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Re: [kictanet] Net neutrality 'first world' problem?
by mutua.ezekiel 27 Feb '16

27 Feb '16

I love this analogy too, Kivuva. INTELECTUAL Kwashiorkor! Ezekiel Mutua, MBS Chief Executive Officer Kenya Film Classification Board NAIROBI Email : mutua.ezekiel(a)yahoo.com / emutua(a)kfcb.co.ke Ali Hussein via kictanet <kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:Good analogy Kivuva. Ali Hussein Tel: +254 713 601113 On Feb 27, 2016 11:59 AM, "Mwendwa Kivuva" <lordmwesh(a)gmail.com> wrote: Let us debate on the notion of "bread" 🍞 alone. We all know lack of a balanced diet … [View More]brings kwashiorkor. And it brings stunted growth too. Forget zika virus, normal children in Africa get smaller brains because of the stunted growth. Take that analogy and compare it to the malnutritioned internet being paraded around. Out children too will develop intellectual Kwashiorkor On Feb 27, 2016 10:17 AM, "Ali Hussein via kictanet" <kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Ebele It has to do with the issue of Third Party Liability. Ali Hussein Tel: +254 713 601113 On Feb 27, 2016 10:01 AM, "Ebele Okobi" <ebeleokobi(a)fb.com> wrote: I'm curious-what does the KFCB demand that Google censor content have to do with net neutrality? Ebele Okobi | Head of Public Policy, Africa m. +44 (0) 771 156 1315 10 Brock Street | London | NW1 3FG ebeleokobi(a)fb.com On Feb 27, 2016, at 5:32 AM, Ali Hussein via kictanet <kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: Nanjira The CS is definitely entitled to his opinion. Like all of us. My concern is of course that his opinion can be construed to be Government Policy. And Net Neutrality cannot be distilled in such a simplistic way. I think it's high time this country and the rest of Africa have a deep conversation about what Net Neutrality means for us. Take for example the issue of KFCB the other day when the CEO announced that they have asked Google to take down the 'offending' video of same sex marriage/love endorsement. I was astounded that the whole discussion degenerated to the issue of homosexuality!! My questions and concerns were quite clear and they alluded to our total lack of policy regarding Net Neutrality. And address in an ICT Forum. KFCB used the right tools to ask for the video take down. The same tools have been used by other governments. With all due respect to the CS but I think he needs to be careful not to simplify this important matter. Let's discuss it fully and come up with our own Net Neutrality version. This definitely doesn't include abdicating our responsibilities as a country to global internet companies. This will be a recipe for disaster. Ali Hussein Principal Hussein & Associates +254 0713 601113 / 0770906375 Twitter: @AliHKassim Skype: abu-jomo LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim "Discovery consists in seeing what everyone else has seen and thinking what no one else has thought". ~ Albert Szent-Györgyi Sent from my iPad On 27 Feb 2016, at 8:08 AM, Nanjira Sambuli via kictanet <kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: This is at least the second piece citing the CS' point of view. It might be in order to write a letter to him explaining why it is not a first world problem. Regards, Nanjira. Sent from my iPhone. On 27 Feb 2016, at 07:44, kictanet-request(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke wrote: Net neutrality 'first world' problem? (Ali Hussein) _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/info%40alyhussein.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__lists.kictanet.or.ke_m… Unsubscribe or change your options at https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__lists.kictanet.or.ke_m… The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/kivuva%40transworldaf… The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. [View Less]

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Net neutrality 'first world' problem?
by Nanjira Sambuli 27 Feb '16

27 Feb '16

This is at least the second piece citing the CS' point of view. It might be in order to write a letter to him explaining why it is not a first world problem. Regards, Nanjira. Sent from my iPhone. > On 27 Feb 2016, at 07:44, kictanet-request(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke wrote: > > Net neutrality 'first world' problem? (Ali Hussein)

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Re: [kictanet] kictanet Digest, Vol 105, Issue 103
by Nanjira Sambuli 27 Feb '16

