: @Alex I am open to any introduction and as I said the issue of morality is subjective and conscience based. You may see gay relationship as okay and right from your perspective. However, to another person, it may be immoral depending on one's beliefs. The board has also given the reasons behind the ban. Regards -----Original Message----- From: Alex Comninos Sent: Monday, April 30, 2018 3:09 PM To: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Cc: ldinga@managecom.co.ke<mailto:ldinga@managecom.co.ke> Subject: Re: [kictanet] Banning of the FILM Rafiki @Lawrence Why is love between two consenting non-abusive people a morality issue? Please explain? There are many issues of morality in relationships, but what does the sexual orientation of the partners have to do with anything? So basically you are saying being gay is immoral, it would be nice if you could back that up without resorting to the first testament. Once again, I am more than willing to introduce you to my LGBT friends and their morality. If you would like to be introduced and learn something, contact me. Kindly, Alex On Mon, 30 Apr 2018 at 14:05, Lawrence Dinga, CISSP via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>> wrote:
Religion a side I think this is an issue of morality but I agree, morality can be subjective and depends on one’s conscience.
Regards
From: Mwendwa Kivuva via kictanet Sent: Monday, April 30, 2018 2:50 PM To: ldinga@managecom.co.ke<mailto:ldinga@managecom.co.ke> Cc: Mwendwa Kivuva Subject: Re: [kictanet] Banning of the FILM Rafiki
KFCB always makes roadside pronouncements that would not pass any legal threshold.
And quoting the Bible here is imposing your religion on others who believe in different deities.
Ebele, No, there is no State religion in Kenya, and our constitution recognises freedom of worship.
Article 32 of Kenyan Constitution:
32. FREEDOM OF CONSCIENCE, RELIGION, BELIEF AND OPINION
(1) Every person has the right to freedom of conscience, religion, thought, belief and opinion.
(2) Every person has the right, either individually or in community with others, in public or in private, to manifest any religion or belief through worship, practice, teaching or observance, including observance of a day of worship.
(3) A person may not be denied access to any institution, employment or facility, or the enjoyment of any right, because of the person's belief or religion.
(4) A person shall not be compelled to act, or engage in any act, that is contrary to the person's belief or religion.
On Mon, Apr 30, 2018, 2:36 PM Ebele Okobi via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>> wrote:
Does Kenya have a state religion?
On 4/30/18, 12:33 PM, "kictanet on behalf of Lawrence Dinga, CISSP via kictanet" <kictanet-bounces+ebeleokobi=fb.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:fb.com@lists.kictanet.or.ke> on behalf of kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>> wrote:
Dear Alex,
I don’t know much about the movie but if it is about lesbianism then
it is
immoral and ungodly. God only approves a relation between a man and a woman
Leviticus 18:22 You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination.
Genesis 2:24 Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast
to his
wife, and they shall become one flesh.
Regards
-----Original Message----- From: Alex Comninos via kictanet Sent: Monday, April 30, 2018 2:05 PM To: ldinga@managecom.co.ke<mailto:ldinga@managecom.co.ke> Cc: Alex Comninos ; KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions Subject: Re: [kictanet] Banning of the FILM Rafiki
I am not sure what the film is about in its entirety, but the main storyline is a lesbian romance in Nairobi. It is the first Kenyan
film to
be nominated for the Cannes film festival and will premiere there on
the
8th of May.
Here is the trailer for the film
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7M_-ucSaFpU<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7M_-ucSaFpU>
On Mon, 30 Apr 2018 at 12:57, Dorcas Muthoni <dmuthoni@gmail.com<mailto:dmuthoni@gmail.com>>
wrote:
> What is the film about?
> On Mon, Apr 30, 2018, 1:55 PM Alex Comninos via kictanet < kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke<mailto:kictanet@lists.kictanet.or.ke>> wrote:
>> Hi
>> I was shocked to learn that the film classification board has
banned an
>> LGBT film, Rafiki.
>> Our Film and Publication Board recently attempted this but it was reversed >> by the courts.
>> Films are ICTs and we should be discussing this on the list.
>> I am looking forward to the discussion.
>> Kind regards, >> Alex
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