27 Feb '16

Paul, your statement seems to frame the pro-Net Neutrality advocacy as an "externally well funded" thing. Why is that? Regards, Nanjira. Sent from my iPhone. > On 27 Feb 2016, at 10:08, kictanet-request(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke wrote: > > Send kictanet mailing list submissions to > kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet > or, via email, send a … [View More]message with subject or body 'help' to > kictanet-request(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke > > You can reach the person managing the list at > kictanet-owner(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of kictanet digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Net neutrality 'first world' problem? (Mwendwa Kivuva) > 2. Re: Net neutrality 'first world' problem? (Paul Roy) > 3. Re: Net neutrality 'first world' problem? (Ebele Okobi) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2016 09:57:28 +0300 > From: Mwendwa Kivuva <Kivuva(a)transworldafrica.com> > To: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> > Subject: Re: [kictanet] Net neutrality 'first world' problem? > Message-ID: > <CAEhPqwqNYPVfqOAVrdaiV_XoC1mwsLthCVaUvW_=U-ysGaKnAg(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > Dr. Waudo, > > "I attack ideas, I don't attack people - and some very good people > have some very bad ideas" - Antonin Scalia > > > Allowing people to break the Internet is the slippery road. Allowing > others to break the Internet for the developing world is like saying; > "we should use second hand, we are second rate citizens, for us > anything goes. We can take anything. Hell we are poor, we are beggars. > Please give us crumbs". > > When will developing countries start asserting themselves? You know > what, countries that believe in the best for themselves in the end > becomes outliers. These are the little differences that after a long > while separates the masters from the slaves. > > Imagine two digital natives, one born in North America with access to > the Internet, and the second born in Africa with access to just a few > services of the Internet. After 20 years, they meet in the corporate > scenes. How will they compete? This was illustrated very clearly > thousands of years ago by Plato in the "Allegory of the cave". > > The narrative should be " We deserve the best, we are rich both in > spirit and ideologies, we will go for the best, we deserve the best". > After that we find solutions to getting what we deserve. Let us not > settle for less. Remember, as Voltaire said, no problem can withstand > the assault of sustained thinking > > The argument that a little few websites are better than non is a non > starter. > > > Sincerely > >> On 27/02/2016, Ali Hussein via kictanet <kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: >> Liz >> >> Thanks for sharing. Unfortunately I think that notion is too simplistic. Net >> Neutrality is not only a first world problem. And comparing it with bread >> and other foods is basically missing the point. >> >> Let's address it from an infrastructure point of view. Firstly the Internet >> is now so critical that this Balkanization that is happening is >> discriminatory. The likes of the Internet Giants who dole out a walled >> garden form of Internet access have zero motive for the good of the African >> people - they are after eyeballs. Plain and simple. Eyeballs mean money. >> >> Secondly, the government has a responsibility to make the Internet >> affordable, and to make access free in marginalized areas and communities. >> That's why we have the Universal Access Fund. >> >> Thirdly, to say that Net Neutrality is a first world problem is to rubbish >> all the startups that are struggling to build content in Africa. They surely >> don't have the muscle of Google or Facebook to dole out 'Free Access'. And >> if we allow this to happen they will have a snowball in hell getting their >> content read. >> >> Our CS is quoted as saying:- >> >> It?s like saying someone has no food, but if someone brings them bread we >> are not going to allow them to have the bread because they must have a >> balanced diet,? he said. ?I don?t think that works for me.? >> >> I'll compare this statement with access to roads. So if we don't have access >> to roads we should accept potholed ones? Granted we may not have a choice >> but to use the potholed ones (as is the case). However it sure doesn't make >> it right! Someone is dropping the ball and they must be made accountable. >> >> One thing I'll concede is that Net Neutrality as defined by the first world >> is just not workable here. That's why we must define Net Neutrality from an >> African perspective. >> >> A National Forum is long overdue. >> >> Ali Hussein >> Principal >> Hussein & Associates >> +254 0713 601113 / 0770906375 >> >> Twitter: @AliHKassim >> Skype: abu-jomo >> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim >> >> >> "Discovery consists in seeing what everyone else has seen and thinking what >> no one else has thought". ~ Albert Szent-Gy?rgyi >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >>> On 26 Feb 2016, at 9:43 PM, Liz Orembo via kictanet >>> <kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Interesting read. >>> >>> http://mgafrica.com/article/2016-02-24-africa-internet-access-more-importan… >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Best regards. >>> Liz. >>> >>> PGP ID: 0x1F3488BF >>> _______________________________________________ >>> kictanet mailing list >>> kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke >>> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet >>> >>> Unsubscribe or change your options at >>> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/info%40alyhussein.com >>> >>> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform >>> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and >>> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT >>> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and >>> development. >>> >>> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors >>> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, >>> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do >>> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. > > > -- > ______________________ > Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya > twitter.com/lordmwesh > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2016 10:01:11 +0300 > From: Paul Roy <roykoikai(a)gmail.com> > To: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> > Subject: Re: [kictanet] Net neutrality 'first world' problem? > Message-ID: > <CA+AXev7jnLzqGeoDg5WoM08_pCk7iQvZpP+GEKWEApO9gqH-1A(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > I think you jumped the gun here Ali. The CS's point is that we have a long > way to go in expanding internet access for now that we should not be > worried about net neutrality kind of discussions. > > This doesn't mean that lobbyist and special interest groups that are > externally well funded should not express their ideas and opinions in > public forums, but to also acknowledge the effort the government is doing. > > Back to your analogy of roads, If you have no roads you would not insist on > having a tarmac road as the only form of acceptable road. An all weathered > road will be better than no road at all. Of course you can always ask for > it's upgrade. > > On public forum discussion - i totally agree on the need to have one > soonest. > > > > On Sat, Feb 27, 2016 at 7:38 AM, Ali Hussein via kictanet < > kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: > >> Liz >> >> Thanks for sharing. Unfortunately I think that notion is too simplistic. >> Net Neutrality is not only a first world problem. And comparing it with >> bread and other foods is basically missing the point. >> >> Let's address it from an infrastructure point of view. Firstly the >> Internet is now so critical that this Balkanization that is happening is >> discriminatory. The likes of the Internet Giants who dole out a walled >> garden form of Internet access have zero motive for the good of the African >> people - they are after eyeballs. Plain and simple. Eyeballs mean money. >> >> Secondly, the government has a responsibility to make the Internet >> affordable, and to make access free in marginalized areas and communities. >> That's why we have the Universal Access Fund. >> >> Thirdly, to say that Net Neutrality is a first world problem is to rubbish >> all the startups that are struggling to build content in Africa. They >> surely don't have the muscle of Google or Facebook to dole out 'Free >> Access'. And if we allow this to happen they will have a snowball in hell >> getting their content read. >> >> Our CS is quoted as saying:- >> >> It?s like saying someone has no food, but if someone brings them bread we >> are not going to allow them to have the bread because they must have a >> balanced diet,? he said. ?I don?t think that works for me.? >> >> I'll compare this statement with access to roads. So if we don't have >> access to roads we should accept potholed ones? Granted we may not have a >> choice but to use the potholed ones (as is the case). However it sure >> doesn't make it right! Someone is dropping the ball and they must be made >> accountable. >> >> One thing I'll concede is that Net Neutrality as defined by the first >> world is just not workable here. That's why we must define Net Neutrality >> from an African perspective. >> >> A National Forum is long overdue. >> >> *Ali Hussein* >> *Principal* >> *Hussein & Associates* >> +254 0713 601113 / 0770906375 >> >> Twitter: @AliHKassim >> >> Skype: abu-jomo >> >> LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim >> >> >> "Discovery consists in seeing what everyone else has seen and thinking >> what no one else has thought". ~ Albert Szent-Gy?rgyi >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On 26 Feb 2016, at 9:43 PM, Liz Orembo via kictanet < >> kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: >> >> >> Interesting read. >> >> >> http://mgafrica.com/article/2016-02-24-africa-internet-access-more-importan… >> >> -- >> >> Best regards. >> Liz. >> >> PGP ID: 0x1F3488BF >> >> _______________________________________________ >> kictanet mailing list >> kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke >> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet >> >> Unsubscribe or change your options at >> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/info%40alyhussein.com >> >> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform >> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and >> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT >> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. >> >> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors >> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, >> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do >> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> kictanet mailing list >> kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke >> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet >> >> Unsubscribe or change your options at >> https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/roykoikai%40gmail.com >> >> The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform >> for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and >> regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT >> sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. >> >> KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors >> online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, >> share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do >> not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. > > > > -- > "Change is slow and gradual. It requires hardwork, a bit of > luck, a fair amount of self-sacrifice and a lot of patience." > > Roy. > [View Less]

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Net neutrality 'first world' problem?
by Liz Orembo 27 Feb '16

27 Feb '16

Interesting read. http://mgafrica.com/article/2016-02-24-africa-internet-access-more-importan… -- Best regards. Liz. PGP ID: 0x1F3488BF

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Re: [kictanet] Net neutrality 'first world' problem?
by mutua.ezekiel 27 Feb '16

27 Feb '16

Thank you Husein for this. You have captured the issue of the "Same sex" video very well. I think this debate goes to show the urgent need for the forum we discussed on Net Neutrality. I believe this forum is creating the necessary conversations on the issue but we now need to escalate it to a stakeholder forum and come up with a report that can inform policy change. I am so proud of kicktanet and the robust, diverse and informed ideas presented here. Ezekiel Mutua, MBS Chief … [View More]Executive Officer Kenya Film Classification Board NAIROBI Email : mutua.ezekiel(a)yahoo.com / emutua(a)kfcb.co.ke Ali Hussein via kictanet <kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote:Nanjira The CS is definitely entitled to his opinion. Like all of us. My concern is of course that his opinion can be construed to be Government Policy. And Net Neutrality cannot be distilled in such a simplistic way. I think it's high time this country and the rest of Africa have a deep conversation about what Net Neutrality means for us. Take for example the issue of KFCB the other day when the CEO announced that they have asked Google to take down the 'offending' video of same sex marriage/love endorsement. I was astounded that the whole discussion degenerated to the issue of homosexuality!! My questions and concerns were quite clear and they alluded to our total lack of policy regarding Net Neutrality. And address in an ICT Forum. KFCB used the right tools to ask for the video take down. The same tools have been used by other governments. With all due respect to the CS but I think he needs to be careful not to simplify this important matter. Let's discuss it fully and come up with our own Net Neutrality version. This definitely doesn't include abdicating our responsibilities as a country to global internet companies. This will be a recipe for disaster. Ali Hussein Principal Hussein & Associates +254 0713 601113 / 0770906375 Twitter: @AliHKassim Skype: abu-jomo LinkedIn: http://ke.linkedin.com/in/alihkassim "Discovery consists in seeing what everyone else has seen and thinking what no one else has thought". ~ Albert Szent-Györgyi Sent from my iPad On 27 Feb 2016, at 8:08 AM, Nanjira Sambuli via kictanet <kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke> wrote: This is at least the second piece citing the CS' point of view. It might be in order to write a letter to him explaining why it is not a first world problem. Regards, Nanjira. Sent from my iPhone. On 27 Feb 2016, at 07:44, kictanet-request(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke wrote: Net neutrality 'first world' problem? (Ali Hussein) _______________________________________________ kictanet mailing list kictanet(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/listinfo/kictanet Unsubscribe or change your options at https://lists.kictanet.or.ke/mailman/options/kictanet/info%40alyhussein.com The Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTANet) is a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation. The network aims to act as a catalyst for reform in the ICT sector in support of the national aim of ICT enabled growth and development. KICTANetiquette : Adhere to the same standards of acceptable behaviors online that you follow in real life: respect people's times and bandwidth, share knowledge, don't flame or abuse or personalize, respect privacy, do not spam, do not market your wares or qualifications. [View Less]

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Re: [kictanet] Of Data Security, Terrorism, National Security, and Marketing
by Mark Kipyegon 26 Feb '16

26 Feb '16

It is important to remember that Apple have indeed provided assistance in this particular case. The point of contention is that the security and privacy of every legitimate Apple user would be compromised if they were to comply with the court order. On 26/02/2016 20:50, kictanet-request(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke wrote: > Message: 3 > Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2016 12:38:14 -0500 > From: Lawrence Njogu <lnjogu(a)hotmail.com> > To: KICTAnet ICT Policy Discussions <kictanet(a)lists.… [View More]

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Re: [kictanet] Of Data Security, Terrorism, National Security and Marketing
by Mark Kipyegon 26 Feb '16

26 Feb '16

It might be worth noting that recent history shows law enforcement agencies abuse their power to access such controlled information. Edward Snowden (@Snowden) Tweeted at 7:50 a.m. - 17 Feb 2016 : The @FBI is creating a world where citizens rely on #Apple to defend their rights, rather than the other way around. (https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/699984388067557376?s=17) -- keybase.io/kipyegonmark On 21 Feb 2016, at 21:33, kictanet-request(a)lists.kictanet.or.ke wrote: > > … [View More]

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Digital Spaces and Civil Society: Harnessing the power of the internet to build communities, foster trust, create transparency and drive fundraising success. #NGOdigitalspaces
by Alice Munyua 25 Feb '16

25 Feb '16

Dear all, This event might be of interest https://www.eventbrite.com/e/ngodigitalspaces-digital-spaces-and-civil-soci… Best regards Alice

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Films board gives Google a week to take down gay song video - Corporate News
by Ali Hussein 25 Feb '16

25 Feb '16

Listers This may be of interest. http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Corporate-News/Films-board-gives-Google-… <http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Corporate-News/Films-board-gives-Google-…> index.html <http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Corporate-News/Films-board-gives-Google-…> It has become increasingly important for we as a nation to define our parameters when it comes to content. 1. Should we allow content online that we wouldn't even think about showing in our sitting rooms … [View More]

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The role of KFCB
by Josh Kinoti 25 Feb '16

25 Feb '16

Hi Listers, It appears that KFCB is struggling to remain relevant in an ever changing environment. Has the Board considered getting into partnerships that will advance the cause for a 'family friendly Internet'? That would include but not limited to use of filters, proactive training on the use of Internet at home. While at it, they could commission the development of a Kenyan Internet filtering tool. IMO, the Board can still advance the cause the believe in using available technologies. Josh

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